Olivia

[UncleThursday]

I agree that Satire and Parody are indeed the rights of everyone to have. But heres the thing: I don't know if her show WAS. It was just her recreating the Nazi propaganda and wearing it. There was no mockery of it. There was no twisting of it to be anything more than 'sexy' and for shock value. The Producers used the Nazi idea because in the end, there was a gay guy playing Hitler which mocked Hitler. Plus the whole show/movie/ other movie wasn't ABOUT the Nazis, per se..

It's like the actor playing the colonel in Hogan's Heroes. He was a Jew, and only agreed to do the role after he was assured that the character would be a complete bumbling idiot. Thus, he could be a Jew, wearing a Nazi uniform on TV, but be making fun of Nazis the entire time. Every time Mel Brooks does things relating to Nazis, he makes sure that it is poking fun at them in subtle and not so subtle ways.

As I said in the other thread about her, she has every right, in the US, to be as distasteful and offensive as she wants. I do not know the laws of her country to know if that sort of thing is considered free speech (she is Romanian, living in Romania, as far as I know). But, while she has the right, in the US, she is also not immune to criticism for whatever shenanigans she decides to pull (and I say this as an Jew). Criticize her to your heart's content. That's everyone's right, as well. She's done other things, like broadcasting copyrighted works, that should have had her banned a long time ago. But, she makes MFC a lot of money, so Leo, et al, look the other way for the most part.

 

[SoTxBob]

the thing i find sadly amusing these days is when people have what could be a well done post and then they crash the thought by labeling others as liberals, fascists, sociopaths, sympathizers, etc etc etc.. I have found that ideas, opinions and most other things worth writing about are much better received and not immediately tossed away when there isn't any judgemental labeling within.

 

[UncleThursday]

Actually, the reason I am so pissed is because I am jewish and my grandfather was a Holocaust survivor. For the first time last night I was ashamed of working on MFC. Most of you didnt see it unfold, but the string of antisemitic vile in her room last night was apalling, and she didnt ban them, she didnt do anything. This is why
I dont think she is innocent. What she did resonated with white supremacists and antisemites, something that would NEVER happen with The Producers and Springtime for Hitler. No neo-nazi would applaud that because it is a mockery. But they were in Olivia's room last night cheering and MFC did nothing. My grandfather survived the product of jew hatred and it always begins innocently.

I'm Jewish as well. My grandfather fought in Europe, and was awarded the Bronze Star for Meritorious Service for his design that helped save the lives of paratroopers in the US Army. Also, between the Nazis and Stalinist Soviet Union, my family has been reduced so bad in Europe, that anyone born with my last name, in the entire world, is a blood relative. That's how unique my last name is.

However, I'm not pissed at the show (I also didn't see it, just heard about it on Twitter while I was watching the UFC fights at a weekend house party I was at... at a model's house that I know). Do I find it in poor taste? Sure. But, as a proponent for free speech, I won't say she can't do thing I find distasteful, or even offensive (it takes a lot to offend me). But, as I said, I feel it is everyone's right to criticize her, if they want. And they should, with positive or negative criticism. Say if they found it offensive, or not. Say if they feel her performance was done just for controversy and to earn a quick buck. Etc.

Should she be banned from MFC for it? No. She should be banned for many other things she has done, and continues to do (to the best of my knowledge she still does the Friday Night Movies thing, but I haven't been on MFC as much); but not for this performance.

 

[Azhrarn]

Liberals are supposed to believe in freedom of speech. Conservatives are supposed to believe in the First Amendment. Libertarians even more so than either Liberals or Conservatives. So if you call yourself an American, the one thing that everyone should be able to agree upon is that you don't censor speech. Anyone who does so argue, that speech, ideas and symbols should be forbidden just because they themselves don't agree with them, is someone who just isn't a Liberal, or just isn't a Libertarian, but someone who is espousing ideas that go against the whole historical current of the United States for the last 400 years.

As for your rejection of "judgmental labeling", I suggest you preach that sermon to all of Olivia's critics, who seem to have found her show distasteful for no other reason than her costume and props. To my knowledge she didn't espouse any Nazi ideology. My German is very poor, but I couldn't make out anything that came close to sounding like hate speech. She put on a silly costume, danced around a bit, and if people today find that beyond the pale, then I'll just point to the utter failure of our educational system to actually educate people, to teach critical thinking skills, rather than encouraging group thought and cultural conformity. Furthermore, I thought it had been established on these forums as dogma that cam girls are never responsible for the speech of members in their room. Yet now I see exactly this being laid against Olivia.

I wonder how much of the outrage against Olivia was motivated by nothing more than jealousy? Last night people who had never even heard of MFC before showed up in her room. How many other cam girls can say that?

 

[dilligaf0]

I've read the posts and I have a few issues with what's been said by some people.
Shutting down MFC will only hurt 1,000+ other models who try hard to make a living.
Banning her would open a very tricky door of disciplining other models too, for any reason, justly or unjustly.
Unequal treatment toward models as far as disciplining behavior, MFC would have to set and publish rules for all models to follow.
Boycotting MFC, your choice but I doubt they would notice.


My suggestion, if you are unhappy about her show or thought it in bad taste don't go into her room and don't tip her.

 

[gonegirl2352]

Oh please, to say a model is jealous of Olivia is like saying a baboon is jealous of an octopus. Why would you want to trade a rainbow butt for tentacles.

 

[Sevrin]

I think this is one of those cases where we should put this down to stupidity rather than malice. Listening to her German in the video was pretty painful, though.

 

[BasicBasic]

Well, she's back to her usual mime routine with distorted music, so the world has returned to normal in MFC land.

Box of chocolates... indeed.

 

[Molison]

noticed her camming from hospital last month I think, going for the ultimate sympathy tokens.

She wasn't camming from a hospital. It was green screen. Same as when she does her radio show, she is not in a broadcasting studio, she uses green screen.

 

[Ambers Troll]

She wasn't camming from a hospital. It was green screen. Same as when she does her radio show, she is not in a broadcasting studio, she uses green screen.

That was my point, the hospital thing was her way of having fun over sympathy tokens. I have never tipped her over her antics, but they are difficult to not notice from time to time. That one made me smile.

 

[Azhrarn]

This is what Olivia posted a short time ago in her room.

"freedom is freedom
do not be fooled
some can abuse the freedom
and do stupid stuff
offensive stuff
but who decides what is offensive?
ask yourself that
a dictator can say you have the freedom of speech
but I decide what is offensive
is that freedom?"

If it wasn't for freedom of speech, a website like MFC couldn't exist and thousands of cam girls would be forced to seek other occupations, because there are many who would deem this form of speech offensive and call for it to be shut down.

“I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it” - François-Marie Arouet (aka Voltaire)

 

[gonegirl2352]

Yeah. I am done with any further discussion of lame, tacky, viral-fail attempt internet programming.

 

[hiakuryu]

This is what Olivia posted a short time ago in her room.

"freedom is freedom
do not be fooled
some can abuse the freedom
and do stupid stuff
offensive stuff
but who decides what is offensive?
ask yourself that
a dictator can say you have the freedom of speech
but I decide what is offensive
is that freedom?"

If it wasn't for freedom of speech, a website like MFC couldn't exist and thousands of cam girls would be forced to seek other occupations, because there are many who would deem this form of speech offensive and call for it to be shut down.

“I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it” - François-Marie Arouet (aka Voltaire)

1) Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from the consequences of being a giant idiot.
2) Freedom of speech means Governments can't take actions against you for your speech, private organisations and other people can do what they like in response to speech in any damn way they like as long as it's legal
3) If she's going to quote Voltaire then she should at least use something that he's said. He never said it. Ever. Gah I fucking hate it when people say that.

 

[RedHerby]

Olivia is consistently thought to be more interesting, artistic and smart because she stands among dolled up half naked girls doing something vaguely odd. I find that to be far more offensive than her used up, half assed Nazi nonsense. She works in shock value and drama, and if she did so anywhere else she would go completely unnoticed. She's as interesting as Marilyn Manson is evil

I have an other opinion, not that there is anything wrong with it, I understand that a fellow cam model feels like that, it is just that I think different.

I'm intrigued by how Olivia has reached her current position. She started as a cam model in a non-sexual Romanian studio (search for olivia4naked at xhamster to see her in that environment). I normally visit mfc rooms like in this video. Romanian girls working very hard with a cam score below 500. With just a few members. Tipping 2 or 3 times 25 tokens a evening and I have nice social/human contact, chatting with a sexy girl half my age about various subjects. Or a group chat with other regulars too. And sometimes skype xxx fun for 200 tokens.

But she 'escaped' this and does have now a long time a high position in the Miss MFC ranking. How did she do this? Does she work alone? Or has she a team (or boss, still studio worker maybe?). I would find it very interesting to see answers to this kind of questions, with a serious interview for example.

 

[Nordling]

Well, the Voltaire quote was taught to kids for a very long time, plus it's does kind of reflect his style of thinking but:

"He never actually wrote “I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it” – this excellent formulation was, rather, the work of his English biographer, Evelyn Beatrice Hall (who also used a pseudonym: SG Tallentyre), who used it to describe his “attitude” in her 1906 biography, The Friends of Voltaire."

I can forgive Olivia for misquoting something that virtually everyone n the planet misquotes.

Also, when she talked about freedom, I don't think she means the US Bill of Rights first amendment...but freedom as a concept...and that anyone who censors you is wrong. Now obviously there are exceptions (crying fire in a crowded theater), but generally, it's a good idea.

 

[LoonaVision]

I am completely against what Olivia did, I know she has to be creative in her shows, but she crossed the line this time.
I don't understand why mfc admins did nothing about it.
There are just some themes what can't be performed.

 

[dilligaf0]

Now obviously there are exceptions (crying fire in a crowded theater), but generally, it's a good idea.

Why am I not free to do that?
If I can say anything I want, there should be no exceptions.



(Muah-ha-haaaaaaa)

 

[Azhrarn]

If she's going to quote Voltaire then she should at least use something that he's said. He never said it. Ever. Gah I fucking hate it when people say that.

As Nordlin has already pointed out, the quote may not be accurate in a strictly literal sense, but it is an accurate summation of his beliefs, for in his works can be found very similar passages, such as these below:

“Think for yourself and let others enjoy the privilege of doing so too.”
― Voltaire, Traité sur la tolérance à l'occasion de la mort de Jean Calas

“It is clear that the individual who persecutes a man, his brother, because he is not of the same opinion, is a monster.”
― Voltaire, Dictionnaire philosophique

Familiarity with these works makes clear the accuracy of this papaphrase by Evelyn Beatrice Hall, which is why I chose it (not Olivia), to serve as a summation of my posts on this topic. What you seem to overlook by your quibbling is that this paraphrase is probably the best explanation possible of the meaning behind "freedom of speech."

 

[RedHerby]

I can forgive Olivia for misquoting something that virtually everyone n the planet misquotes.

Did Olivia quote Voltaire? Looks like Azhrarn first qouted Olivia, then did write a few own lines and then qouted Voltaire.

 

[Nordling]

Why am I not free to do that?
If I can say anything I want, there should be no exceptions.



(Muah-ha-haaaaaaa)

Ha! Do you want your freedom to be symmetrical or something? The universe is a bit lopsided methinks.

 

[Nordling]

Did Olivia quote Voltaire? Looks like Azhrarn first qouted Olivia, then did write a few own lines and then qouted Voltaire.

I assumed that was what he was saying, but honestly, I have no idea. I rather thought he was being a bit pedantic.

 

[LoonaVision]

I need to comment here again.
The point is i don't understand why Olivia does it. First, it was terrorist show on 9/11, now this nazi performance. I mean so many people were killed, so much pain, sorrow, tears. Why? Please, tell me why to bring it live on adult site? Is it fun for her? How can it be fun? How murder and death can be fun? I am sorry I just don't understand her.

 

[Jenny_B.Good]

This girl has future. She uses her haters to become famous.

 

[Lexi Emerson]

I need to comment here again.
The point is i don't understand why Olivia does it. First, it was terrorist show on 9/11, now this nazi performance. I mean so many people were killed, so much pain, sorrow, tears. Why? Please, tell me why to bring it live on adult site? Is it fun for her? How can it be fun? How murder and death can be fun? I am sorry I just don't understand her.

Shock value. Look at all the attention it has gotten her, even if a lot of it is negative. Do something so insensitive will get more people in your room and get everyone else talking.

 

[LoonaVision]

I can't respect her ways to become famous.
And its not like she wasn't famous before. She is MFC legend for years.
I loved watching her shows in past, her creativity.
But this is just too much for me, i think. What she did is so wrong.

 

[Peachfuzz]

It's obviously not meant to be taken seriously, she's dressed in a mashup of dictator uniforms spouting a 'speech about dominating the token war for miss.mfc'. I don't agree with the use of symbols associated with hate, but she's clearly saying, I want to shake this place apart and wake you all up. Mabye there is a message to other cam girls to try harder and not just sit there looking grumpy expecting to be loved because you slapped on some lipstick.

What I took away from this incident was, Olivia has embraced what others in the media have done. That is, kick people in the pants with controversy and make them look. Not allways the classy approach, but I have to admit that in these past months.. If you want to be Miss.Mfc, you have to make an entrance, and love her or hate her, the girl made a big f##king entrance this month.

 

[L'Erotica]

I need to comment here again.
The point is i don't understand why Olivia does it. First, it was terrorist show on 9/11, now this nazi performance. I mean so many people were killed, so much pain, sorrow, tears. Why? Please, tell me why to bring it live on adult site? Is it fun for her? How can it be fun? How murder and death can be fun? I am sorry I just don't understand her.

What's wrong with mocking Hitler? She dosen't look like she's serious into all that nazi stuff.

 

[Zoomer]

All the "freedom of speech" reminds me when I used to run a forum. Blimey, people were insane! They'd faux* threaten legal action if i deleted something they posted as it was curbing their freedoms.

Freedom of speech is something that your government allows. It doesn't mean *I* must provide you with my platform upon which to spout your opinion. Not even the slightest. I don't have to give justifications, explanations or anything else - though I often did; libel can be a cause for it at times.

I've no idea of the scenario these few posts mention and frankly don't care. If you've got an issue with how any company and/or individual prevents you from expressing yourself as you wish - then go make your own place; they're under no obligation or requirement to give you any platform from which to say "whatever I damned will like".

*faux as I told them to go right ahead... unsurprisingly no takers.

 

[lovesheidi]

All the "freedom of speech" reminds me when I used to run a forum. Blimey, people were insane! They'd faux* threaten legal action if i deleted something they posted as it was curbing their freedoms.

Freedom of speech is something that your government allows. It doesn't mean *I* must provide you with my platform upon which to spout your opinion. Not even the slightest. I don't have to give justifications, explanations or anything else - though I often did; libel can be a cause for it at times.

I've no idea of the scenario these few posts mention and frankly don't care. If you've got an issue with how any company and/or individual prevents you from expressing yourself as you wish - then go make your own place; they're under no obligation or requirement to give you any platform from which to say "whatever I damned will like".

*faux as I told them to go right ahead... unsurprisingly no takers.

I admin a forum with over 100k users, though it had about a quarter of that when I started. As the number went up, so did the trolling and spamming. Nobody just takes their bans quietly, I've gotten people saying they're going to dox me, hunt me down, kill me, etc. I think the anonymity of the internet can just bring out the worst in people. I had to remove all evidence of being female since the threats were getting sexual and something about that just felt worse.

"Freedom of Speech" is an often used tactic, like no, you can say whatever you want but I have every right to ban you if you can't follow some simple rules.

 

[xtc]

... I do not know the laws of her country to know if that sort of thing is considered free speech (she is Romanian, living in Romania, as far as I know). ..

She could get 6 months to 5 years in jail in Romania for disseminating "fascist, racist or xenophobic" symbols.