WWE Network

[PunkInDrublic]

Wrestling politics is some crazy cutthroat stuff. All those Alpha Male egos in one place, and here's McMahon, who's so ambitious that he's managed to create a real monopoly within his lifetime, and then play it all in caricature for entertainment value. It's kinda mind-blowing.

Vince might be the greatest heel of all time, took some pretty crazy bumps too in the small amount of time he was wrestling. Will never forget him blowing out both of his quads trying to enter the ring, dude is tough. Love reading and watching interviews about the backstage politics, so good.

 

[mynameisbob84]

I think with Bret, it wasn't that he wouldn't drop the belt (he proposed dropping it to Ken Shamrock or Steve Austin) or that he wanted to take the belt to WCW (he offered to forfeit it on RAW) it was just that he refused to drop it to Shawn in his home country, due to all the shit that had gone down between them and Shawn being (a self-confessed) asshole around that period. It's fascinating stuff though.

I've been digging the Monday Night Wars stuff but wish they'd have some more WCW guys offering their perspective. So far it's been very "WCW stole talent and had one good idea with the NWO, WWF were forced to reinvent themselves with the Attitude Era and create new stars, here's some WWE guys to talk about how bad WCW was and how great WWF was", rinse, repeat. They also really haven't touched on guys like Sting or Goldberg yet.

For the money though, it's an awesome service. One that I may well make use of right now.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

^DDP should get some mention too. Would be awesome if they did a cruiserweights episode.

I can undertand Bret not wanting to drop it to Shawn but too bad, Bret. I doubt whoever it was that had to drop the WCW belt to David Arquette felt that it was the right move either. If Vince tells you you're losing to the Brooklyn Brawler, that's business, just deal with it. Still think Bret was the better in ring worker tho.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

They did a cruiserweights episode, pretty cool. Surprised they showed Benoit. Was crazy how good dudes like Malenko and Mysterio were back then. Dean's top rope gut buster looks so brutal, dude was so underrated.

 

[zippypinhead]

They did a cruiserweights episode, pretty cool. Surprised they showed Benoit. Was crazy how good dudes like Malenko and Mysterio were back then. Dean's top rope gut buster looks so brutal, dude was so underrated.

The biggest criticism of Monday Night War is that, in pointing out all that WCW had done wrong, it mostly reminds people that WWE is currently pulling the same stuff. I think the cruiserweights is a pretty good illustration of that, considering right now there is nothing even remotely resembling what WCW had with the cruiserweights. Whether WCW had mishandled the division or not seems immaterial, considering that WWE doesn't even bother to pretend they exist. How can they seriously act like they won in that battle?

So, I was thinking -- the Divas division by and large sucks. Hell, most of the roster is just there to be part of that reality show. My dream would be to see Divas become a bunch of high-flying acrobats. Maybe it could fill the cruiserweight hole, and give the Divas some sort of purpose beyond "Hey look, ladies is rasslin'!" factor. At least then, if they're doing a bunch of twisting backflips off the top rope, I wouldn't care so much that they can't sell a simple clothesline or arm bar.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

So, I was thinking -- the Divas division by and large sucks. Hell, most of the roster is just there to be part of that reality show. My dream would be to see Divas become a bunch of high-flying acrobats. Maybe it could fill the cruiserweight hole, and give the Divas some sort of purpose beyond "Hey look, ladies is rasslin'!" factor. At least then, if they're doing a bunch of twisting backflips off the top rope, I wouldn't care so much that they can't sell a simple clothesline or arm bar.

Divas are seriously awful nowadays. Some can't even run the ropes properly. I'm sure Paige and AJ and Flairs daughter could put on a decent match if given the time. Women can be much better wrestlers than men, just not in America. I remember being like 12 years old and seeing a japanese womens wrestling event for the first time and it blew my mind. I remember buying FMW dvds and seeing Megumi Kudo in deathmatches, shit is wild. Not expecting the same level of training or toughness from divas but Lita, Trish Stratus, Victoria, and Gail Kim were able to have matches that weren't a complete embarassment. They aren't even allowed to be sexy anymore. Was spoiled as a youngster with Stacy Kiebler, Torrie Wilson, Dawn Marie, Buelah, and a buncha others that couldn't really wrestle but they were still awesome to watch.

Hard to keep up with good womens wrestling because it just isn't that big here and is pretty hard to find but I hear this woman is pretty popular, would love to see more of her new stuff.

 

[mynameisbob84]

In terms of talent, they've got enough women to make a pretty great division, they just choose not to. Paige, AJ, Nattie Neidhart, Charlotte Flair, Bayley, Sara Del Rey (probably the best they have and they don't even put her on TV - she had some pretty great matches against Cesaro/Claudio Castagnoli and Sami Zayn/El Generico that you can check out on YouTube)... they're all capable of having legitimately good matches, but they'd rather focus on the reality show chicks who for the most part are there because they're hot, and not because they can wrestle.

 

[BritneySiren]

I was really excited when they first announced it but after CM punk left I decided not to get it since I didn't really know what direction things would go in. Some monday night raw's are strong and other weeks it feels like filler though I'm glad dean ambrose is still around and hasn't been pushed to the background as of yet (I'm planning on dressing as him for halloween actually). I can watch attitude era stuff on daily motion and youtube... If I felt the programming was solid each week I'd probably reconsider... only time will tell

 

[mynameisbob84]

They're showing Survivor Series 1996 on the Network at the moment. Really good show I haven't watched in years. The product was just so different back then, but there's a surprising number of guys who, 18 years later, are still around - Goldust, Lawler, Rock, HHH, Undertaker, Kane (wrestling as 'fake Diesel'). There are also way too many guys who have since died young - Owen, Bulldog, Crush, Doug Furnas, Yokozuna, Pillman.

Random observations...

- I can't tell if Jim Ross was a heel or just in a bad mood that night but he's been cranky, arrogant, and wildly sexist at various points. Very un-Jim Ross.

- Vince's commentary was terrible but I still miss his trademark calls "what a manoeuvre!", "baaaaaaack body drop!" and "1! 2! Hegothimnohedidn't..."

- The current match is like a showcase of future great and formerly great wrestlers being saddled with terrible gimmicks (Barry Windham as the "Stalker", HHH as an aristocrat, and Rock as "blue-chipper Rocky Maivia".

- I remember Bret Hart vs Steve Austin (in a match where they actually wrestled as opposed to brawled) and Shawn Michaels vs Sid being really good. Hopefully they still hold up.

 

[zippypinhead]

I'm waiting for the network to add a bit more to the mid/late 90s content before I start watching that far back. Just as well, since I'm still working my way through 2012 Raws and Smackdowns.

 

[zippypinhead]

News broke today that Sunny is camming. I checked her twitter, and it seems she's been at it for about a year.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

News broke today that Sunny is camming. I checked her twitter, and it seems she's been at it for about a year.

Damn, not sure how to feel about this. I mean, part of me wants to get a show from her but another part of me is like ugh, another drug addicted wrestler that didn't save any money and will probably be working indy shows for very little money for the rest of her life. She said in an older interview that she regretted posing nude. The money she gets for skype shows has to be better than what she is getting for indy bookings I guess tho. Wouldn't think twice if it was Sable offering shows.

Divas episode of Monday Night Wars was solid. Watched this weeks raw so I'd know what to expect from Survivor Series and they had Grumpy Cat as a guest host. Was stupid. Was awesome seeing Luke Harper getting a push tho. Love Sandow, dude is hilarious. Not expecting much from Survivor Series but will still be watching.

 

[mynameisbob84]

Last I heard, Sunny was clean. She's looked much, much healthier the last few times she's been on WWE TV and whenever she crops up as a talking head on a DVD. I dunno, I wouldn't necessarily take her camming as a sign that she's financially fucked or drug addicted. I'd be interested in buying a show from her. It's Sunny. I kind of owe it to 15 year old me to check it out.

And I'm glad Survivor Series is free this year, else I'd probably skip it. The way they've booked the main event is pretty much the perfect encapsulation of everything that's annoying about WWE in 2014

- Cena (the character) is a terrible person but we're just supposed to pretend he's not. On RAW, he didn't lift a finger to help any of his teammates (who are risking their job by joining his team) and yet he labelled Ryback selfish and then went on to say that it didn't matter who his teammates were, he was winning anyway (this after Sheamus was hospitalised and Dolph was screwed out of his title, all because they joined Team Cena). Talk about ungrateful, ya know?

- They've given up on creating new stars. They could have used this as an opportunity to highlight the mid-card or even the NXT guys, but it's just the same guys who have been around for years. Cena, Big Show, Henry, Kane have literally been around for over 10 years now; Ryback's on his third attempt at a main event push in as many years; Ziggler (while awesome) has been jobbed out in the midcard for so long (even as champion he lost more than he won) that it seems unlikely they're ever gonna run with him as a top guy; Rusev, the Wyatts and Rollins are all young but it just feels like they're making up the numbers as it's been crystal clear that the only people involved in the match who matter are Cena, HHH and Steph.

Cesaro's arguably the best wrestler they have on the entire roster and he's not even on the show, let alone in the main event; Ambrose was massively over a month ago but they've failed to run with any momentum he had and moved him out of the main event into a feud with Bray Wyatt (who himself was massively over until being jobbed out to Cena for three months straight earlier in the year) that on paper sounds great, but in reality only exists because they needed a finish for the Ambrose/Rollins match last month and couldn't commit to one guy decisively beating the other, and that so far has revolved around a hologram popping out of a lantern and the same tricks with the lights that the Undertaker was doing 20 years ago. Other than those two matches, there's just nothing else going on. A tag title match with four teams who have no issue with one another, a Divas title match that exists to serve as a backdrop to a reality TV show and a thrown-together Divas tag match that's only there to serve as a piss-break. Oh, and Adam Rose is gonna fight a guy in a bunny suit.

And it's not like they don't have an awesome roster of guys who are over with the crowd. Ambrose, Cesaro, Rollins, the Wyatts, Ziggler are all awesome. It's just frustrating watching them taking a backseat to the John Cena/HHH Show at best, or at worst, not be used at all.

End rant.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

Last I heard, Sunny was clean. She's looked much, much healthier the last few times she's been on WWE TV and whenever she crops up as a talking head on a DVD. I dunno, I wouldn't necessarily take her camming as a sign that she's financially fucked or drug addicted. I'd be interested in buying a show from her. It's Sunny. I kind of owe it to 15 year old me to check it out.

Good to hear and yeah she did look better in the recent interview clips of her. I just figured after all the arrests in 2012 that she was in bad shape to be doing what she did, her time in jail is probably what got her clean. Still feel bad for her tho. She doesn't seem that healthy after looking at her twitter. She deserves better than the random indy bookings, would be cool if Ring of Honor or even TNA could find something for her to do. Tempted to get a few shows and just ask dumb questions about wrestlers.

Cesaro's arguably the best wrestler they have on the entire roster and he's not even on the show, let alone in the main event

Makes no sense how he is basically jobber status right now. They gave him the Andre battle royal, made him a Paul Heyman guy, he improved on the mic, his giant swing was the most over move and just a ridiculous show of athleticism and strength, had WWE MOTY candidates in NxT, and is now doing nothing. Hard to have faith in them with guys like Kenta and Steen and Devitt when they get called up. Pretty cool seeing Kenta in NxT even if he had to tone it down a bunch.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

Pretty entertaining show. Don't want to spoil anything but the last match had a cool surprise. Was surprised and happy to see who they chose to go over too.

 

[mynameisbob84]

First two hours were terrible, but the last hour/match was awesome. Can't really call it a surprise (not with access to the internet) but it was a pretty great, surreal way to end the show. Also really liked that they didn't go with the obvious "Cena Rises Above Hate Pt.85975" finish and actually made Ziggler look like a star. Hopefully they follow up on it.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

Was lucky to not see any spoilers so it was surprising to me. Kinda figured he'd be around at some point because of his involvement in 2k15 so I guess it wasn't that shocking. Yeah was great that it wasn't Cena overcoming the odds for the thousandth time but we still got another Big Show heel turn, gonna be awful.

 

[mynameisbob84]

I'd seen a few "Huge Survivor Series Spoiler" articles on a few wrestling sites and purposefully didn't click on them but then after he'd been trending on Twitter every day since those articles popped up, it sadly became apparent what was gonna happen. Would have been nice to be legitimately surprised by it. The Big Show thing made sense for once but it's not something I look forward to sitting through. Ziggler vs Rollins (if they go that route) and Ambrose vs Wyatt in a TLC match should be really good. Strangely excited about Rowan vs Harper too, and I'm guessing we're getting Rusev vs Ryback, which might not be terrible.

 

[Teagan]

They're showing Survivor Series 1996 on the Network at the moment. Really good show I haven't watched in years. The product was just so different back then, but there's a surprising number of guys who, 18 years later, are still around - Goldust, Lawler, Rock, HHH, Undertaker, Kane (wrestling as 'fake Diesel'). There are also way too many guys who have since died young - Owen, Bulldog, Crush, Doug Furnas, Yokozuna, Pillman.

I had no idea Yokozuna died. Makes sense as he was so big and that is never healthy. He was one of my favs growing up though. Now i'm sad.

I still have a Rey Mysterio tshirt I bought years and years ago I wear proudly. I remember while working at Hooters bartending during Royal Rumble 2006 and yelling when he won. It was more like an embarrassing screaming jumping up and down but I got huge tips for actually being a fan so that was nice.

My all time fav and always will be is HBK. He's just amazing to me and was since I was little. Yes I saw Hulk and Andre and the Harts but HBK just drew me in and made me a fan.

I bought the Wrestlemania Complete Anthology years ago that has all of them 1-20. Definitely worth the money at the time. Now with the channel out I may be tempted to get it. Wrestlemanias are expensive in the US and going to a bar is a pain and not as fun as at home to me. Im glad i found this thread. Thanks guys

 

[PunkInDrublic]

Punk finally speaks on his departure. Haven't listened to it all but pretty interesting so far.

 

[mynameisbob84]

The Punk/Cabana podcast was awesome.

Bullet points for anyone without the time to listen:

- He's never, ever coming back.

- Officially, he was fired (on his wedding day) and never officially quit, though he did walk out in January due to injuries. He was frustrated with creative, didn't want to work with HHH at WrestleMania (who he resented for not putting him over in 2011), and was angry that they weren't planning to run with Daniel Bryan on top (he's happy that him walking out indirectly helped Bryan), but his reason for walking out was injury-related. He was working concussed (he slammed WWE's concussion protocol as being unsafe) and he had broken ribs from working with Ryback (who he refers to as "the steroids guy"). He also had a growth on his back that the WWE doctor misdiagnosed for months and he needed knee surgery.

- He told Vince and HHH that he was done. Vince hugged him with tears in his eyes, HHH shook his hand and he walked out. A week later Vince called him to ask if he was ready to come back. He said "no". HHH texted him to discuss royalties (which Punk felt he was owed) and the possibility of coming back. Punk said he was busy planning his honeymoon and would schedule a meeting when he got back. Then on his wedding day he got a fedEx saying he'd been released over breach of contract (for appearing on a UFC PPV).

- Punk hired a lawyer and sued WWE for royalties. He got "everything he wanted and then some".

- He criticised Vince as being "out of touch" and HHH as being self-serving. He said WWE is a "creatively toxic" environment. He also said Vince would take ideas of his and give them to other people like Cena and Brock.

- He was rushed back from injury multiple times and never truly given the time he needed to heal.

- The Shield was his idea (he pitched the idea of using Rollins, Ambrose and Chris Hero as his own security unit but HHH didn't like Hero so replaced him with Reigns and they eventually moved away from the idea of having them aligned with Punk).

- He doesn't like the idea of part-timers like Rock and Lesnar being pushed over the full-timers.

- Even though everybody including Vince and HHH agreed that his WrestleMania match with Undertaker was the best on the show, his WrestleMania payday was less than almost everybody else's.

- He asked for months how the Network would affect wrestler's pay but was never given any answers.

- He was chosen to do a random drug test (for steroids) despite being straight-edge and refused to do it out of principle. HHH told him that Batista had had to do the same test. When Punk asked HHH if he'd taken the drug test, HHH didn't answer.

- The only wrestlers who dare argue with Vince and HHH are Cena and Orton.

 

[BritneySiren]

This sheds a lot of light on things... I'm surprised he held out for as long as he did. Also glad to finally hear it from him what happened. I don't blame him for leaving

 

[mynameisbob84]

I was getting tired of spending as much time deciding what PPV to watch as I was watching PPVs, but as luck would have it, I stumbled across this website...

http://randomppv.info/

Each time you load it up, it randomly generates a different PPV. So from now on, I'm just gonna load it up when I have enough spare time to sit down and watch a PPV and see where it takes me. Today it landed on Halloween Havoc 2000, a show I'd heard was shit and wouldn't have watched otherwise. It's as bad as I'd heard (with the notable exception of a tag title match that was awesome) but perversely entertaining nonetheless. Like watching a multi-million dollar organisation falling apart in real-time, full of unintentional comedy and head-scratching moments.

 

[mynameisbob84]

The Austin/Vince podcast on the Network is well worth checking out for anyone who missed it. Much more candid than I was expecting with Austin quizzing him on pretty much everything you'd hope (CM Punk, the Network performance, the scripted nature of the current product, Jim Ross being fired, Undertaker's streak being ended, the lack of blood in the current product, guys like Cesaro being squandered, Randy Savage going in to the HOF, Vince running the competition in to the ground ultimately being a bad thing for the business as a whole, etc. etc. as well as some reminiscing on Vince and Austin working together in the past). Could have easily gone for another hour (it went an hour and fifteen minutes after the director told Austin to wrap things up as they were approaching the end of their scheduled 60 minutes when Vince shot back "I own this Network, let's go another 15 minutes") and they alluded to doing more in the future, which I'd be all for.

If I had a criticism, it would be that Austin occasionally let Vince off the hook too easily. He'd ask the difficult questions, give Vince the chance to answer, and then move on. When Vince said no wrestler has "reached for the brass ring" since Cena, it was just begging for Austin to bring up guys like Punk and Bryan and Ziggler, but he let it slide. All in all, really good stuff though.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

Yeah that Stone Cold podcast was dope. Loved how they were shitting on Vince for not being athletic. Really hope they decide to do more. Part 2 of Punks should be showing up later, should be entertaining.

 

[mynameisbob84]

The random PPV generator landed on No Mercy 2007 when I last loaded it up so that's what I watched today. Not a bad show, especially if you enjoy HHH vs Randy Orton matches, as there's two of them (or HHH matches in general, as there's three of them). Their second match (a Last Man Standing match) is really good, while the first one isn't bad. There's a perversely entertaining Batista vs Great Khali Punjabi Prison Match on there and a couple of good matches on the undercard too.

 

[BritneySiren]

are any of you excited about Punk going to UFC? I wonder how he will do/who they will put him up against first.

 

[zippypinhead]

are any of you excited about Punk going to UFC? I wonder how he will do/who they will put him up against first.

I hear that one of the Power Rangers wants to fight him.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

Excited to see him fight but don't see him being very good, would love to be wrong. Wonder how much he will be making for each fight. Some really good UFC cards in the next couple of months, Diaz Vs Silva is going to be wild.

 

[Sevrin]

Can't log in on the 360 app, will try later tonight. lol Hogan just came out, haven't seen dude in years.

Hogan did what now?