Why I no longer tip - one member's experience

[nancy_raygun]

I think reading this has made me realize how selfish people get OR that I'm really too nice of a person. It is understood that you can watch models for free on MFC, that's what the F stands for. There are a ton of arguments as to why people don't/won't tip and honestly, I find them all to be disgusting.

The model is running a business and they are selling a service. Don't forget that.

I feel like cam models get a lot of crap for what they do and people don't consider it a 'real' job. It's definitely a real job and it's just as challenging as a 'normal' job. Freeloaders tend to forget this.

I stopped buying tokens, not out of concern for personal finances, but because so much of what I originally was spending money for had become free.

Members tip a model because they like her and they want to see her perform. I imagine myself on cam, doing a countdown towards an oil show and when I hit the goal I say, "Okay guys, thanks for the tips. Imma go take a nap and have my friend over here do the work for me." That wouldn't fly with my regulars. There's a reason why they have been in my room for 2+ hours and there's a reason why they're tipping ME instead of watching someone who may already be doing a show.

I feel this is the core issue that fuels the concerns I've seen on this forum of reduced earnings and the proliferation of freeloaders. I would liken it to a paradigm where one goes grocery shopping and everything in the store is free; the store accepts donations from its patrons but requires no payments. How many of you, models included, would donate the amount commiserate with the groceries you took rather than simply taking what you need and allocating those funds to an activity that doesn't give you the option of enjoying it for free?

Fuck yeah, I would donate the fuck out of that grocery store. Like I said, I may be too nice and I have a tendency to just give stuff to people. (As it stands, my wardrobe is pretty nil since I have a habit of donating clothes that I know I don't/ won't wear.) There's plenty of people out there like me who are absolutely willing to shell over some money to help people/charities/ etc. I think in the current state of a lot of people's finances though, more people are less willing to give and while part of me understands, the other part thinks that entire thing is sad when someone refuses to shell over one measly dollar if they have the means to do so.

Rather than condemn freeloaders I think the models on this site should condemn those amongst them who offer free shows that disincentivize members from paying for content.

I think the models can handle freeloaders themselves in their own way. We models are smart and creative and even though there are times when we want to throw our computers out the window and cry, we're pretty resilient too.

Some models don't mind freeloaders as long as people are tipping. Some models prefer that if you're going to freeload, do it in guest mode and do it quietly. Some models effing' hate freeloaders and wish they would all die in a fire.

Some models are A-OK with doing a free show. Some models prefer to do stuff in pvt or even group. Some models will go to town on their pussy in public chat and people will make it rain on that bitch OR it will be dead silent because no one is tipping and everyone is pulling a jerk-n-go.


Lastly, I'm going to throw in what could be a very unpopular opinion of mine. Some of MFC's rules are just trivial. I think I remember a discussion in either ACF or another forum I check out about how some of the rules are just to cover MFC's behind.

I know that Streamate has a rule against nudity in free chat, but I've lurked there a lot and saw about 5 gals on the front page either chillin' in the buff or just wearing panties but flashing their pink bits when someone tipped. They weren't busted for it.

Of course, I'm not saying that if everyone is doing it you should too.


In closing, I think it's totally okay to condemn freeloaders that refuse to tip because that's just some BS.

 

[NyGuy]

"Ma! I did not eat the last two cookies! That was a fictional allegory!"





:roll:




* what's a "non-fictional" allegory?

A story being used to illustrate a larger point where the story is true.

Was that a joke or do you not understand the concept?

Yeah, it was a joke, but it points out that YOU do not understand that ALL allegories are fictional. They may be used to represent something non-fictional, but an allegory or metaphor, by their very structure, have to be fictional.

That's not true. It is simply a device, it doesn't need to be fictional. Most are but a true story can serve as an allegory for something else. I can appropriate a true story as part of a greater work where it's inclusion has a greater purpose.

 

[JoleneBrody]

So lemme get this straight.
You started a thread with a very detailed description of how you perv and why you don't tip like a decent human being.
You then argued with those who pointed out the flaws in your reasoning.
You then got called a douche for being douchey.
You then got emotional and defensive about being called a douche.
You then expected everyone to know that your detailed description of yourself without any questions posed was false and intended to start a discussion about economics but your still hurt that your fictional self was called a douche.

............

I second Frankie.
I'm not sure if I should applaud your troll skills or cry at the demise of human civilization.


Edit: The rest of this is directed at everyone else, not OP since he's obviously a troll and honestly, not a bad one at that.

I'm with Nancy on the grocery store. I would donate to them for sure because I love what they are doing and want them to continue providing this service.
I have a free zoo locally that rescues injured animals and gives them a place to live out the rest of their lives. They have a little box in the entry and its asked that you donate $5 dollars per family to enter the small zoo and enjoy the animals. No one stands at the door and no one enforces the donation. I always drop in at least $10 when I go.
Any person who can enter that zoo, not donate and go home with a clear conscience make me VERY concerned for the future of mankind.

On the case of the magical keys. It's one thing to be ignorant about how your actions will negatively affect others, it's another thing to continue to be selfish with full knowledge. That's called being a bad person.

 

[BetsyBooty]

To your point, I am not actually receiving a service. You point about restaurants is a good one, but still, the waiter is providing ME a service in that case whereas on MFC, the model isn't providing a service to any particular member and the concept of reciprocity, the backbone of the argument for tipping in restaurants, does not apply. The model will do what she's doing regardless of whether or not I am in the room, thus there is no element of reciprocity...[In] an environment where goods are being given a way for free, the rational action is to accept the free good.

Prior to cam-viewing (I'm going to suppose) you have trapped semen. Viewing a cam helps pleasurably expel that semen. This is the service provided. The notion that the service is not being provided to you, but simply exists regardless of your consuming it or not is a classic illustration of the free rider problem.

Each camgirl has her own business model, but I do not know of any who declare their services to be free, without expectation of payment from anyone at any time. So, unlike your hypothetical shiny vehicle, the camgirl never presents herself as a free good, inviting anyone to partake without charge. Some camgirls' business models involve payment from only those who volunteer it, but the show is indeed a paid show. Those who watch without paying have arguably acted in rational self-interest, but only in a short term--you might say small-minded--way.


"A free rider is someone who enjoys the benefits of an activity without paying for it. The free rider may withhold effort or resources, or may impose the costs of his or her activities on others. One consequence of free riding is the excessive use of a common property resource: because people do not take into account the impacts of their actions on others, they take too much from the common pool." from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_rider_problem)


If the common resource is a camgirl, she will become depleted if everyone using her service adopts the rationale of the free rider. Semen cannot then be expelled in aforementioned pleasurable manner. Free riders may perceive themselves as rationally, harmlessly consuming a free service, but in fact they are shifting the burden of payment away from themselves onto others, and if such 'rational' behavior was universally adopted, the service would cease to exist. At best a freeloader bets others will pay for the service he enjoys; at worst he destroys that service.

Oh, and my econ degree is merely allegorical.

 

[LadyLuna]

To your point, I am not actually receiving a service.[/b[ You point about restaurants is a good one, but still, the waiter is providing ME a service in that case whereas on MFC, the model isn't providing a service to any particular member and the concept of reciprocity, the backbone of the argument for tipping in restaurants, does not apply. The model will do what she's doing regardless of whether or not I am in the room, thus there is no element of reciprocity.

Have you ever been in a room where the model has 2 viewers? She's not doing very much, is she?

The model starts the show once she's gotten paid. If all those freeloaders would chip in 5 tokens to see the show they want, it would happen a lot faster.

I reiterate, I didn't make this post to justify freeloading. I did so to point out that freeloaders aren't the problem, giving away a good for free is. If no models did public shows, there would be no freeloaders and, in an environment where goods are being given a way for free, the rational action is to accept the free good and allocate those funds to goods that cannot be obtained for free.

FALSE. People were begging for free stuff long before the public shows started. I've worked on Streamate since before they added a tip feature. People were begging for things in public chat even though models didn't give it to them, and the rare model that did give it to them was booted post-haste.

Of course, now that there is a tip feature, admin has a lot more difficulty figuring out who is giving something away for free, and who is not. But before the tip feature, it was easy. They will still ban models who are caught, but it's getting harder to catch the models.

 

[LolasLiger]

Seriously guys? You don't see our old trollish friend Maniac behind this? The same modus operandi? Rejoin the forum within a day of being banned, start a thread where he berates himself and sounds all apologetic (but with a clear message to the models/members about how they are doing something wrong) and then proceeds to berate other members and models for their views, each post becoming more and abusive.

 

[NyGuy]

So lemme get this straight.


Edit: The rest of this is directed at everyone else, not OP since he's obviously a troll and honestly, not a bad one at that.

I'm with Nancy on the grocery store. I would donate to them for sure because I love what they are doing and want them to continue providing this service.
I have a free zoo locally that rescues injured animals and gives them a place to live out the rest of their lives. They have a little box in the entry and its asked that you donate $5 dollars per family to enter the small zoo and enjoy the animals. No one stands at the door and no one enforces the donation. I always drop in at least $10 when I go.
Any person who can enter that zoo, not donate and go home with a clear conscience make me VERY concerned for the future of mankind.

On the case of the magical keys. It's one thing to be ignorant about how your actions will negatively affect others, it's another thing to continue to be selfish with full knowledge. That's called being a bad person.

I know that wasn't directed at me but that was actually the exact type of discussion I was hoping to have. I think it's interesting to view the free loader issue in the context of hypotheticals like that, hence why I proposed them. I'm admittedly exhausted by this thread though so I'll let you ladies / gents carry on. It's nice to see that after 6 hours of name calling people are starting to think about the underlying issues.

 

[NyGuy]

To your point, I am not actually receiving a service. You point about restaurants is a good one, but still, the waiter is providing ME a service in that case whereas on MFC, the model isn't providing a service to any particular member and the concept of reciprocity, the backbone of the argument for tipping in restaurants, does not apply. The model will do what she's doing regardless of whether or not I am in the room, thus there is no element of reciprocity...[In] an environment where goods are being given a way for free, the rational action is to accept the free good.

Prior to cam-viewing (I'm going to suppose) you have trapped semen. Viewing a cam helps pleasurably expel that semen. This is the service provided. The notion that the service is not being provided to you, but simply exists regardless of your consuming it or not is a classic illustration of the free rider problem.

Each camgirl has her own business model, but I do not know of any who declare their services to be free, without expectation of payment from anyone at any time. So, unlike your hypothetical shiny vehicle, the camgirl never presents herself as a free good, inviting anyone to partake without charge. Some camgirls' business models involve payment from only those who volunteer it, but the show is indeed a paid show. Those who watch without paying have arguably acted in rational self-interest, but only in a short term--you might say small-minded--way.


"A free rider is someone who enjoys the benefits of an activity without paying for it. The free rider may withhold effort or resources, or may impose the costs of his or her activities on others. One consequence of free riding is the excessive use of a common property resource: because people do not take into account the impacts of their actions on others, they take too much from the common pool." from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_rider_problem)


If the common resource is a camgirl, she will become depleted if everyone using her service adopts the rationale of the free rider. Semen cannot then be expelled in aforementioned pleasurable manner. Free riders may perceive themselves as rationally, harmlessly consuming a free service, but in fact they are shifting the burden of payment away from themselves onto others, and if such 'rational' behavior was universally adopted, the service would cease to exist. At best a freeloader bets others will pay for the service he enjoys; at worst he destroys that service.

Oh, and my econ degree is merely allegorical.

Again, great post and I appreciate your taking the time to write it up. I would've happily debated it with you a few hours ago but it's time for me to get ready for bed.

 

[JoleneBrody]

So lemme get this straight.


Edit: The rest of this is directed at everyone else, not OP since he's obviously a troll and honestly, not a bad one at that.

I'm with Nancy on the grocery store. I would donate to them for sure because I love what they are doing and want them to continue providing this service.
I have a free zoo locally that rescues injured animals and gives them a place to live out the rest of their lives. They have a little box in the entry and its asked that you donate $5 dollars per family to enter the small zoo and enjoy the animals. No one stands at the door and no one enforces the donation. I always drop in at least $10 when I go.
Any person who can enter that zoo, not donate and go home with a clear conscience make me VERY concerned for the future of mankind.

On the case of the magical keys. It's one thing to be ignorant about how your actions will negatively affect others, it's another thing to continue to be selfish with full knowledge. That's called being a bad person.

I know that wasn't directed at me but that was actually the exact type of discussion I was hoping to have. I think it's interesting to view the free loader issue in the context of hypotheticals like that, hence why I proposed them. I'm admittedly exhausted by this thread though so I'll let you ladies / gents carry on. It's nice to see that after 6 hours of name calling people are starting to think about the underlying issues.

I hate you. If we were in the same room right now I would probably punch you in the ear. Just thought I would share.

 

[NyGuy]

\
I hate you. If we were in the same room right now I would probably punch you in the ear. Just thought I would share.

huh?

 

[BetsyBooty]

Oh dear. I did not intend to please him.

 

[JickyJuly]

So lemme get this straight.


Edit: The rest of this is directed at everyone else, not OP since he's obviously a troll and honestly, not a bad one at that.

I'm with Nancy on the grocery store. I would donate to them for sure because I love what they are doing and want them to continue providing this service.
I have a free zoo locally that rescues injured animals and gives them a place to live out the rest of their lives. They have a little box in the entry and its asked that you donate $5 dollars per family to enter the small zoo and enjoy the animals. No one stands at the door and no one enforces the donation. I always drop in at least $10 when I go.
Any person who can enter that zoo, not donate and go home with a clear conscience make me VERY concerned for the future of mankind.

On the case of the magical keys. It's one thing to be ignorant about how your actions will negatively affect others, it's another thing to continue to be selfish with full knowledge. That's called being a bad person.

I know that wasn't directed at me but that was actually the exact type of discussion I was hoping to have. I think it's interesting to view the free loader issue in the context of hypotheticals like that, hence why I proposed them. I'm admittedly exhausted by this thread though so I'll let you ladies / gents carry on. It's nice to see that after 6 hours of name calling people are starting to think about the underlying issues.

I hate you. If we were in the same room right now I would probably punch you in the ear. Just thought I would share.

Jolene, if causing a pregnant woman to laugh ice cream out her face holes is on your bucket list, cross it off. :lol:

 

[Nordling]

Seriously guys? You don't see our old trollish friend Maniac behind this? The same modus operandi? Rejoin the forum within a day of being banned, start a thread where he berates himself and sounds all apologetic (but with a clear message to the models/members about how they are doing something wrong) and then proceeds to berate other members and models for their views, each post becoming more and abusive.

Exactly. Also known as Hornygods.

 

[nancy_raygun]

So lemme get this straight.


Edit: The rest of this is directed at everyone else, not OP since he's obviously a troll and honestly, not a bad one at that.

I'm with Nancy on the grocery store. I would donate to them for sure because I love what they are doing and want them to continue providing this service.
I have a free zoo locally that rescues injured animals and gives them a place to live out the rest of their lives. They have a little box in the entry and its asked that you donate $5 dollars per family to enter the small zoo and enjoy the animals. No one stands at the door and no one enforces the donation. I always drop in at least $10 when I go.
Any person who can enter that zoo, not donate and go home with a clear conscience make me VERY concerned for the future of mankind.

On the case of the magical keys. It's one thing to be ignorant about how your actions will negatively affect others, it's another thing to continue to be selfish with full knowledge. That's called being a bad person.

I know that wasn't directed at me but that was actually the exact type of discussion I was hoping to have. I think it's interesting to view the free loader issue in the context of hypotheticals like that, hence why I proposed them. I'm admittedly exhausted by this thread though so I'll let you ladies / gents carry on. It's nice to see that after 6 hours of name calling people are starting to think about the underlying issues.

I hate you. If we were in the same room right now I would probably punch you in the ear. Just thought I would share.

Speaking of paying for services...


.. I would totally pay to see that!

 

[AmberCutie]

I can't really tell what the FRAK this whole thing was about, if it's a troll, if it's Maniac or hornygods, or WHAT...

... but I will say this. We've heard the argument before that "it's the models who give public shows faults that freeloaders are so abundant yadda yadda." But in every instance, there is no solution mentioned. We are not going to bust out our sticks and markers and poster board and picket/strike to get this fixed, because we are too busy trying to make a living for ourselves.

So in the end, sure if less models did public shows, there would be more reason for people to pay for private/group, but there really is no easy way to make that happen. The only easy way would be if the admins made it happen (which is doubtful, since the site is madly successful just as it is right now).

My recommendation to the OP (even though the story is... made up? :liar: :liar: ) is to not point out that you are not planning to tip anymore, and stick to the girls who you've already spent SOOOO much of your money on for the future of your freeloading (bud do it as a guest, because I guarantee, she won't appreciate the "but bb I spent 1000's on you last year, I deserve it free from now on" line), or find someone you're interested in watching and take her private like you seemed to enjoy so much once upon a time. If finances are no issue, then showing a little appreciation to the performer you enjoy watching really is no skin off your nose, right?

By the way, in 2011 there were already TONS of public shows going on. They started being abundant back in 2010, so not much has really changed since you started your membership at MFC.

Would you tip a musician if you enjoyed their 2 hour set while hanging out at a club or restaurant? I would certainly hope so since they're putting their heart into their work and taking time out of their day to entertain you. It's called morals, baby. Sure, you're not obligated to tip but giving a model even a small tip is a good gesture to show them that you enjoyed and appreciated their hard work & time.

I make a reference to music/bands performing quite often when discussing why tipping is appropriate even if you don't *have* to, and why tipping a person/performer even if they make more money than you is still acceptable. :thumbleft:

 

[SoTxBob]

I have a free zoo locally that rescues injured animals and gives them a place to live out the rest of their lives. They have a little box in the entry and its asked that you donate $5 dollars per family to enter the small zoo and enjoy the animals. No one stands at the door and no one enforces the donation. I always drop in at least $10 when I go.
Any person who can enter that zoo, not donate and go home with a clear conscience make me VERY concerned for the future of mankind.

Be concerned JJ.. Be Very concerned... Here that box would have to be made of steel, padlocked shut and welded to something to prevent it being taken. :?

 

[Poker_Babe]

Sound like someone who (as it was suggested to me when I first started posting here) should "Lurk Moar".
Here's a good place to start:
Tips for premium MFC members (how to be great!)

Oh and all I ask from premium members who are hanging out in my room, but can't contribute towards the count down right now, is that you at least participate in the conversation in my chat room if it's dead. A dead chat room is awful. But I find that if there is a good conversation going, it tends hold more and more premiums in my room, because it's more entertaining. The more premiums in a chat room, the better chances a model has of getting tipped.

Just my :twocents-02cents:

 

[loveyougipsy]

Another analogy that just occurred to me. "Shareware." In the original concept, shareware was a deal where you acquired software for free and tried it out, if you found it useful, you voluntarily paid for it, if not, you deleted it from your computer. If you found it useful and continued to use it without paying, you were a douche.

Thus, if you enjoy your time spent in a cam model's room but don't even tip her belly button lint, you sir, are a douche.

That's actually a great example that gets right to the heart of what I'm arguing. Do companies still give their software away for free or did that prove to be an unsustainable business model?

There is a rise in companies giving software away for free. Look at the iPhone, Android market and the number of free to play browser games. You can have the game for free, the hope is you'll pay to remove the ads, or for many you'll make micro-payments (eg tip) for extra things that you don't get in the free main game.
UbiSoft have seen the hurt from declining sales of PC games and I think their next release will be free for the main game, with the ability to pay for extras. They blamed gamers being a bunch of Pirates and to be honest I agree with them. Working in IT I know the biggest bunch of pirates certainly used to be the people making a living from it. Why? we had the technology, knowledge and access. The developers in the software houses would give copies to other friends in IT months before release, they'd then give them to other people.

For the government/phone analogy, what you overlooked isn't that the government collects the taxes, the government created a law that states some types of phones are not allowed, but then doesn't enforce the law and prosecute because it's making money from taxes on the phones that are illegal to sell.

I don't know about the US, but the economic situation of 'race to the bottom' seems to be the main economic model in the UK. People want more and more for less. Some companies are being very profitable entering at the bottom of the market, other previously premium brands are diluting their products, quality and brands due to a decline of people buying the quality items and buying the cheapest.

I point the fingers for the 'race to the bottom' on the buyers more than the manufacturers. They'd rather have cheap junk now, rather than save a bit and get the high quality version. For phones and tablets especially, the cloners in China saw this and flood the market with cheap and nasty junk.
The result, the buyer gets a very poor experience and are unsatisfied and don't see what the fuss is, but there are always people to replace them buying the junk. There is only so long the premium manufacturers can hold out, because any sales, even lower prices ones are better than none.

 

[AllisonWilder]

There is only so long the premium manufacturers can hold out, because any sales, even lower prices ones are better than none.

In this case models would be the premium manufacturer and you make it sound like there's only so long we can hold out. That's not true, at least not the way I see it. When push comes to shove models won't just say 'Well, nobody is paying for groups or privates anymore so I'll just give it away for free.' They'll say, 'Well, nobody is paying for groups or privates anymore so I'm heading to a new site where nudity isn't allowed unless you're in paid chat. It's been fun. Kthnxbai!'

 

[nzhere]

I would venture to point out the obvious and say that BOTH freeloading members and models who rely on public shows are to blame for this. The fact that a model is using public shows doesn't undo the fact that you're freeloading if you enjoy the show without throwing a few tokens. I'm not sure why personal responsibility is so lacking in our world, but few things are as unattractive as people making excuses. If you're against the rise in public shows, don't watch them. You can't really point out that the shows are killing mfc while you hold your dick in your hand and sit on your wallet.

Is the solution .. MFC implementing a "Hide my show from those without tokens" function ?

 

[Jupiter551]

Is the solution .. MFC implementing a "Hide my show from those without tokens" function ?

I don't think so because that would serve to alienate regulars and/or past and future tippers who just don't happen to have tokens today.
There are models who would argue that if you don't have tokens how dare you even log on, but the reality of a relationship with a valued customer isn't quite as black & white.

 

[BabyGirlRed]

Well, this is quite an interesting thread. What I have to say will most likely be viewed as negative by a large amount of you folks, but I personally don't care. All of our opinions will differ.

I think I might just be on OP's side on this one. I think I understand where he's coming from.

Here's what I think:

Myfreecams.com is a site full of 'freeloaders'. It's a free site. That's how I discovered it. I wanted to find free, interactive porn. Is that a problem? Not at all. I freakin' love free stuff!
In the 'MFC Rules', it does indeed state that public masturbation is 'not allowed', yet a large amount of models are doing it. Like myself, for example.
I think what OP is getting at is that we have the choice to show all we got in public or not. Doing private and group shows are the best ways to avoid freeloaders. Problem is, there are hundreds of girls already naked and getting it on. So, I could make the decision to stay clothed in my room or nude without masturbation, and wait for private or group shows to get freaky. Will I get a lot of people in my room? Not that much. Will I be making a lot of tips? I don't think so. Now, why would that be? Possibly because the girl on the top of the front page has her twat in the camera with a hitachi on her clit in public chat.
How many freeloaders would I have in my room compared to hers? I'm not showing much, so it wouldn't be considered freeloading when I'm not giving anything, and I would only be masturbating in private or group, so it would be impossible for anyone to freeload.
Does the girl in the popular room have the right to bitch about freeloaders? Fuck no! It was her choice to get freaky on a site called 'myfreecams.com'.
I've been a freeloader on MFC. There are so many, simply because it's free. Nobody has to tip. Of course, it's a great thing to go. I am a model myself, and I do look forward to tips because I want to make some moolah. Do I bitch about freeloaders? Heck no. They all probably found the site the same way I did. Looking for something free.
OP was a tipper. I think that's great! Good on him for tipping. Now he doesn't tip. That doesn't bother me one bit.
Why pay for something when you can get it for free? Maybe I'm a douche. Maybe I'm a freeloader. Whatever. Fuck all the labels I've been seeing in this thread. I like OP and he can freeload in my room any time.

Telling this man that he should go check out recorded porn instead because it's free is, well, quite ridiculous if you ask me. It's just like MFC or any other sexual chat site. The models in the recorded videos are like the models on MFC. Either looking to make money, looking to have fun, or a bit of both. Me watching free porn on the internet of girls getting off is much like me watching a cam girl get off without tipping her. Both women worked hard to make some money. Both have fans that appreciate and will pay money for the service, and both have freeloaders sitting at a computer desk getting off with them.

My. Free. Mother. Fucking. Cams.
Free.
Problem? Shouldn't be! There's a reason why it's possible for people to get on MFC as a guest or basic.
As a 'freeloader' myself, I knew what I was getting into with MFC. I will try to sell myself as much as possible and attract regular customers, of course. I need the money. I don't get too upset with non-tippers, though. The folks that barge into my room with no tokens in horny caps lock mode obviously annoy me. But if someone comes into my room without tokens or chooses not to tip me and either keeps quiet or has a nice conversation with me, that's great!

I think that you were all focusing on the negativity too much in the original post. I can definitely see the positive.
I hope you all don't think I'm a 'douche' because of my opinion.

I'm going to finish this off with some pink words because happy, happy, joy, joy.

 

[RoxieRed]

I can completely understand NyGuy's presented viewpoint. The problem is that this viewpoint isn't nearly as logical as he and many other freeloaders would like to think. That is because they are missing the big picture that would put the "logic" to shame. Use the reasoning all you like, but it doesn't change the fact that this way of thinking is only going to be problematic for the model first, the other guys still paying out for the model's time second, and also yourself in the long run. It's short-term and selfish thinking. Sure you can find reasons and excuses but they don't hold up when you start looking deeper and more long-term.

It worries me that so many guys don't consider that they actually CAN'T get the same thing anywhere else for free. I don't give the same show any other model does. I don't even give the same strip show each time I do a striptease show. It's a unique experience from model to model and from show to show. If anyone thinks that the models and the shows they provide are easily interchangeable then they are missing the whole point of live cams and should probably just be wanking to some free clips on redtube or whatnot.

I've also really got to agree with the whole musician or entertainer scenario. It's just in bad taste to walk by a street performer and enjoy what they offer without throwing a few cents their way.

 

[IsabellaSnow]

Just out of curiosity, you say you haven't bought tokens since June, well why not? Why then? I see absolutely no difference in mfcs except for summer being pretty crap on cam.

Also these model's are NOT giving things out for free. They run a countdown, people tip for the countdown. Someone has paid for this show, you're just jumping on for the ride! If you have taken a certain amount of privates/spent a certain amount on certain girls, then freeload on their rooms, you having spent money on other girls doesn't make it ok for you to go into another girls room and wank off for free.

I like doing public shows, having a large amount of non tipping prems and guests/basics is very frustrating, and sometimes insulting. But I like that my regulars who usually tip can still have fun on non tipping days, and that people can contribute little bits. And if no one tips, no show! I also love doing private shows, for a member I'd think it'd be more about having one on one time being more intimate than just being able to see me play. Many though take me private because they have the tokens and can't be bothered to wait around for ages.

You've clearly made your mind up on this, you have the funds, you could tip us, you could help make the show even better and more fun, but you've obviously decided that you might as well stop spending the money as you can sit and wank for free. Why you felt the need to tell us this I'm not entirely sure, or even defend yourself on it.

I had a regular in my room, I helped him through some really tough times and he got a bit attached, he was never a very high tipper, but he'd drop a few thousand token tips a month, anyway, he decided not to come into my room as much for a bit because of how he felt. When he started talking to me again and coming back into my room, he didn't tip. This upset me, all it'd have taken would have been 20 tokens to say hello. I asked if his financial situation had changed/was ok, he said it was just the same. Eventually I pointed out that it'd upset me, that I didn't mind about big tipping, but not even giving back a little bit. He started tipping again after that, I don't think he'd thought about it from my point of view.
For me, all it takes is a few tips here and there, I'm obviously closer to those who spend lots on me, but I feel it's the thought that counts quite often.

If you feel like this, that is how you feel. Men in real life wank over me all the time and don't pay me anything, men on mfcs wank over me too, and most don't pay me a thing. It is no ones 'fault'. As long as they don't go out to hurt me/record me and don't try taking up my time then I won't be happy about it, but I can ignore it.

Also, more guys tend to tip once I'm naked... I still get plenty of freeloaders watching and wanking over me when I'm dressed, so I don't think it actually makes that much difference!

 

[ComicOzzie]

Actually you did attack by calling someone small minded, and no the waitress comparison is spot on, they are providing you a service if you want to admit it or not. Freeload all you want but guess what it's a douche move.

Look again, I didn't call anyone small minded. I called her position small minded because, frankly, it was; it failed to account for the unseen victims of an act she intimated was ethically acceptable. Get mad at me all you want, I guess that's what I deserve for trying to have an intelligent conversation about economics and ethics on a discussion board.

Please. "Views" don't have minds. When you say someone's views are small minded, you are saying that person is small minded.

This is an entirely different discussion and not something that I think we need to get into, but you're implying that there's no difference between acting and being? So in your mind any woman who is dressed provocatively is a slut and someone who, if raped, deserved it?

Wow, my reactions to your posts have gone from "I disagree, but that was well-written" to "WTF!" all in one page.

 

[Cassidy Nicole]

The OP's opinion may not be a popular one, but he is not the only guy on MFC that has this opinion and has/does the exact same thing. This is why I don't work for MFC anymore, because there are way too many guys on MFC that have a very similar mindset-- Why pay for a show/chip in when I can wait around, maybe click around and see all the other public shows going on, come back when I see whatever girl I originally wanted to see completed her countdown, get my nut off, and log out?


I am def not saying it is right at all! Trust me, if people didn't have this mindset I would still be working on MFC. I LOVED MFC when I started on it over 3 years ago, it was a great sense of community and play time. You logged in, did mostly privates and groups, public was for teasing and hanging out. Hell, I remember getting penalized for doing a public show back in the day in 2010.


Times have changed. :twocents-02cents:

 

[legmanct]

I am going to stir the bees nest a little bit here, and hopefully I don't upset anyone too bad in the process.

But have you seen the ads for MFC lately?

They say stuff like (And while I am quoting these are quotes from memory not direct quotes) "Never pay to jerk off to a webcam girl again.", "Or girls will do what you want." "Why pay for other sites when our is 100% free."

With ads like that I can see why there is a huge uptick of freeloaders...

Then you have models who sit there and say Boobs for 300 tolkens and is getting none, while the next model is totally naked with a dildo in each hole and the room is full and no one there is tipping either.

I think the old saying "Why buy the cow when you get the milk for free" applies here.

I personally think that way MFC is promoting itself and letting it turn into a free for all is hurting things. I miss the old days when you could play in free chat a bit, but if you wanted a better show you went into a group and if you wanted the best show take the model private for one on one.

Things are not going to change in fact it looks the way things are going things will only get worse. As more and more models come on board hoping to make a quick buck they are going to keep doing these public shows thnking its the norms them dropping off when they don't make anything... only to have 2 or 3 take their place. This will keep on happening until MFC steps in and makes some changes....

And when MFC makes changes its going to piss off a lot of people... especialy those who have never spent a cent at MFC. But those folks are going to bitch and moan and act like they spent millions at MFC which will give MFC a bad name.

Thats the way i see things going unfortunately. And I hope I am wrong.

 

[legmanct]

BTW I should note I have been guilty or not tipping much lately as well. In face may last few visits instead of going to the models room, I just watch her cam in Lounge 1000 where I don't have to deal with the drama.

However if I do see something I like or one of my favs comes on I do go in and play and TIP.

 

[AllisonWilder]

My. Free. Mother. Fucking. Cams.

It's My Free Cams, not My Free Shows.

This is a job, an awesome job, but at the end of the day, it's a job. I don't know about you, but I can't take a friendly conversation I had on MFC to the electric company in lieu of payment. I need to earn money in order to pay bills and provide for my family.

Honestly, I just don't have time to sit around shooting the shit with a bunch of guys that will NEVER tip me. I just can't afford to waste my time hanging with the guys that don't care that this is my job. Let's say you're a car salesman, sure it's a cool job and you have potential to make good money but you have to stand around talking to people that just want to test drive cars and see what they're like but really have no intention of ever buying one. While you're over here with the person who just wants to hang around, here comes someone who wants to buy a Mustang (or some other car that would net you a great paycheck), but wait...you're busy with time waster XYZ, so the person who wants to spend money leaves because he doesn't want to fight for your attention. He'll go somewhere where he'll be appreciated more than just some random dink.


*I'm totally aware that this makes me sound awful, but the freeloaders were the sole reason I had to leave MFC.

BTW I should note I have been guilty or not tipping much lately as well. In face may last few visits instead of going to the models room, I just watch her cam in Lounge 1000 where I don't have to deal with the drama.

However if I do see something I like or one of my favs comes on I do go in and play and TIP.

There's a HUGE difference between not tipping a girl you're a regular of now because you can't and blatantly saying "I'm not buying any more tokens on MFC since I can just watch for free."

 

[BabyGirlRed]

Allison, I am aware that it's a job. I treat it like a job. I want to make money. I'm just aware of the fact that people can watch for free, and that's not a problem. That's what the site is all about. That's why it's so popular. Yes, it's my free cams, not my free shows. That's all up to the model, though. In public, you're going to make more tips if you put on a show. Seeing as public chat is free, people will watch for free. Simple as that. No problem. It's all up to the model if she gives a 'free show' or not.