How do you deal with pictures and videos on google?

[tth]

A model that I've known for quite a while now has recently gotten very scared about the pictures and videos she finds of herself on google, she doesn't want to tell her boss(studio) and she's scared that her friends are gonna find out about it.

I tried telling her that the only way her friends would find out about it is if they knew her username which they don't, but she's still scared that someone might stumble upon them

Any thoughts? How do you guys deal with it?

 

[ElaySmith]

I tried telling her that the only way her friends would find out about it is if they knew her username which they don't, but she's still scared that someone might stumble upon them

This is FAR from the truth. When I started camming nobody knew. I was outted bc somebody that new me in real life came across one of my capped videos that had been put on a tube site. Then they plastered my model name and real name all over facebook. It happens more often than you might imagine.

As far as how to handle it, every person is different. I came out to my friends and family and now I just link all the videos and stuff I find to my cam room or videos sites and use it as free promotion. You can send DMCAs to try to have the videos taken down but if she is going to continue to cam it will be an up hill battle. Honestly, its just part of the job and if she is dead set on not being found out then this job may not be for her.

 

[dark_mermaid]

I'm quite sure studios do not tell girls about this before the girls start (mine didn't, they very explicitly said how this is all without risk). What sites is she on if I may ask? Why does she not want to tell her boss? I'm 100% sure he knows but didn't tell. I'm actually curious what he would say.

 

[AudriTwo]

i own my shit and try to have an adult conversation about why i cam. if they turn into a hateful bitch about it...

 

[dark_mermaid]

Errrr...what?

 

[Mintx]

Don't tell her that no one will find her if (x) doesn't know (x). One day the people I play video games with were browsing some clip site, and a guy messaged me to let me know that it took about two seconds to find me by putting my Snapchat handle into the search bar. It is super easy to find people online. Don't try telling her that people only need her username to find her. People do browse clip and cam sites.

 

[CurvyJ]

I would just say most likely if they come across her camming stuff...they are looking at camming stuff to begin with, and it would be hypocritical of them to try and hurt her or make her feel badly...She is owning herself and her body, there is no shame in that

 

[dark_mermaid]

As bad as it is, in certain countries guys look on the auto recording sites for girls that they know and blackmail them. I personally know of three such cases. It's Eastern Europe. Unprepared or even intentionally misinformed studio girls are the easiest targets. Social network accounts are also often wide open. I'm not saying it happens to everyone, far from it but it does happen unfortunately.

 

[CurvyJ]

As bad as it is, in certain countries guys look on the auto recording sites for girls that they know and blackmail them. I personally know of three such cases. It's Eastern Europe. Unprepared or even intentionally misinformed studio girls are the easiest targets. Social network accounts are also often wide open. I'm not saying it happens to everyone, far from it but it does happen unfortunately.

People are such assholes

 

[ElaySmith]

I would just say most likely if they come across her camming stuff...they are looking at camming stuff to begin with, and it would be hypocritical of them to try and hurt her or make her feel badly...She is owning herself and her body, there is no shame in that

If only this were true. So many guys that watch porn wouldn't think twice about outting a sex worker. We're just the whores they wack their willies to. There have been time where some random dude has approached me and been like "you look so familiar" and I love saying "Oh, well you've probably seen my porn".... The reaction is normally priceless and I just kinda walk away...... fun times.

 

[SaffronBurke]

If only this were true. So many guys that watch porn wouldn't think twice about outting a sex worker. We're just the whores they wack their willies to. There have been time where some random dude has approached me and been like "you look so familiar" and I love saying "Oh, well you've probably seen my porn".... The reaction is normally priceless and I just kinda walk away...... fun times.

I had a dude in a restaurant a few months ago asking if I went to (local college) because I looked so familiar. I've gotten shit like that even BEFORE being a sex worker, I must have at least a dozen dopplegangers running around because people would stop me in the mall and insist that I went to some high school that I don't even know the location of. It never occurs to me that they might recognize me because of porn, it's always an immediate, "here we go again, another person who's met the other me...."

 

[unanonymous]

You can help her submit DMCA takedown requests. You can read how to do so in this thread. The DMCA is a good concept, but the way it's applied by Google is total B.S. Not only are the videos/pictures NOT taken down from the sites they're uploaded to, but Google submits all the information in your request to the Lumen database and includes a link to it for everyone to see, in the name of "transparency". If her videos are already out there, she's pretty much screwed. Most of these sites are registered in 19th world countries that don't comply with privacy laws, and are protected by cloudflare, so you can't even find the host service to file a complaint with THEM.

Even if you've submitted the takedown requests, if someone knows your nickname and googles it in quotes, they might not find your videos/pictures with 1 click... But they will after 2 clicks, because the links to the DMCA takedown requests pop up right at the bottom of the search page. The Lumen database includes the exact links you requested to be removed, your name (at least you can use a fake one), as well as the reason for the removal.

What you can do to protect your identity is, obviously, remove ANY identifying information from your nickname, bio and physical appearance. If she's super-paranoid, she probably shouldn't be camming in the first place. If she's that scared that someone will find her, tell her to delete her account, pick a new vague username, never put her real date of birth or location on the cam site, learn how to use a VPN, block access to her country/region and disable the "appear on network sites" option to minimize the risk of getting auto-recorded. Tell her to wear a mask too if she's scared that she'll get found out, or just tell her to stop showing her face altogether.

Still, considering how much information cam sites collect on you, you're never in the clear unless you upload a fake ID and photoshop your face to a point where no future facial recognition software will be able to tell who you are. Just look at how much Chaturbate collects on you. They store all the videos/pictures you upload, the IPs you log from, all the messages you send. I haven't heard of any camsite employees blackmailing broadcasters with the information they have on them, but that doesn't mean that it won't happen. We're humans after all.

So how to deal with this - either relax and be more careful, or stop doing it altogether.

 

[ameliababyxo]

I keep googling my real name and my username and seeing if any pictures come up, nothing so far. I’m sure it won’t take long though. It’s a little nerve wracking, but in the end the money is making it worth the risk for me. I don’t live at my parents house anymore, so even if they actually find out what I do, it’s not life or death.
All my close friends, my roommate, and my boyfriend know what I do and none of them care (two friends are actually going to start camming too!) so I’m pretty comfortable with it.

 

[ElaySmith]

It never occurs to me that they might recognize me because of porn

This is ALWAYS my first thought.

 

[LilyPink]

There was much more of an illusion of anonymity when I first started but now it looks like we're heading towards one online identity each as governments try to take control of the internet.

The problem isn't just the stigma associated with sex work but also protecting our personal details so we can remain safe from stalkers and harmful people.

 

[ElaySmith]

There was much more of an illusion of anonymity when I first started but now it looks like we're heading towards one online identity each as governments try to take control of the internet.

The problem isn't just the stigma associated with sex work but also protecting our personal details so we can remain safe from stalkers and harmful people.

Seriously. All of this.
Id honestly love to quit living what could be considered a double life. After portraying Elay online for almost a decade she is a huge part of who I am. My close friends and family know what I do and we have had very open discussions about it. For the most part everyone is on board and there are no issues there. But, like I said earlier I was outed on facebook and I have never really owned up to being Elay on there. Part of me feels like all these people, old hs classmates/people that live in my hometown etc. think they have something on me.... like they know my dirty secret... only its not really a secret. Id love to scream and shout from the rooftops that this is what I do bc I am proud of building a business and brand that gives me a great life. Im not ashamed of what I do. I just don't want everyone from Elay Land to try to follow me personally bc it can get creepy out there.

 

[unanonymous]

now it looks like we're heading towards one online identity each as governments try to take control of the internet.

I'm pretty sure that the NSA already has all the data it needs to put 2 and 2 together. Except they probably don't know how to do that optimally yet, because there's just so much data out there. Imagine collecting terrabytes of data on each person. I could barely force myself to go through my browser history, let alone forcing some government employee to go through gigs of meaningless jibberish, while they have much more important things to do.

I mean, we send our real-life IDs to get verified on cam sites. How difficult could it be to link that document to our cam nicknames? Yet, I've searched and searched for camgirl government blackmail stories and never found any. You'd think that camgirl sites would be long penetrated by governments for future blackmail purposes. Sexual blackmail is a real thing, but I guess it doesn't concern "powerless" people like us. It only ever becomes a thing when you're already in a position of power, like being a gay/pedo in congress or something.

 

[DJ_Pioneer]

You can help her submit DMCA takedown requests. You can read how to do so in this thread. The DMCA is a good concept, but the way it's applied by Google is total B.S. Not only are the videos/pictures NOT taken down from the sites they're uploaded to, but Google submits all the information in your request to the Lumen database and includes a link to it for everyone to see, in the name of "transparency". If her videos are already out there, she's pretty much screwed. Most of these sites are registered in 19th world countries that don't comply with privacy laws, and are protected by cloudflare, so you can't even find the host service to file a complaint with THEM.

Even if you've submitted the takedown requests, if someone knows your nickname and googles it in quotes, they might not find your videos/pictures with 1 click... But they will after 2 clicks, because the links to the DMCA takedown requests pop up right at the bottom of the search page. The Lumen database includes the exact links you requested to be removed, your name (at least you can use a fake one), as well as the reason for the removal.

What you can do to protect your identity is, obviously, remove ANY identifying information from your nickname, bio and physical appearance. If she's super-paranoid, she probably shouldn't be camming in the first place. If she's that scared that someone will find her, tell her to delete her account, pick a new vague username, never put her real date of birth or location on the cam site, learn how to use a VPN, block access to her country/region and disable the "appear on network sites" option to minimize the risk of getting auto-recorded. Tell her to wear a mask too if she's scared that she'll get found out, or just tell her to stop showing her face altogether.

Still, considering how much information cam sites collect on you, you're never in the clear unless you upload a fake ID and photoshop your face to a point where no future facial recognition software will be able to tell who you are. Just look at how much Chaturbate collects on you. They store all the videos/pictures you upload, the IPs you log from, all the messages you send. I haven't heard of any camsite employees blackmailing broadcasters with the information they have on them, but that doesn't mean that it won't happen. We're humans after all.

So how to deal with this - either relax and be more careful, or stop doing it altogether.

Google can't takedown websites they don't host. The Lumen database is a good thing because it makes it harder for people that does shady stuff to take down reports on it with DMCA claims.

Also I just want to point out for anyone that considers using a fake ID that doing so could result in a fine and/or prison time depending on where you live if you are caught.

 

[unanonymous]

The Lumen database is a good thing because it makes it harder for people that does shady stuff to take down reports on it with DMCA claims.

The Lumen database is a good idea overall, but its extreme transparency contradicts the right to be forgotten. The way it's implemented, you have a right to be forgotten within 1 click, but people can still find you in 2.

I wrote them a letter explaining why they should only list (on the publicly-available complaint form) the website url and exclude the extension which leads DIRECTLY to the problematic content, in order to protect the complainant's privacy. Otherwise what's the point of a takedown request? It only removes the links from the searches and adds them to the bottom of the page...

That way, in case the DMCA takedown forms are abused like you mentioned (I doubt these malicious takedown requests represent the majority of DMCA requests), the victim can check the complaint and file a counter-complaint.

My point being that the public in general, and random nosy people in particular, shouldn't have access to the full links in the Lumen database, just the basic url: "www.offendingsite.com". That's transparent enough for the public and even for a potential victim of DMCA abuse (someone trying to hurt your business).

For us broadcasters, even that's too much if you know what you're looking for (how hard is it to visit the website and search for a nickname?). It's a compromise, but I think it's a good start.

 

[LilyPink]

Seriously. All of this.
Id honestly love to quit living what could be considered a double life. After portraying Elay online for almost a decade she is a huge part of who I am. My close friends and family know what I do and we have had very open discussions about it. For the most part everyone is on board and there are no issues there. But, like I said earlier I was outed on facebook and I have never really owned up to being Elay on there. Part of me feels like all these people, old hs classmates/people that live in my hometown etc. think they have something on me.... like they know my dirty secret... only its not really a secret. Id love to scream and shout from the rooftops that this is what I do bc I am proud of building a business and brand that gives me a great life. Im not ashamed of what I do. I just don't want everyone from Elay Land to try to follow me personally bc it can get creepy out there.

I'm coming to the decision to be just Lily online and keep my legal name for offline spaces only. I wonder if this would be something that could suit you too?

 

[DJ_Pioneer]

The Lumen database is a good idea overall, but its extreme transparency contradicts the right to be forgotten. The way it's implemented, you have a right to be forgotten within 1 click, but people can still find you in 2.

I wrote them a letter explaining why they should only list (on the publicly-available complaint form) the website url and exclude the extension which leads DIRECTLY to the problematic content, in order to protect the complainant's privacy. Otherwise what's the point of a takedown request? It only removes the links from the searches and adds them to the bottom of the page...

That way, in case the DMCA takedown forms are abused like you mentioned (I doubt these malicious takedown requests represent the majority of DMCA requests), the victim can check the complaint and file a counter-complaint.

My point being that the public in general, and random nosy people in particular, shouldn't have access to the full links in the Lumen database, just the basic url: "www.offendingsite.com". That's transparent enough for the public and even for a potential victim of DMCA abuse (someone trying to hurt your business).

For us broadcasters, even that's too much if you know what you're looking for (how hard is it to visit the website and search for a nickname?). It's a compromise, but I think it's a good start.

The right to be forgotten and the DMCA is two different things. The DMCA is a US law regulating copyright, the right to be forgotten is a right we in Europe and Argentina have through laws. The DMCA should not be used as a way to be forgotten because if a DMCA claim is contested then it have to be solved in court and if it goes that far then there are penalties for submitting false DMCA claims.

 

[unanonymous]

@DJ_Pioneer we have nothing to worry about since none of us would be submitting false DMCA claims. And before the Lumen database, there existed Chilling Effects, which took itself down because people complained about it having become the exact opposite of what the DMCA is about, or a literal search engine for concentrated pirated content.

The DMCA should, by default, be a means of being forgotten. The Lumen database has repeated the Chilling Effects' mistake of becoming a search engine for links to concentrated pirated content, defeating the entire purpose of submitting DMCA complaints.

 

[DJ_Pioneer]

@DJ_Pioneer we have nothing to worry about since none of us would be submitting false DMCA claims. And before the Lumen database, there existed Chilling Effects, which took itself down because people complained about it having become the exact opposite of what the DMCA is about, or a literal search engine for concentrated pirated content.

The DMCA should, by default, be a means of being forgotten. The Lumen database has repeated the Chilling Effects' mistake of becoming a search engine for links to concentrated pirated content, defeating the entire purpose of submitting DMCA complaints.

Still the right to be forgotten and the DMCA are completely different things, which is important to make clear just in case some person comes across this thread looking to get content that they have been apart of but does not own the copyright to off the internet.

 

[unanonymous]

Yes, it is important to make that distinction. While a DMCA takedown form can be submitted with a fake name and without providing an ID, the right to be forgotten form requires an ID and asks you to select information about which name you wish to delist from the Google search engine. I severely doubt that anyone worried about their privacy would use their full real name as their broadcaster nickname.

 

[DJ_Pioneer]

Yes, it is important to make that distinction. While a DMCA takedown form can be submitted with a fake name and without providing an ID, the right to be forgotten form requires an ID and asks you to select information about which name you wish to delist from the Google search engine. I severely doubt that anyone worried about their privacy would use their full real name as their broadcaster nickname.

OK then please explain to me like I am five what is so wrong with the Lumen database in this context.

 

[unanonymous]

OK then please explain to me like I am five what is so wrong with the Lumen database in this context.

You can be discovered via your nickname. The Lumen database immortalizes content that people want removed. It defeats the purpose of DMCA by literally becoming a pirate search engine. If you don't see a problem with how ridiculous the Lumen database is, I don't know how I can convince you.

It's like a little girl who asks a police officer to save her from her pedo uncle, and the police officer throws her in protective custody where all the pedos can prey on her.

 

[DJ_Pioneer]

You can be discovered via your nickname. The Lumen database immortalizes content that people want removed. It defeats the purpose of DMCA by literally becoming a pirate search engine. If you don't see a problem with how ridiculous the Lumen database is, I don't know how I can convince you.

It's like a little girl who asks a police officer to save her from her pedo uncle, and the police officer throws her in protective custody where all the pedos can prey on her.

When someone publishes anything they should do so with the understanding that people can and will figure out their identity given enough time. If they want what they have made removed on copyright grounds they have to pursue their rights in court, there are several international conventions that deal with copyright law on an international level. This is the the only real way to get something removed if it is a copyright infringement, having Google take it out of the search results does not really do anything since there are other search engines that can be used.

If they want to be forgotten using copyright to do so is the wrong way to go about it. Let me point out that the Lumen database is not something shady, it is backed by the Electronic Frontier Foundation and it's intent is to protect people's right to freedom of expression and if we are going to have content on the internet that certain groups don't approve of this is something that creators of sensitive content needs far more than copyright protection. What is even the point of having copyright in the first place if you can't publish what you make so people can see it?

Also I think that was a bad analogy that tries to go for the sensational to have people outraged, because that is not how protective custody works.

 

[unanonymous]

Camgirl vs Internet. I'd like to see that one. Good luck to those suing some site hosted in a 19th world country that doesn't comply with US/international copyright laws and winning, without revealing the things they want to stay hidden and triggering the Streisand effect.

This is a camgirl site and my issue is strictly about camgirls/boys/trans who want stuff taken down silently, with the form that is most widely used to take down content (DMCA takedown) from the search engine that most people in the West use (Google), and not have the full URLs end up on a database that is counterproductive to the act it serves (Lumen).

I don't know why exactly you're pro-Lumen, but you mentioned people covering up shady stuff they did with the help of DMCA takedowns. Would you care to elaborate in more detail? Because from what I've read, the majority of takedown requests, be it DMCA or through other acts and laws, are legitimate, and only a very tiny percentage ever get challenged with a counter-notice. You don't need Lumen as a mediator. When someone files a bogus complaint against you, the service provider contacts you and you take it up with them and the complainant.

I'm not saying destroy Lumen, but it needs reform. List the website URL only as a start, instead of the full URL to the problematic content. Reveal it to the person submitting a counter-notification when they dispute the delisting. Sure, keep the information, but don't make it publicly available.

DMCA does not mention or require the existence of a mediator database that lists all requests and makes them publicly available for the sake of transparency and disputing. Google use it to cover up their asses. Say someone files a bogus takedown request against results for my site/business, Google can simply mail me, I can file a counter-notice, and unless the guy with the bogus notice goes to court within 14 business days (which they won't because they know their complaint is bogus), Google will relist my site. It's just between me, the service provider and the person filing the takedown request.

Over a million takedown requests are processed by Google every day. The way things are going, Lumen, the "protector against censorship", might remove themselves from the Internet again, for the same reason they did last time. They did it themselves. That's indicative of a huge problem with their work, and that is very telling.