You've pretty much described every fundraiser ever.zippypinhead said:
For 44 years Jerry Lewis pretty much depended on an entire day of spectacle to raise money for MDA.
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Olivia!
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For 44 years Jerry Lewis pretty much depended on an entire day of spectacle to raise money for MDA.
zippypinhead said:
I go back and forth on this a lot. I agree with you in that I feel that she and others who have done similar things seem (to my jaded mind) to be looking for validation and for us to say they are so kind and generous. To me, charity should be from the heart and private.
On the other hand, would all those guys donate separately on their own? Maybe, maybe not.
zippypinhead said:
Why just donate the toys when you can have a little fun too? Plenty of charity events are like this. People can do a good deed and have a good time.
As for charging a lot of money, I agree 2k tokens is quite a bit. It was likely set that high to draw out the event rather than having everyone open all the presents within an hour or less. Though personally I would have played a game with the prize being opening a present because I'd feel guilty taking that much money for a charity not for myself. :?
JerryBoBerry said:
No, it is not the same thing. Yes, charities often rely upon spectacle in order to both get the word out and make money for the cause. This comes off as cynical to me because the cause here is Olivia herself. As far as I know, Jerry didn't keep the money from the telethons.
I deliberated even chiming in on this because I'm not so emotionally invested in Olivia or anything she does that I really care to carry on a debate regarding her actions. And really, I'm not taking her to task for doing this. Either she bought toys for charity, and decided to have some fun with them, which is nice, or she bought toys for a show, and decided to give them to charity afterward, which is also nice. Yes, it's a fun idea, and I'm sure everyone was entertained. This was not, however, an act of pure philanthropy, and the person who benefits most from the outcome of the show, again, is Olivia herself. That people are painting it as some sort of sweet humanitarian gesture is where I find the distaste.
But hell. Whatever. She's obviously not for me, and the fact that this thread is only one of several that have been specifically about the woman on this forum alone, and like the others, it's gained traction, means that as an entertainer she's got some chops. It doesn't really matter what I see, as an outsider looking in, because she's not for me, and for the people she is for, she's doing it right. So, I'm sorry for being the guy who shits on the floor in the middle of the party. I'll see myself out.
zippypinhead said:
I understand where you're coming from. But for me it's more of a matter of relative perspective. Does she benefit from this. Yes. Definitely in Camscore. She may also be keeping some, or a lot, of the nickel per token tipped. Depends on the cost of the toys she's donating. I don't know that. But a lot of models do charity drives similar to this, usually donating at least 10% of their earnings or as much as all of the money raised. A couple times I've even seen the model donate all the tokens tipped and match it out of their own money.
The perspective part comes from thinking about how this is also done out in the real world. Not many charities out there donate all the money people donate to them. And quite honestly there's some who donate jack shit.
For example. Kids Wish Network.
http://kidswishnetwork.org/
They do big splashy fundraising and it's a bigger, somewhat well known charity. It's also the shittiest one out there. Three cents of every dollar raised actually goes to the cause. The rest goes to pay its for-profit fundraisers and to pay the charity's founder and his own consulting firms.
http://www.tampabay.com/topics/specials/worst-charities1.page
So, in this case, where the toys would have been donated, it doesn't seem like that bad of a charitable event. Think of it this way. If there wasn't any benefit to the
If a charity gets some benefit simply because someone else also was benefited in the process, well...yay!
zippypinhead said:
Every party I've gone to, that guy is the life of it!
It's also 99% of the time me. Waitasecond....
Either way, don't leave, finish pushing that sucker out! Woooooooo! :dance:
ACFFAN69 said:Either way, don't leave, finish pushing that sucker out! Woooooooo! :dance:
Alright, this one's for you.
JerryBoBerry said:
Donated toys notwithstanding, Olivia is not a charitable organization, and this was not a show done to raise money or awareness for charity, so I don't think it's particularly warranted to make comparisons between her and any charity, honest or not.
Nordling
V.I.P. AmberLander
Olivia may not be an official, registered "charity," but being charitable with ANY portion of one's income is ok with me. Why not make it fun?
zippypinhead said:
No he didn't. But he sure as hell enjoyed buffing his reputation for those years, and benefitted from that as a result.
I AM a cynic, and feel that very little in the world happens out of a pure feeling of charity. Givers profit multiple ways from the actions they take. Some financially, but others like Jerry with a reputation stroke, others get a psychological stroke that makes them feel better about themselves, or less guilty about their success and wealth. And so on.
When I look at a charitable act, I look at not the motivation, but the result.
How much better off is the world as a result of the action, regardless of motivation?
In this case a bunch of kids will be getting toys. And a fair number of them based on what I saw in Olivia's room and heard reported from other members. That's pretty good. If Olivia gets a CS bump (can she really get any more visible then she is now?), or some tokens counted toward her eternal battle with MJ for MFC #1, or even a few bucks from it, (2000 tokens = $100 to the model, how much did each tip buy toy wise? It's not hard to eat most of a Benjamin buying one toy these days) then so what? The end result was a positive for the world, and made the place a bit better.
Charities like the one mentioned above that turn 3¢ on a dollar to the goal are the sort of operations that are worth scorn. Not because they do it, but because they could operate on a much smaller margin of the donations, but choose not to. There is a moral crime to be bugged by.
KIds got toys, members had fun and could feel their tokens did more then normal, and Olivia gained ground on many of her goals. Wins all about.
Myriads
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SenaLuna said:
Yeah, I've done charity nights before donating 50% of my earnings to charity so I have no problem with girls not donating 100% but 2000 tokens to "donate" a toy by unwrapping is QUITE the profit unless she's donating iPads, Leapfrogs and those massive expensive Lego sets.
Didn't see the charity thing so its unfair to comment on that directly - but 2k is $100, but were unwrapped-by-end presents also donated? (one assumes so). There are overheads.
But if you wish to give to charity I'd urge you to give directly. After all, if the charity itself is spending a %age of the funds on admin/running costs, then having another company (MFC) taking 50% of the charity before it even gets near the charity is awful.
Furthermore, in the UK, donating to the charity allows you to claim "Gift aid" (essentially the tax you paid on your earnings to the value of the donation is returned to the charity) - which would also be cut in half by doing it via MFC as well. A double negative whammy.
It's all fun and games, so whatever, as long as it actually goes to charity. I'm not an Olivia fan by any stretch (she may be inventive, but she's also very repetitive and her waving/miming got tedious...maybe she's changed) but I do think she's likely to do what she said (i.e. actually donate it).
However, I personally donate every month to 3 different charities by Direct Debit and therefore wouldn't take part in any MFC related fund raiser.
Should also be noted, doesn't MFC also occasionally do charity during big appeals?
But if you wish to give to charity I'd urge you to give directly. After all, if the charity itself is spending a %age of the funds on admin/running costs, then having another company (MFC) taking 50% of the charity before it even gets near the charity is awful.
Furthermore, in the UK, donating to the charity allows you to claim "Gift aid" (essentially the tax you paid on your earnings to the value of the donation is returned to the charity) - which would also be cut in half by doing it via MFC as well. A double negative whammy.
It's all fun and games, so whatever, as long as it actually goes to charity. I'm not an Olivia fan by any stretch (she may be inventive, but she's also very repetitive and her waving/miming got tedious...maybe she's changed) but I do think she's likely to do what she said (i.e. actually donate it).
However, I personally donate every month to 3 different charities by Direct Debit and therefore wouldn't take part in any MFC related fund raiser.
Should also be noted, doesn't MFC also occasionally do charity during big appeals?
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This is a topic that has fascinated me, but I've never wanted to be the one to say: "Toot! Here's my own horn!"
I first started on MFC (I work on SM now, but still have an MFC profile for some reason), and My screen name there is just "Elsalil" because Olivia was just "Olivia". I wanted a first name and only a first name. I've been using the full name Elsalil Stiller for over a decade, so it was more about the presentation.
For a long time I thought the girl was deaf. Really. She was so good at expressions and hand gestures, most hearing people wouldn't bother with all that. I never stuck around in her room long enough to hear her speak.
But before I found my niche as a camgirl (which I am still pinpointing) I would ask myself, "WWOD?" It never worked for me, because her game is not mine, but I used it as a reference point.
I joined SM for the traffic and ease. Somehow, however, I tend to earn just as much or more in tips than in do in privates, where I'll cater to pretty much any fetish involving consenting adults, simply because I'm the "most entertaining here." I'm not saying that's the truth, it's just what I've heard.
I play guitar and I sing. I learn specific songs for regulars. I'm actually quite good at singing, and I know a lot about music. Sometimes I make up X-rated songs on the spot. I also joke a lot. I draw. I teach. I lecture. I'm excessively educated and I talk about a bunch of stuff. I know I don't sound too smart right now, but I'm off the clock.
Anyway, being a "performer" rather than a "professional masturbator" has been what has allowed me to stand out from the crowd. In a way I am totally jealous of Olivia and I hate her, but she's also been a big part of my inspiration. I should also add, I hold Alex Lady as my standard on how to treat people in my room. Some girls can be total bitches to new guys who really just don't know how the site works, and I saw Alex be sweet to them, so I was sweet to them, and whoops there goes their daily limit.
Thanks, Alex!
I first started on MFC (I work on SM now, but still have an MFC profile for some reason), and My screen name there is just "Elsalil" because Olivia was just "Olivia". I wanted a first name and only a first name. I've been using the full name Elsalil Stiller for over a decade, so it was more about the presentation.
For a long time I thought the girl was deaf. Really. She was so good at expressions and hand gestures, most hearing people wouldn't bother with all that. I never stuck around in her room long enough to hear her speak.
But before I found my niche as a camgirl (which I am still pinpointing) I would ask myself, "WWOD?" It never worked for me, because her game is not mine, but I used it as a reference point.
I joined SM for the traffic and ease. Somehow, however, I tend to earn just as much or more in tips than in do in privates, where I'll cater to pretty much any fetish involving consenting adults, simply because I'm the "most entertaining here." I'm not saying that's the truth, it's just what I've heard.
I play guitar and I sing. I learn specific songs for regulars. I'm actually quite good at singing, and I know a lot about music. Sometimes I make up X-rated songs on the spot. I also joke a lot. I draw. I teach. I lecture. I'm excessively educated and I talk about a bunch of stuff. I know I don't sound too smart right now, but I'm off the clock.
Anyway, being a "performer" rather than a "professional masturbator" has been what has allowed me to stand out from the crowd. In a way I am totally jealous of Olivia and I hate her, but she's also been a big part of my inspiration. I should also add, I hold Alex Lady as my standard on how to treat people in my room. Some girls can be total bitches to new guys who really just don't know how the site works, and I saw Alex be sweet to them, so I was sweet to them, and whoops there goes their daily limit.
Thanks, Alex!
I popped in her room last night and watched for a bit. Granted i'm not any sort of fan of Olivia's but it is my gut feeling that she's not even donating these toys to whatever charity she claims she is. no proof either way of whether she has or will, but just a gut feeling based on the fact that she was unwilling to provide any sort of proof of donation, after the fact
I guess I'm a 'pics or it didn't happen' sort of guy.
I guess I'm a 'pics or it didn't happen' sort of guy.
Crumb said:
So, she bought all these presents for kids, wrapped them up, got people to tip 2000 tokens for them, unwrapped them for the tippers to see, all so she could then throw them away afterwards? Is that about right?
:roll:
ComicOzzie said:
What he is saying is she could very well have bought them for kids of friends or family members, and he makes a good point. I am pretty cynical of all charity modeling sessions. Hell, it was a model who told me to be very suspicious, that we can't know for sure donations are ever really made. Though, yes, many models do show receipts, etc.
One time when I was at work the bosses told our department we could order in pizza's and expense it. But the delivery driver forgot the receipt. So I typed up one that looked like it came from a cash register, cut it to width, cut the ends off on the wide packing tape dispenser so it would have those ridges like a cash register. Then i folded it up a couple times, crumpled it up, and sat on it for an hour so it looked like it came out of someone's pocket. All to make it look real. No one ever batted an eyelash.
Receipts from donation sites can be faked easily with today's software. We're talking about camgirls, many of whom make it part of their job to make their own graphics and learn the finer points of photoshop. If we're going to be that paranoid, what makes anyone believe any of the receipts are real? Given 20 minutes I could fake every single picture proof I've ever seen any model post/tweet as proof of donations, they're all just text from a webpage or email with a logo on it.
Sometimes the paranoia just gets too ridiculous. Either you trust them to do it or you don't.
Receipts from donation sites can be faked easily with today's software. We're talking about camgirls, many of whom make it part of their job to make their own graphics and learn the finer points of photoshop. If we're going to be that paranoid, what makes anyone believe any of the receipts are real? Given 20 minutes I could fake every single picture proof I've ever seen any model post/tweet as proof of donations, they're all just text from a webpage or email with a logo on it.
Sometimes the paranoia just gets too ridiculous. Either you trust them to do it or you don't.
Nordling
V.I.P. AmberLander
Exactly my thought. And really, wherever they end up, I imagine they will make some children happy. I like to believe what people say unless I have some special reason to doubt them, not including cynicism.JerryBoBerry said:
Jimsx said it fairly well before I could.ComicOzzie said:
I did say it was a gut feeling of mine... hey, if I'm wrong, then good on her.
Guess the bottom line still stands. If you want to donate gifts for kids, then do it directly.
If you want to tip Olivia for being Olivia, and doing so could benefit a charity - then do so.
But don't tip for charity - as that's plain dumb.
If you want to tip Olivia for being Olivia, and doing so could benefit a charity - then do so.
But don't tip for charity - as that's plain dumb.
Crumb said:
"it was just a gut feeling" doesn't mean it isn't slander without any evidence whatsoever.
I was going to list some gut feeling I'm having right now about you, but that just wouldn't be very nice.
Any chance we can go back to talking about Olivia. She's had some interesting shows this month.
There could be a separate thread about charity on cam sites in general. Attacks on specific models who aren't even here, I dont think is cool.
As said before, I like "Oliv". -not a 'fanboy' by any means, but she is entertaining in measured doses. What gets me is the polarization for/against her. Theres a few guys [long time big hitters in 10k lounge] that have an absolutely palatable hate for her and are quite vocal about it. They have said multiple times how will obscenely tip 'anyone else' just to make sure she doesn't ever win the contest. [I've witnessed them do it 2x.] They also say freely how shes never burned them in any way but they just have a gut hatred. That kind of thing just seems odd to me. like maybe they need therapy kind of odd. :confusion-shrug:
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