How long is a model "obligated" to cam after token goal?

[Kunra9]

I put "obligated" in quotes because I understand that a model is not obligated to do a god damn thing. It's their room they can do what they want.

However from a good business standpoint...

I witnessed today an atrocity from a member standpoint. A new model is broadcasting, has a countdown for her bra off. The goal is met. She takes the bra off and stands up for roughly 1 minute. So let's triple that just for the sake of me being a member and we tend to exaggerate. So 3 minutes of standing up and showing her boobs. She then sits down and sets a new goal.

2000 tokens: panties off.

However when she sits back down her breasts are no longer showing on the camera, she has it moved up where we can't see them. Nobody really complains and the tokens keep flowing. One member tips her 1300 tokens roughly. The count is reached very quickly. She removes her panties and stands up again. Maybe 30 seconds of standing up and she's really just showing us that her panties are removed, not showing the naughty bits.

Then she sits back down, tells everyone she has errands to run and will be back later. Logs off.

Everyone in the room is fairly upset, especially the guy that tipped the majority of the token goal. Some people try to forgive her with "well she's new, doesn't know how it works" when others chime in and say she did the same thing last night. Had a token goal for a "cum show", when the goal was reached she put a vibrator in her vagina for about a minute and then said "thanks guys! I gotta go!" People started complaining and she conceded to stay longer. About 2 minutes later she logged off.


Anyway, that was kind of a long story for the question. BUT, TECHNICALLY she delivered exactly what people paid for. Today people tipped for her bra and panties to be off. She took them off. If she did not plan on doing any kind of "show" today, did these guys get screwed, or were there expectations unrealistic?

I'd love to hear from the models particularly on this one.

Let's say you set a goal for naked and that's all you planned on doing for the day.
Once you are naked you don't receive ANY more tips. How long would you stay on before you decide it's time to go?

 

[sweetiebatman]

As a member, I wouldn't find that an "atrocity" In fact the use of that word made me cringe a bit!

 

[Shaun__]

She is under no obligation like you already said, but that kind of behavior might cost her repeat tippers. Of course the scarcity of what she offers could appeal to some people.

 

[bob]

I put "obligated" in quotes because I understand that a model is not obligated to do a god damn thing. It's their room they can do what they want.

However from a good business standpoint...

well....had i been in that room, i'd a been disappointed, i suppose....but really, so what?
she is new, and has received poor advice, or doesn't really get it, or doesn't really care about it

as long as she can get away with it....shame on the guys who keep playing, unless they are enjoying themselves
in a laissez-faire environment like mfc.....she'll change because the market forces show her the way.....or she will try to fight them.....and......who knows?.. she may succeed and carve out a nice little niche for herself.

few do....but who is too say she won't?

:twocents-02cents:

 

[AllisonWilder]

If my goal was just to get naked and there was no other goal after that, I'd say 30-60 minutes of no tips and I'd be logging off. 30 minutes if the countdown took a really long time to finish, closer to 60 minutes if it went really quickly.

If there were tips flowing, I'd throw up another count though, I've never just stopped at naked because I wouldn't even know what to do with myself at that point.

 

[Evvie]

MFC is a site that relies heavily on regulars or repeat tippers for a model to be successful.

I think that if a model makes it clear her tippers are not going to be rewarded, she's going to have a tough time swimming once spenders become aware that they are not getting what they hoped for. And to be honest, I don't think many of the tippers were greatly mislead; her topless countdown beforehand should have been an indicator that she was not very interested in performing once a countdown was done.

In public chat, I believe that if a countdown has been reached, it is appropriate for the model to stay for several minutes. Depending on the flow of the room, fifteen to thirty minutes might be a reasonable amount.

While it is tough to say that models should be obligated to perform, in a sense, I think this model was obligated and then skipped out on that.

If you paid someone $50 to wash your dog, are they not then obligated to perform the task? Would you feel satisfied if he sprayed your dog down with a hose for three minutes and then walked off because he was busy?

No woman should feel forced to perform or display herself if she is uncomfortable doing so. But if a woman asks for $100 to show her lady bits, gets $100 and then gives a two-minute non-explicit view below the belt, that is misleading. Once you are given money to perform a service, you should feel obligated to do it. In her situation, it seems like she is aware that she is being misleading and cashing in on that anyway.

 

[AprilCarroll]

I agree with Evvie. She's just selling flashes and advertising them as nude shows. :snooty:

Once she has lost "new girl" status, she's really going to struggle unless she changes her approach. Regulars are crucial for successful games and countdowns on MFC, and she probably isn't going to have many.

As for how long a girl should hang out after a countdown, I think 20 minutes or so is appropriate. I usually do a naked countdown and then some sort of show countdown, and I always hang out for a bit after the end of my show just to let my regulars know that I appreciate them and that I'm not going to scurry offline the second I think the tips have stopped. If a girl plans to do only a naked countdown, I think she should hang out for at least half an hour; the members have paid to see and interact with her naked, not to get a glimpse of her before she closes her browser.

 

[Kradek]

I witnessed today an atrocity from a member standpoint.

Calling this an atrocity is ludicrous. Irritating. Unfortunate. But, atrocity? Dude.

 

[Zoomer]

... and this is why some people do not tip, and why folks like me won't tip someone we don't know - via chatting, observation etc.

As for she'll learn - she knows exactly what she's doing. In my humble opinion she is treating the paying members with contempt. Sadly, hitting a 2k panties off topic is out of the reach of most girls on a camscore of ~2000 from what I have observed - so one assumes this new model is extremely attractive and therefore she'll probably get away with it for as long as she's doing it for.

What's her name though - so I can have a quick perv sometime :lol:

 

[Nordling]

I witnessed today an atrocity from a member standpoint.

Calling this an atrocity is ludicrous. Irritating. Unfortunate. But, atrocity? Dude.

Yeah, probably "atrocious," though still a hyperbole, would have been better.

 

[HiGirlsRHot]

I have observed this behavior fairly often, generally among new very good looking models. In some case the seem to be able to get away with it pretty much forever.

However, I will note there is a consistent top 100 model that started her career doing exactly these type of scams. In some cases just abruptly going off cam, then coming back on cam couple hours latter fully clothed and starting the countdown over again. I even wrote to to MFC to complain.

The good news is that I've observed her recently she seems to be behaving much more responsibility lately. Giving videos when promised, providing a true cum show, and generally doing what is expected. I have no idea what cause the change in behavior complaints to MFC, peer pressure or realizing the pool of tipping suckers was rapidly being depleted. So if she is new I'd cut her some slack, but of course no tips until she changes.

 

[ComicOzzie]

Once burned, twice shy. There are a limited number of good-tipping members on MFC and they should quickly move on to other models if they continue to be treated like this. And if they continue to tip, knowing what they are getting, then too fucking bad. Its their money.

 

[UncleThursday]

MFC is a site that relies heavily on regulars or repeat tippers for a model to be successful.

I think this is something new models on MFC should be taught, probably by other models or some sort of info on the model page (if any) for MFC.

You may get lucky as a model, and have some random guy come in and drop 1000+ tokens on you one day. But if he never comes back, well, that's the last you'll see of him, and his tokens.

It's the regulars, who tip more often than randoms that keep MFC models afloat, more often than not. Especially once you get below the first few rows of models on the homepage. Even if those regulars aren't able to tip a ton, say 100-200 a week or sometimes even less, the fact that they're repeat tippers means that income comes in more frequently. And once a model has built up a stable of repeat tipping regulars, even if each tip isn't huge from them, she can find her goals reached more often than not on most days.

Not every model is going to be a 20k+ camscore model who shows up at the top of the page. Those girls are more likely to get random tippers because they're up there on the page. In some case, new premiums. But, they do also have their regulars. And in many cases, it's their regulars who helped them get to that high camscore.

Now, as to the topic of how long a model is 'obligated' to stay on cam after her goals have been reached? I think the other models have said it nicely with 'it depends on how the tipping is going.' If the tipping is continuing after the goals have been reached, then she can afford to stay on longer. If the tipping has stopped? I would say an hour is the max she'd probably want to stay on without losing too much in camscore. Probably less, though, unless she got some really nice tips in a short amount of time to reach her goals.

The only time I ever was truly pissed at a model and her goal was maybe a year and a half back. Topic was 1k to nude. Ok, fair enough. I helped get her there, as did a few others. She got nude. Then over the next 5 minutes earned 5k tokens between myself and others, one really big tipper in there tipped almost 3k himself. Then she got dressed and reset the countdown. Nowhere in her topic did she say there was a time limit for staying nude. And earning 5x as much as the topic in those few minutes is definitely a reason to keep going, I would think. And she was a fairly popular high camscore model at the time. After the countdown reset, I left and hid her. I have no idea if she still is even on the site.

Those sorts of tactics, as well as the girl mentioned in the OP, will only work for so long; unless her stable of regs decides they like that sort of thing. Otherwise, people who might be repeat regular tippers will decide that particular model isn't worth it, and never come back.

 

[Kunra9]

I apologize for my atrocious use of the word atrocity.

 

[Kunra9]

Interesting. So I just got home a bit ago, logged into MFC. her room had been the last one I visited this morning and it wasn't showing on my history.

And running a quick search I can't find the account.

I wonder if she deleted her account because after the debacle (is that ok?) this morning, one guy started calling for everyone to 1-star her profile and leave comments to warn others. And ofcourse everyone followed Spartacus and did just that.

 

[zylog19]

I'm pretty sure I saw the same show. According to mycamgirl.net, she's been a "new model" since October so she's probably not that dedicated to this job as a regular source of income.

 

[PlayboyMegan]

My show durations depend on how long it takes me to get to the show.
If it takes me 4hours to get a 3,000tkn show, I'll put it on for 10min. Reason being, that I feel like a longer show is not really deserved since I had to pull teeth to get it and the fact that if it took that long I'm probably ready to cry over my CS and barely horny.
If it takes 20min. to reach the same goal, I'll do a 40min. show as long as a few tips are still flying.
I think what that model did was unfair. We don't have "rules" but it's just a matter of being a decent person, IMO.
It's funny because I sit so far away from the cam to show my whole body all day, that when I do get my face close, some guys say, "wow, I didn't know you were so pretty. You are always too far away to tell." It's definitely a compliment, but goes to show you, that you can't please everyone. Because at that same time, another guy will say, "BB, show body." Ummmm I just did that for 4hours. Mmmkthnx

 

[Evvie]

Interesting. So I just got home a bit ago, logged into MFC. her room had been the last one I visited this morning and it wasn't showing on my history.

And running a quick search I can't find the account.

I wonder if she deleted her account because after the debacle (is that ok?) this morning, one guy started calling for everyone to 1-star her profile and leave comments to warn others. And ofcourse everyone followed Spartacus and did just that.

She may have just changed her username. If she is still earning good money, there would have been no reason for her to close her account.

MFC is a site that relies heavily on regulars or repeat tippers for a model to be successful.

I think this is something new models on MFC should be taught, probably by other models or some sort of info on the model page (if any) for MFC.

I think new MFC models should not sign up on the site, nor start broadcasting, without a working understanding of how the website works.

The majority of webcam models do not do this as a hobby or for fun. The majority of us are career cam models or at least doing it seriously to support ourselves. I would be surprised if any professional started working on any job or at any company without at least spending an hour or two trying to figure out how that business works or how they are expected to behave. Likewise, cam models should not start working on a site without spending at least like half a day doing research on it and figuring out how things work there.

A formal education plan is not necessary. It is not difficult for new models to figure out "how things work" on MFC, but some models are not interested in educating themselves, and some models play the system to take advantage of members.

 

[curvyredhead]

I think new MFC models should not sign up on the site, nor start broadcasting, without a working understanding of how the website works.

WORDDDDDDDDDD


Also--In order to really answer this question, ya gotta take a look at what the goal was for.

In the case of topless I completely agree that a flash does not equal Topless.

In the case of a cum show.....should the girl have to hang out for 20+ min after she cums? eh I personally do not think so. Esp if it took her a day and half to reach goal.
She has certainly performed the show...and with the assumption it was not a 2min "omg I am there moment"

 

[AmberCutie]

Many times I'll let people know that if we get a countdown done faster, it will leave more time for the actual show. It's less of a mystery now to most people that CamScore is a result of tokens per hour. So if we take an hour to get a countdown done, it makes us cringe to think of spending another hour doing said show with likely not very many tokens coming in during the show. (Unless the goal accounted for 2 hours worth of the girl's hourly token average.)

It sorta sucks we have to think about it on a timed basis like that, but such is life on MFC.

In the OP situation, it does seem pretty unfair that such high topless/naked goals aren't rewarded with at least a better view, if not for a few minutes longer. Bad business will bite her in the ass in the end, so to speak. There's no set time a girl is obligated to perform for, but having some common business sense would tell her that just a flash after 2000 tokens isn't smart.

 

[Just Me]

I apologize for my atrocious use of the word atrocity.

If atrocious is acceptable to say, then atrocity is by definition acceptable as well. Your use of the word was correct. I think some just think it is a word reserved for worse transgressions. :twocents-02cents:

 

[mynameisbob84]

I once saw a model do the following:

Start an hour timer and a token goal. As soon as the token goal was hit, she'd start the show and the show wouldn't finish until the hour was up. So if the token goal was met in ten minutes, the tippers had themselves a fifty minute show. If it took fifty minutes to reach the goal, the show would only last ten minutes.

I don't know what the CS ramifications of such a countdown would be but I thought it was a pretty awesome idea. It encourages people to tip as the faster the countdown is met, the longer the show is. And if it takes longer than the model would hope to reach the countdown, then at least she doesn't have to do a long show. Plus, nobody can complain because she's being completely transparent with what she's doing.

 

[DudeExtreme]

My show durations depend on how long it takes me to get to the show.
If it takes me 4hours to get a 3,000tkn show, I'll put it on for 10min. Reason being, that I feel like a longer show is not really deserved since I had to pull teeth to get it and the fact that if it took that long I'm probably ready to cry over my CS and barely horny.
If it takes 20min. to reach the same goal, I'll do a 40min. show as long as a few tips are still flying.
I think what that model did was unfair. We don't have "rules" but it's just a matter of being a decent person, IMO.
It's funny because I sit so far away from the cam to show my whole body all day, that when I do get my face close, some guys say, "wow, I didn't know you were so pretty. You are always too far away to tell." It's definitely a compliment, but goes to show you, that you can't please everyone. Because at that same time, another guy will say, "BB, show body." Ummmm I just did that for 4hours. Mmmkthnx

It's hard for me to see you struggling. You are a wonderful person who always deserve the best tips from the guys. That's when I wish I could take you out of there and do a skype. Whether you are close up or showing the whole body shouldn't matter too much. You are still very beautiful. I personally like the close ups because you do something with your eyes or lips that makes me smile, and seeing that much beauty for that second, I know everything's going to okay in life.

 

[UncleThursday]

My show durations depend on how long it takes me to get to the show.
If it takes me 4hours to get a 3,000tkn show, I'll put it on for 10min. Reason being, that I feel like a longer show is not really deserved since I had to pull teeth to get it and the fact that if it took that long I'm probably ready to cry over my CS and barely horny.
If it takes 20min. to reach the same goal, I'll do a 40min. show as long as a few tips are still flying.
I think what that model did was unfair. We don't have "rules" but it's just a matter of being a decent person, IMO.
It's funny because I sit so far away from the cam to show my whole body all day, that when I do get my face close, some guys say, "wow, I didn't know you were so pretty. You are always too far away to tell." It's definitely a compliment, but goes to show you, that you can't please everyone. Because at that same time, another guy will say, "BB, show body." Ummmm I just did that for 4hours. Mmmkthnx

It's hard for me to see you struggling. You are a wonderful person who always deserve the best tips from the guys. That's when I wish I could take you out of there and do a skype. Whether you are close up or showing the whole body shouldn't matter too much. You are still very beautiful. I personally like the close ups because you do something with your eyes or lips that makes me smile, and seeing that much beauty for that second, I know everything's going to okay in life.

Every model sees slow days, though. As I've mentioned before, there was one day Megan did a 12 hour Megathon, and for the first hour and a half I was literally the only person tipping (she had a private in there, though). And she was playing the spell Megan game to win videos and other such, so you'd think at least one other person would have been tipping. I ended up clearing 3/4 of the board or more. And when I sent an 'I'm off to work' tip, I accidentally got rid of another letter. To which she then said in PM: Good. They aren't playing, anyway. They don't deserve it.

It happens to every model, though. Some days are just better than others, and some days seem to be super slow compared to normal. So models need to be ready to take the good with the bad and roll with the punches on any given day.

 

[DudeExtreme]

My show durations depend on how long it takes me to get to the show.
If it takes me 4hours to get a 3,000tkn show, I'll put it on for 10min. Reason being, that I feel like a longer show is not really deserved since I had to pull teeth to get it and the fact that if it took that long I'm probably ready to cry over my CS and barely horny.
If it takes 20min. to reach the same goal, I'll do a 40min. show as long as a few tips are still flying.
I think what that model did was unfair. We don't have "rules" but it's just a matter of being a decent person, IMO.
It's funny because I sit so far away from the cam to show my whole body all day, that when I do get my face close, some guys say, "wow, I didn't know you were so pretty. You are always too far away to tell." It's definitely a compliment, but goes to show you, that you can't please everyone. Because at that same time, another guy will say, "BB, show body." Ummmm I just did that for 4hours. Mmmkthnx

It's hard for me to see you struggling. You are a wonderful person who always deserve the best tips from the guys. That's when I wish I could take you out of there and do a skype. Whether you are close up or showing the whole body shouldn't matter too much. You are still very beautiful. I personally like the close ups because you do something with your eyes or lips that makes me smile, and seeing that much beauty for that second, I know everything's going to okay in life.

Every model sees slow days, though. As I've mentioned before, there was one day Megan did a 12 hour Megathon, and for the first hour and a half I was literally the only person tipping (she had a private in there, though). And she was playing the spell Megan game to win videos and other such, so you'd think at least one other person would have been tipping. I ended up clearing 3/4 of the board or more. And when I sent an 'I'm off to work' tip, I accidentally got rid of another letter. To which she then said in PM: Good. They aren't playing, anyway. They don't deserve it.

It happens to every model, though. Some days are just better than others, and some days seem to be super slow compared to normal. So models need to be ready to take the good with the bad and roll with the punches on any given day.

I understand there are up and down days. It is still not easy for me to witness as a member especially if it had been a rough week for the model.

 

[Keithy]

Many times I'll let people know that if we get a countdown done faster, it will leave more time for the actual show. It's less of a mystery now to most people that CamScore is a result of tokens per hour. So if we take an hour to get a countdown done, it makes us cringe to think of spending another hour doing said show with likely not very many tokens coming in during the show. (Unless the goal accounted for 2 hours worth of the girl's hourly token average.)

It sorta sucks we have to think about it on a timed basis like that, but such is life on MFC.

In the OP situation, it does seem pretty unfair that such high topless/naked goals aren't rewarded with at least a better view, if not for a few minutes longer. Bad business will bite her in the ass in the end, so to speak. There's no set time a girl is obligated to perform for, but having some common business sense would tell her that just a flash after 2000 tokens isn't smart.

More than just life on MFC, that's business. I mean when I'm working on a project, I have to think how much money it will cost for supplies, then how much time it will cost. Time is money. More time means cost goes up. That's just how things work. It's super important for models, and anyone wanting to start a business (or hobby business) to understand this.

General Topic Reply below

On MFC you want to price yourself what you're worth and then convince people you're worth it. The better you are at showing the customers you're worth that money, by fulfilling that time obligation and delivering what you promise, the more likely you are to see a return visit.
Of course there is an obligation to stay, but it's a social obligation. Your reputation and future earnings depend on it. From the sounds of it, this model won't see people wanting to return. Breaking a social obligation on MFC has consequences similar to a friendship. If you ditch your friends, break promises, etc. you won't see them calling you up. The difference here is that those people are your income. I'm doubtful that the people willing to spend a lot of money on a model are the people that just want to see some boobs. They want an interesting, beautiful woman to entertain them and give them an intimate investing.

Just a note: serious mode me isn't 100% yet since the car accident what with pain killers and muscle relaxers, so please keep that in mind when reading.

 

[UncleThursday]

I understand there are up and down days. It is still not easy for me to witness as a member especially if it had been a rough week for the model.

Just remember, though, it's not your responsibility to ensure she makes her goals, or to feel bad if she doesn't make her goals. In the end, it's the model's responsibility to do what she can to make her goals. If that's offer a public show, sell videos, be in private or group for most of her time on cam, or whatnot, it's up to her to work the room to make her goals. It's still a job, just not an hourly wage job or salary job. Each model eventually learns what will most often bring in the tokens. It doesn't always work, but they know after a while what things they can do to get tokens most of the time.

If you're a regular repeat tipper to a model, she's not going to really care if you have a week or so a month when you really can't give like you would want to. Or she shouldn't care, anyway. Most models are going to understand that not everyone has the extra money every day. My favorites know I don't make a lot, so my tipping can be infrequent. Everyone knows the economy is bad right now, all over the world. Having extra money for luxury spending (and let's face it, to the members, MFC/other cam sites is luxury spending) isn't going to always be there. Sure, for many models, it's their only source of income, but I'm pretty sure they know they can't expect one person to suport them. That's why they want to build up their stable of regulars. Even if each regular can't always tip/group/private, they know their regulars will be the ones to do so when they can, as opposed to randoms coming and going from the rooms. Random tips help, obviously, but they can't be counted on to happen repeatedly.

Megan, Amber, JJ, Luna, etc. all know what they can do to bring in the income. They also all know it won't always be assured. But it's their responsibility to work their rooms to get their income. And they all know it.

 

[Nordling]

I see nothing wrong with feeling bad if a model you like isn't doing well--on a night, a week or a month--or even in general.

Just because it's a "business," it doesn't remove the human element from either model or member, and "business" isn't something we're born with. Yes, it can be taken to absurd extremes, but I'm with MegansDude here. If I thought models were simply performing robots and didn't give a shit about anything but the "business model" or some other buzz word, I'd lose most of the joy of entering cam chats.

 

[UncleThursday]

I see nothing wrong with feeling bad if a model you like isn't doing well--on a night, a week or a month--or even in general.

Just because it's a "business," it doesn't remove the human element from either model or member, and "business" isn't something we're born with. Yes, it can be taken to absurd extremes, but I'm with MegansDude here. If I thought models were simply performing robots and didn't give a shit about anything but the "business model" or some other buzz word, I'd lose most of the joy of entering cam chats.

I'm not saying don't feel anything. But I am saying don't get it all in your head when a favorite isn't doing well on a given day/week/month to the point where it weighs on you and you consider spending money you don't have to help her out. There's the normal empathy you should have, then there's being probably a little too involved. And to some that line can be hard to see for themselves.

 

[DudeExtreme]

I understand there are up and down days. It is still not easy for me to witness as a member especially if it had been a rough week for the model.

Just remember, though, it's not your responsibility to ensure she makes her goals, or to feel bad if she doesn't make her goals. In the end, it's the model's responsibility to do what she can to make her goals. If that's offer a public show, sell videos, be in private or group for most of her time on cam, or whatnot, it's up to her to work the room to make her goals. It's still a job, just not an hourly wage job or salary job. Each model eventually learns what will most often bring in the tokens. It doesn't always work, but they know after a while what things they can do to get tokens most of the time.

If you're a regular repeat tipper to a model, she's not going to really care if you have a week or so a month when you really can't give like you would want to. Or she shouldn't care, anyway. Most models are going to understand that not everyone has the extra money every day. My favorites know I don't make a lot, so my tipping can be infrequent. Everyone knows the economy is bad right now, all over the world. Having extra money for luxury spending (and let's face it, to the members, MFC/other cam sites is luxury spending) isn't going to always be there. Sure, for many models, it's their only source of income, but I'm pretty sure they know they can't expect one person to suport them. That's why they want to build up their stable of regulars. Even if each regular can't always tip/group/private, they know their regulars will be the ones to do so when they can, as opposed to randoms coming and going from the rooms. Random tips help, obviously, but they can't be counted on to happen repeatedly.

Megan, Amber, JJ, Luna, etc. all know what they can do to bring in the income. They also all know it won't always be assured. But it's their responsibility to work their rooms to get their income. And they all know it.

Thanks for the advice. I never did say that it was my responsibility. If I feel bad because Megan's feel bad. it's okay.