Is Chaturbate in a State of Decline?

[Mila_]

While I have never seen you broadcast, I cannot help but think you are probably also a relationship model rather than someone just performing to new users every time you turn on the cam. You also figured out affiliate marketing - which most models never do - and you drive your own traffic and revenue from Twitter. It always strikes me how many of the Eastern European models never figure out how important relationships and repeat customers are to business. They simply show up to work and get a new batch of customers every day, more or less. So they run very fragile operations and they more or less immediately feel changes in a site's traffic and viewer dynamics.

Several of the models I follow reacted to the CB trend they saw by opening parallel accounts at Camsoda. A quick search through Google trends suggests that CB gets more than seven times as much traffic as Camsoda. Yet those models quickly got the same or better revenue on Camsoda. This might reflect that Camsoda has a smaller number of models, so the model-per-viewer metric might not be so different between the two sites.

Sorting out all these variables is tricky.

You have never watched me yet you draw all these conclusions from what? My hair color in my avatar? 90% of my income is new tippers. My regulars are incredible but no room survives on CB on regulars. That’s MFC. On CB either you figure out how to engage new users every time you are online or your earnings suck. I also don’t use social media.

The reason I brought up affiliate earnings is that when you want to know if there is a slow time on the site it’s more reliable to look at how much your affiliate program is making as those are users whi spend on the site as a whole as opposed to your room. So it’s a better control sample than your own room where maybe you got a haircut they didn’t like or your Saturn is retrograde and they aren’t spending ON YOU.

This said.. the fact that those 2 factors haven’t changed doesn’t mean the game is the same every month. Models from page 2, 3, 4 etc could be struggling more and it’s just the models at the top getting the revenue. When this happens you either change your game and figure it out or sink and move shop to Camsoda. The reason they do better there is not that they have more paying traffic, but the fact that there is less models so much less competition. The bar is much lower so in order to stand out you don’t need to do as much.

 

[Smores]

The reason I brought up affiliate earnings is that when you want to know if there is a slow time on the site it’s more reliable to look at how much your affiliate program is making as those are users whi spend on the site as a whole as opposed to your room. So it’s a better control sample than your own room where maybe you got a haircut they didn’t like or your Saturn is retrograde and they aren’t spending ON YOU.

Great point, and that would be a pretty strong reason to want affiliate revenue: just to have a better rounded sample of spending behavior on CB.

 

[dark_mermaid]

It always strikes me how many of the Eastern European models never figure out how important relationships and repeat customers are to business.

Off topic here but i'm curious, do you EVER visit any other girls than Eastern European studio models?

 

[Mila_]

Off topic here but i'm curious, do you EVER visit any other girls than Eastern European studio models?

Whatfor? He wants easy prey for his power trip games and nobody is as helpless.

 

[dashaM]

not decline but lot's of new young and strong model
since 1 month i make 60/70% of usually

 

[Smores]

Off topic here but i'm curious, do you EVER visit any other girls than Eastern European studio models?

I try to visit US models all the time, but when there are 400+ people there who all speak the same language as the model what is the actual point of it? It seems impossible to get to know the model as well as I want to. I am also typically using these systems very late at night, when Europe is awake and US is asleep.

 

[Smores]

Whatfor? He wants easy prey for his power trip games and nobody is as helpless.

Out of hundreds of models I have interacted with, I have tried to help a handful. And the handful I helped were anything but helpless. They were usually some of the strongest personalities and smartest people. They were always people who I thought had huge talent but no sense of how to organize and market it. I have no interest in helping "helpless" people, because those people have no chance to succeed, and I wanted the experience of getting a person into at least a medium level of success. None of my interactions have made me feel - or be - powerful. All of this has been about helping me to learn about webcam modeling as a business by helping models who actually do the job. Once I have the knowledge I want, I doubt I will keep doing it.

It is really not nice, or fair, to keep taking cheap shots at me.

 

[DJ_Pioneer]

Out of hundreds of models I have interacted with, I have tried to help a handful. And the handful I helped were anything but helpless. They were usually some of the strongest personalities and smartest people. They were always people who I thought had huge talent but no sense of how to organize and market it. I have no interest in helping "helpless" people, because those people have no chance to succeed, and I wanted the experience of getting a person into at least a medium level of success. None of my interactions have made me feel - or be - powerful. All of this has been about helping me to learn about webcam modeling as a business by helping models who actually do the job. Once I have the knowledge I want, I doubt I will keep doing it.

It is really not nice, or fair, to keep taking cheap shots at me.

You know it seems a bit arrogant to go into someones room and teach them how to run things when you don't have any first hand knowledge of your own on how to do it. Also since you are still learning about webcamming as a business do you help them by making stuff up as you go along to see what works?

Why do you want the experience of getting a person into a medium level of success and why do you want to learn about webcam modeling as a business if you are not going to apply that knowledge in someway? I think helping people because you want to learn how their business works seems like a bit of a waste of time, you will learn how parts of their business works but you won't get to see the big picture. It is kind like walking into a store and helping them stock shelves, you will learn how to stock shelves but you won't know all the other aspects of how to run a store.

I also help models out but I get something out of it apart from feeling good because I did something nice for someone. For instance I get to practice my skills in editing which I have use of elsewhere. The whiteboards I made for people before MFC made it easy to edit whiteboards, I did those because I felt that I was the best at making them which gave me pride myself and it was pretty awesome that one time AdminLeo said "ooh cool whiteboard" in a models room.

 

[dark_mermaid]

Once I have the knowledge I want, I doubt I will keep doing it.

You will not. The next cute and helpless girl is already waiting. Mark my words. This is how the system works and do you know why it works and will not change? Because of guys like you. You (plus white knights) are the target audience.

 

[Smores]

You know it seems a bit arrogant to go into someones room and teach them how to run things when you don't have any first hand knowledge of your own on how to do it. Also since you are still learning about webcamming as a business do you help them by making stuff up as you go along to see what works?

It is arrogant to try anything you have not done before. Entrepreneurs do that all the time. Doing an activity is often the only real way to learn.

For the people I am helping, what are their options? Their studios do not help them. They - for whatever reason - do not figure it out on their own. They claim they want to improve and ask for help. We each benefit from the other's interest and we have a somewhat similar goal.

And, as some of the models have pointed out, nothing I am teaching is rocket science. Make the show interesting. Don't give up too much for free. Have an interesting menu. Market to people through channels like Twitter or a direct mailing list. Price your privates high enough that you do not disturb the continuity of your regular show. I learned those lessons here. Why not share that information with those who are open to hearing it?

Why do you want the experience of getting a person into a medium level of success and why do you want to learn about webcam modeling as a business if you are not going to apply that knowledge in someway?

Because I am going to apply it in some way....

I think helping people because you want to learn how their business works seems like a bit of a waste of time, you will learn how parts of their business works but you won't get to see the big picture. It is kind like walking into a store and helping them stock shelves, you will learn how to stock shelves but you won't know all the other aspects of how to run a store.

I already understand how to run a business. That part of modeling isn't what I want to learn or teach.

I also help models out but I get something out of it apart from feeling good because I did something nice for someone. For instance I get to practice my skills in editing which I have use of elsewhere. The whiteboards I made for people before MFC made it easy to edit whiteboards, I did those because I felt that I was the best at making them which gave me pride myself and it was pretty awesome that one time AdminLeo said "ooh cool whiteboard" in a models room.

And why do you assume I do not get the same type of pleasure from creating something that is nice to look at and use?

 

[Smores]

You will not. The next cute and helpless girl is already waiting. Mark my words. This is how the system works and do you know why it works and will not change? Because of guys like you. You (plus white knights) are the target audience.

Nope, you are wrong on this. I'm not the one-dimensional stereotype who simply repeats a pattern endlessly. I am already stressed out by the activity, and I am really looking forward to seeing the project end.

 

[AmberCutie]

And why do you assume I do not get the same type of pleasure from creating something that is nice to look at and use?

 

[Mila_]

Remember... he "creates" them. Like God!

 

[DJ_Pioneer]

It is arrogant to try anything you have not done before. Entrepreneurs do that all the time. Doing an activity is often the only real way to learn.

For the people I am helping, what are their options? Their studios do not help them. They - for whatever reason - do not figure it out on their own. They claim they want to improve and ask for help. We each benefit from the other's interest and we have a somewhat similar goal.

And, as some of the models have pointed out, nothing I am teaching is rocket science. Make the show interesting. Don't give up too much for free. Have an interesting menu. Market to people through channels like Twitter or a direct mailing list. Price your privates high enough that you do not disturb the continuity of your regular show. I learned those lessons here. Why not share that information with those who are open to hearing it?

What are their options? They have the same options as every other model who starts out on their own, learn by doing or at least figure out how to use google. You could tell them to come here where they can get help from people who have first hand knowledge of camming and actually know what they are talking about. If they really want to improve they will come here and get the help they need.

Because I am going to apply it in some way....

How are you going to apply it then?

I already understand how to run a business. That part of modeling isn't what I want to learn or teach.

So what is it what you want to learn then? What you seem to have learned so far is as you said not rocket science and if they can't figure out that stuff on their own through simple observation they must be "helpless people".

And why do you assume I do not get the same type of pleasure from creating something that is nice to look at and use?

Because as far as I am aware you don't create anything unless you imply you are creating these models careers for them which you may very well be since you are paying for the privilege of teaching them.

 

[AmberCutie]

Remember... he "creates" them. Like God!

That is EXACTLY how I read that statement lol.

 

[Smores]

What are their options? They have the same options as every other model who starts out on their own, learn by doing or at least figure out how to use google. You could tell them to come here where they can get help from people who have first hand knowledge of camming and actually know what they are talking about. If they really want to improve they will come here and get the help they need.

I do share ACF with them. None has ever shown the slightest interest in signing up.

If people want something badly enough they find a way to make their way through it all. In the meantime, I have things I want to learn, and they have things they want people to do for them (apparently since they are a bit lazy and lost).

None of your advice is helping either them or me to accomplish short term goals.

How are you going to apply it then?

I do not really want to share a business idea.

So what is it what you want to learn then? What you seem to have learned so far is as you said not rocket science and if they can't figure out that stuff on their own through simple observation they must be "helpless people".

I want to see what works. I want to see what does not work. I want to understand the ebbs and flows of viewer traffic. I want to understand viewers real needs, as when I am the mod and I get to have private conversations with a user who just sent 3000 tokens and I get to ask pointed questions about what my model can do to improve her show in his eyes. I want to understand how significantly Twitter marketing affects traffic and bidding. I want to understand how to affect return visits by the best customers. The list goes on....

Because as far as I am aware you don't create anything unless you imply you are creating these models careers for them which you may very well be since you are paying for the privilege of teaching them.

Yes, I guess they are using me. Things that should have been done in one month take many months because of lack of motivation or work ethic on their side. And I am okay with that for a short period of time while my own knowledge grows. Long term, it sucks. I won't put up with that forever.

 

[AmberCutie]

I do not really want to share a business idea.

Man oh man, I was actually JUST about to make a post giving kudos to you for having been told repeatedly over and over, for MONTHS, how your constant need to "help" models is ridiculous and still pushing forward and not rage-quitting ACF like most would.

Then you posted this. And it all makes sense. You have a purpose of being here. We are feeding you breadcrumbs for your future business idea.

I do hope you'll tip a hat this direction one day if you do take all the knowledge and advice we've shared and make something of it for yourself.

(Most people don't... they come, they reap, they make their own, they pretend ACF didn't act as a launch pad for their endeavors. But I'm not bitter at all...)

 

[Smores]

Remember... he "creates" them. Like God!

No I don't create anyone. Marketing is not product development. The models I help have talent, and I didn't give them or develop their talent. All I am doing is helping them to package what they already have in a way that gives them commercial results.

One of my favorite models is an incredible dancer. She has physical attributes that make this a key part of her performance. When I started working with her she was sitting in her chair staring at the camera never dancing. I asked her to dance. She said "I really don't think I am a good dancer and I really don't do that very often." I persisted. I immediately saw that she was phenomenal and simply did not have confidence. It took months to get her out of her shell and build her confidence. Now it is second nature for her and she is amazing.

How is it a crime for me to give someone confidence in an innate skill they had all along? How is it me "creating" or "playing god" to simply help a person realize what they already have?

 

[Smores]

Man oh man, I was actually JUST about to make a post giving kudos to you for having been told repeatedly over and over, for MONTHS, how your constant need to "help" models is ridiculous and still pushing forward and not rage-quitting ACF like most would.

Then you posted this. And it all makes sense. You have a purpose of being here. We are feeding you breadcrumbs for your future business idea.

I do hope you'll tip a hat this direction one day if you do take all the knowledge and advice we've shared and make something of it for yourself.

(Most people don't... they come, they reap, they make their own, they pretend ACF didn't act as a launch pad for their endeavors. But I'm not bitter at all...)

There is no question I have learned things here. And there is no question that this is a tough business for the models. I have a lot of respect for the models who push through all the obstacles and succeed.

I have tried to be generous with ideas and tried to help people when I could. That includes giving people technical support and screen shots and whatever, which I did not need to do but did anyway.

And rage-quitting is not my style, but wow it has not been smooth sailing.

 

[Gen]

when I am the mod and I get to have private conversations with a user who just sent 3000 tokens and I get to ask pointed questions about what my model can do to improve her show in his eyes.

I have tried to think of a more invasive, inappropriate, annoying boner killer than getting a PM from some random dude when I’m making it rain on a girl...and I can’t. That would make me quit the room immediately. I can’t imagine I’m alone in this?

 

[AmberCutie]

I have tried to think of a more invasive, inappropriate, annoying boner killer than getting a PM from some random dude when I’m making it rain on a girl...and I can’t. That would make me quit the room immediately. I can’t imagine I’m alone in this?

Shit, how did I miss that?

jesus fk'in christ, @Smores don't do that!

 

[Smores]

I have tried to think of a more invasive, inappropriate, annoying boner killer than getting a PM from some random dude when I’m making it rain on a girl...and I can’t. That would make me quit the room immediately. I can’t imagine I’m alone in this?

It has always been the opposite. These are always guys who are in love with the model and cannot stop talking about her. Every conversation has been friendly and usually they turn around and start asking me questions about her. But if someone doesn't answer or gives a weak answer, I am not going to push them. I have also only done this about five times. Also, this is never done during the middle of a tipping frenzy. This is always done at the end, as the member is ready to leave. You are making something out of nothing.

 

[DJ_Pioneer]

I do share ACF with them. None has ever shown the slightest interest in signing up.

If people want something badly enough they find a way to make their way through it all. In the meantime, I have things I want to learn, and they have things they want people to do for them (apparently since they are a bit lazy and lost).

None of your advice is helping either them or me to accomplish short term goals.

My advice to tell them to come her would most certainly help them, however I do agree that it won't help you the slightest. If they are to lazy to click a link where they can get the very best help for free I don't think there is anything that you can do, beyond tipping for them to continue on the path they have chosen.

I do not really want to share a business idea.

My guess is that you is going to compile what you have learned in some form and sell it, but if you can't even sell clicking a link to these "lazy and lost" models how are you going to get them to pay to take advantage of your great understanding of the world of cam modeling?

I want to see what works. I want to see what does not work. I want to understand the ebbs and flows of viewer traffic. I want to understand viewers real needs, as when I am the mod and I get to have private conversations with a user who just sent 3000 tokens and I get to ask pointed questions about what my model can do to improve her show in his eyes. I want to understand how significantly Twitter marketing affects traffic and bidding. I want to understand how to affect return visits by the best customers. The list goes on....

What works and doesn't work is one of those things you and I will never be able to understand because we are not the models and we do not know what goes on in their heads. As for viewer traffic if people think that the room seems entertaining in someway it will get traffic. How much traffic it gets and if it is the kind of traffic that pays that also depends on the model and I don't think we can or should sit and direct them because we are not the people who are on cam. As a member if you would start asking me questions about my tipping I wouldn't answer you but I would tell the model what you are doing politely ask the model to permanently ban you and if she didn't I probably wouldn't comeback to her room ever again.

Yes, I guess they are using me. Things that should have been done in one month take many months because of lack of motivation or work ethic on their side. And I am okay with that for a short period of time while my own knowledge grows. Long term, it sucks. I won't put up with that forever.

You say again that you gain knowledge, but what knowledge have you gained so far? From what you have written previously your knowledge of camming seems very basic. To summarize what you have gained so far from your efforts, it seems like you haven't created models careers or anything else for that matter but you spent some money and time only to gain the little knowledge that you have. To me it seems like you would be better off learning image editing or some other useful skill, because that is something people would actually be willing to pay for.

 

[Gen]

It has always been the opposite. These are always guys who are in love with the model and cannot stop talking about her. Every conversation has been friendly and usually they turn around and start asking me questions about her. But if someone doesn't answer or gives a weak answer, I am not going to push them. I have also only done this about five times. Also, this is never done during the middle of a tipping frenzy. This is always done at the end, as the member is ready to leave. You are making something out of nothing.

God, that’s insufferable. Like I said, that sounds so creepily invasive and I’d love to see how many members have blocked you. Justify it however you want but I’m saying, as a model and a member, that would annoy the fuck out of me. The gall!

 

[Smores]

God, that’s insufferable. Like I said, that sounds so creepily invasive and I’d love to see how many members have blocked you. Justify it however you want but I’m saying, as a model and a member, that would annoy the fuck out of me. The gall!

Doing the math together: five conversations. All five extremely positive. All five users now greet me in public chat and have ongoing positive interactions. Zero blocks. You made me aware of the issue. Thanks.

 

[AmberCutie]

Doing the math together: five conversations. All five extremely positive. All five users now greet me in public chat and have ongoing positive interactions. Zero blocks. You made me aware of the issue. Thanks.

Seriously stop.

 

[AudriTwo]

who are these models... i want to talk to them. are naive or they are just entertaining you for the coin? i can't figure it out. maybe it's more. but i want to pick their brain for having the ability to deal with your insufferable and controlling behavior.

 

[AmberCutie]

who are these models... i want to talk to them. are naive or they are just entertaining you for the coin? i can't figure it out. maybe it's more. but i want to pick their brain for having the ability to deal with your insufferable and controlling behavior.

I feel similarly!

I would love to see what these models would actually say about him in a closed room with trusted other models. I have this strong feeling it would be a very surprising experience for Smores to see what happens if he was a fly on that wall.

 

[Sophiestique]

are we still talking with Smores about his models? @AudriTwo @AmberCutie

 

[curvyredhead]

this thread tho