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Elder Scrolls VI: Argonia

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KatVonnegut

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Aug 17, 2014
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I don't meet many people/gamers that haven't played Skyrim,
but the number of dedicated Elder Scrolls fans seems to be declining.
I often exclaim "oh you like Skyrim! Did you prefer it or Oblivion?!"
And people go: "obliv-whhaaat"
:woops:
Are you skyrim-only fanatics excited for the release of no. 6?
What about the few that remember morrowind?
What do you guys think?

I personally can't wait for a world that isn't human inspired. Cyrodiil and skyrim = snooooze, I get it, there's lots of snow and men with lots of muscles.
BUT SWAMPS AND LIZARDS? DUDE YES.

(fingers crosses there's a stronger plot-line than skyrim, three times through it and I was bored. 7-10 times through Obliv and 10/10 would still replay)
 
mynameisbob84 said:
Loved Oblivion. Still playing Skyrim. Hopefully Argonia will be awesome. I really liked the setting for Oblivion though. It was basically (Video)Game of Thrones.

I couldn't get based the really strange counter intuitive way that your leveled you character in Oblivion. In really decreased my enjoyment of the game. Skyrim character progression was a much better system.
 
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OMG YES!!!! I play an Argonian every time I create a new character.
I loved Oblivion. I think it was a better game than Skyrim, but I think Skyrim is prettier and the leveling system is better.
 
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I'm sorry, have I missed the biggest game announcement of the last three years, or are we just playing pretend that we know there's an upcoming Elder Scroll VI, and that it takes place in Argonia?
 
zippypinhead said:
I'm sorry, have I missed the biggest game announcement of the last three years, or are we just playing pretend that we know there's an upcoming Elder Scroll VI, and that it takes place in Argonia?

It comes out in March 2016 Zippy! Mark it on your calendar and book the day off work :p

OMG YES!!!! I play an Argonian every time I create a new character.
I loved Oblivion. I think it was a better game than Skyrim, but I think Skyrim is prettier and the leveling system is better.
I'm with you 1000%, Oblivion has suchuchsuchsuch a far superior plot line but skyrim's game play is mmmmm
 
katza_ said:
zippypinhead said:
I'm sorry, have I missed the biggest game announcement of the last three years, or are we just playing pretend that we know there's an upcoming Elder Scroll VI, and that it takes place in Argonia?

It comes out in March 2016 Zippy! Mark it on your calendar and book the day off work :p

But that's just rumor. Nothing is official. Nothing is even close to official. If it was, every single corner that I frequent on the internet would be absolutely blowing up with simultaneous nosebleeds and orgasms. And that hasn't happened. Can you at least provide the source from which you've drawn this information?
 
Just to make up for being a Negative Nancy, what they've got left are the southern provinces, which is pretty exciting for me. They've all got a lot of great potential to get away from standard high fantasy, sword & sorcery settings. Valenwood is probably the biggest dark horse among the unused provinces, but I kinda hope that's our next destination. I've always had a soft place in my heart for the Bosmer, ever since I was met off the boat in Seyda Neen and became fast friends with Fargoth, all because I simply found his ring.
 
ramblin said:
There are also a lot of claims about an announcement at EGX 2014, but no actual announcement to be found.

Yeah, along with Fallout 4, right? :lol:
 
I'm so freaking excited for this! I haven't had a game that I was really excited for in quite a while.

However, I'm not able to find any reliable sources to confirm that it actually is happening. They're all weird blogs which are linking to each other lol. If someone can find something reliable that would be awesome!

Also, Khajiit Master Race reporting in. :p
 
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It's all weird blogs linking to each other because there has been no official word on a new Elder Scrolls game. The best reliable info we have on hand is that Bethesda is currently working on an unnamed project. Could be Elder Scrolls, could be Fallout, could be something else. Who knows?

But that doesn't stop us from dreaming about what the next Elder Scrolls game could be!

Last night, I was attacked by a trio of Altmer assassins, trying to take a strategic advantage from my engagement in a battle with a blood dragon.

It didn't end well for any of them.

uoYU9qi.jpg


That's when it occurred to me. I think the next installment is going to be Summerset Isle. It's a largely mysterious land, so there's plenty of opening for fantasy coolness. It's also a self-contained land -- an island, like Vvardenfell or Solstheim, which means a good local focus. The story of the expansion of the Aldmeri Dominion is a strong thread to the narrative that's currently at play, but it still hasn't been directly addressed. Obviously, the Dominion is now important to the history of Tamriel, so it would make sense to set it where this particular empire is based, and have as much fun exploring the intrigues that come with a society's ascension as it has been to deal with the Empire's decline over the last couple of games.

So, as much as I've said I like the Bosmer, I'd be willing to hold off on Valenwood, if it meant that I could get to go to Summerset and learn to understand the High Elves.
 
katza_ said:
But but I'm so bored with elves.

You make a convincing case. At least Elder Scrolls elves are more interesting and varied than the standard.

I certainly wouldn't mind Black Marsh. I have every faith that Bethesda would make it interesting.
 
I think we'll most likely see Fallout 4 before we see ES6, but then again Skyrim was hugely popular so I suppose it's possible that they'll reverse them. I wouldn't complain. (I'm excited for new games in both franchises, but ES6 slightly more so.)

Personally I think we're most likely to see a Fallout game based on the Skyrim engine sometime next year and then the next Elder Scrolls game on an improved game engine, perhaps in November 2016 if we're lucky.
 
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One thing Bethesda has going for it is people are already pre-hyped for Fallout and ES games, so they don't have to work so hard at the marketing, and the time between announcement and release can be comparatively short. The time between the first teaser drop for Skyrim and its release was eleven months (12/11/10 teasing to 11/11/11 -- OMG NUMEROLOGY!!!)

mynameisbob84 said:
Dove back in to Skyrim after reading through this thread. Might even finish it by the time the next one is released (assuming there is one).

I'm working really hard on finally getting through the main quest. We'll see if I can do it this time!
 
Always_Tim said:
I think we'll most likely see Fallout 4 before we see ES6, but then again Skyrim was hugely popular so I suppose it's possible that they'll reverse them. I wouldn't complain. (I'm excited for new games in both franchises, but ES6 slightly more so.)

Personally I think we're most likely to see a Fallout game based on the Skyrim engine sometime next year and then the next Elder Scrolls game on an improved game engine, perhaps in November 2016 if we're lucky.

lol I did the same thing! I rage quit last time because my ex SAVED OVER MY GAMES. ALL OF MY SAVES. UGH.
 
Morrowind was my childhood...I keep the soundtrack on my phone to remind me of a happier time. Oblivion was not even close, but it wasn't god awful. Skyrim was unplayable after being such a huge morrowind fanatic. After killing drauger after drauger, I ended up in this cave full of mages, which was a nice change of pace I guess. I am a magic only user and I'm sitting there shooting flames at a group of these mages while healing occasionally. After about 3 minutes of shooting one of them and his HP bar slowly draining I was just like...ok fuck this I'm out.. I stopped before even finishing him off and the next time I went back it just felt like a hassle. I am so sad how they made it into the lowest common denominator from a game that was so in depth, morrowing felt like a real D&D experience with all of the twist and turns and RNG a guy could ever want...

Sorry about my rant, I've carried these thoughts on my shoulders for a long long LONG time now. I haven't even seen previews for the new one but I just know it will never go back to the way it used to be.
 
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Shamefully I've only just started playing Skyrim in the past few weeks. I played a fucktonne of Oblivion and Fallout 3 back in the day (but no New Vegas for reasons which escape me). It probably goes without saying that it's blowing my mind. Also: All The Snow. Squee! I think like Always_Tim said, we'll probably see a new Fallout before we see a new TES. Particularly with the MMO not having been out for so long. I hope New Fallout has some new tricks up it's sleeve. I love the dual-wielding magic in Skyrim.
 
I played morrowind to death, then I played oblivion to death, then I played fallout 3 to death, then I played New Vegas for about 500 yours, and now i am up to about 700 hours on Skyrim.

I think I will reload Oblivion next. I've forgotten large chucks of it. I tried fallout 3 again, but I remember every fucking inch of the entire wasteland and its expansions. Morrowind. I played that game for years and its even worse than Fallout 3 for me. I know where everything is. If the Skyrim/Morrowind project ever completes, I will be very happy. Looking at Elder Scrolls online, it appears most people are playing PvE and just ignoring the MMO aspect, so i might give it a try when I move somewhere with better internet.

I really missed the backwards kneed Argonians and and Khajit in Oblivion, it is worst change they made.
 
DDuckworth said:
Morrowind was my childhood...I keep the soundtrack on my phone to remind me of a happier time. Oblivion was not even close, but it wasn't god awful. Skyrim was unplayable after being such a huge morrowind fanatic. After killing drauger after drauger, I ended up in this cave full of mages, which was a nice change of pace I guess. I am a magic only user and I'm sitting there shooting flames at a group of these mages while healing occasionally. After about 3 minutes of shooting one of them and his HP bar slowly draining I was just like...ok fuck this I'm out.. I stopped before even finishing him off and the next time I went back it just felt like a hassle. I am so sad how they made it into the lowest common denominator from a game that was so in depth, morrowing felt like a real D&D experience with all of the twist and turns and RNG a guy could ever want...

Sorry about my rant, I've carried these thoughts on my shoulders for a long long LONG time now. I haven't even seen previews for the new one but I just know it will never go back to the way it used to be.


That is what the construction set is for. There are also a lot of really good mods if you are too lazy to make the changes yourself. I run an alteration/conjuration mage with massive magic shields and summoning. I just made all the alteration and conjuration spells last 3 times as long and doubled the level you can raise with any given conjuration spell. Its very practical and painless to do.
 
I have lurked on this site for years and I finally have to register to put out fires of misinformation about TES series.

First the rating of the games for TES goes in THIS order

Morrowind
Daggerfall
Arena
Skyrim
Oblivion


Oblivion was the absolute worst most atrociously done elder scrolls. Every ounce of customization that Morrowind brought to TES was stripped away. Daggerfall's political system and character rating were superb to any other CRPG (computer) of the day. It's disappointing how much of that has been stripped away from Oblivion and Skyrim.

I prefer the level system in Daggerfall and Morrowind but Skyrim's is OK. While map markers might be convenient they took away from the accomplishment feeling of when you actually found somewhere from the directions people would give you. I.E. "Walk a ways until you see a tree with two twisted branches.. turn left there until you get to 4 rocks and then its a little ways on the right"

Let's talk about Magic... in Daggerfall and Morrowind becoming good at magic meant something. It was actually worth the trouble, In Oblivion and Skyrim Magic is so nerfed you might as well not use it. Dual casting? Great... Now I can heal twice as fast. And trust me. I have every spell the base game offers and healing is the only one worth a flying crap. Even the mods for Skyrim magic are disappointing compared to Midas Magic Mod for Oblivion which was the only thing that made Oblivions magic worth using.

I've put 5000+ hours in TES and Oblivion and Skyrim I've put the least. I probably only have 60 hours on Oblivion and Steam says I have 150 on Skyrim. I dumped easily 2k into Morrowind and 2k+ into Daggerfall.

I really feel like the series has gone backwards the last 2 games after so much progression was made in the first 3. I hope Argonia or Hammerfell is the setting for the next game. Redguards never did get enough attention in my opinion. :twocents-02cents:

DDuckworth said:
Morrowind was my childhood...I keep the soundtrack on my phone to remind me of a happier time. Oblivion was not even close, but it wasn't god awful. Skyrim was unplayable after being such a huge morrowind fanatic. After killing drauger after drauger, I ended up in this cave full of mages, which was a nice change of pace I guess. I am a magic only user and I'm sitting there shooting flames at a group of these mages while healing occasionally. After about 3 minutes of shooting one of them and his HP bar slowly draining I was just like...ok fuck this I'm out.. I stopped before even finishing him off and the next time I went back it just felt like a hassle. I am so sad how they made it into the lowest common denominator from a game that was so in depth, morrowing felt like a real D&D experience with all of the twist and turns and RNG a guy could ever want...

Sorry about my rant, I've carried these thoughts on my shoulders for a long long LONG time now. I haven't even seen previews for the new one but I just know it will never go back to the way it used to be.

Glad to know I am not the only one.. and the MMO? GOD AWFUL.
 
To your general point, DP667, this is becoming an ever-bigger problem in game development in general. As graphics become higher fidelity and production costs go up accordingly, so less time can be devoted to game features. Or at least there is a greater cost associated with any game feature to bring it up to sufficient quality to match the rest of the content. I really want to play Morrowind. I've heard so many people refer to it as their first and favourite TES game. I think it sat right on the tipping point where the graphics were good enough that it was accessible and attractive, without the cost of making assets being prohibitively high. Here's hoping that as the graphical arms races starts to slow down we can start to see games being differentiated more on their features and mechanics and less on how good they look.
 
HologramDonut said:
To your general point, DP667, this is becoming an ever-bigger problem in game development in general. As graphics become higher fidelity and production costs go up accordingly, so less time can be devoted to game features. Or at least there is a greater cost associated with any game feature to bring it up to sufficient quality to match the rest of the content. I really want to play Morrowind. I've heard so many people refer to it as their first and favourite TES game. I think it sat right on the tipping point where the graphics were good enough that it was accessible and attractive, without the cost of making assets being prohibitively high. Here's hoping that as the graphical arms races starts to slow down we can start to see games being differentiated more on their features and mechanics and less on how good they look.

Beth made it all very clear between Morrowind and Oblivion. They worked out that only some microscopic number of people completed Morrowind. The game was just too big and too hard for the AVERAGE gamer. Plus you had the endless whining on the Beth forums about "there is this bug, I just killed everyone in Balmora and now I can't complete the mainquest" The result of all of this was Oblivion.

Oblivion was an idiotproof linear quest without some of the good points and all of the bad points of Morrowind. Essential characters were directly from complaints on the forums about Morrowind. You don't need to construct an ass backwards character like Morrowind and didn't know that every piece of loot in the game was going to be after the first playthough. The worst thing about Oblivion was watching them cutting the map down so it would work on the X box. Oblivion is still my favourite of the ES games.
 
Red7227 said:
HologramDonut said:
To your general point, DP667, this is becoming an ever-bigger problem in game development in general. As graphics become higher fidelity and production costs go up accordingly, so less time can be devoted to game features. Or at least there is a greater cost associated with any game feature to bring it up to sufficient quality to match the rest of the content. I really want to play Morrowind. I've heard so many people refer to it as their first and favourite TES game. I think it sat right on the tipping point where the graphics were good enough that it was accessible and attractive, without the cost of making assets being prohibitively high. Here's hoping that as the graphical arms races starts to slow down we can start to see games being differentiated more on their features and mechanics and less on how good they look.

Beth made it all very clear between Morrowind and Oblivion. They worked out that only some microscopic number of people completed Morrowind. The game was just too big and too hard for the AVERAGE gamer. Plus you had the endless whining on the Beth forums about "there is this bug, I just killed everyone in Balmora and now I can't complete the mainquest" The result of all of this was Oblivion.

Oblivion was an idiotproof linear quest without some of the good points and all of the bad points of Morrowind. Essential characters were directly from complaints on the forums about Morrowind. You don't need to construct an ass backwards character like Morrowind and didn't know that every piece of loot in the game was going to be after the first playthough. The worst thing about Oblivion was watching them cutting the map down so it would work on the X box. Oblivion is still my favourite of the ES games.

Yeah, I really don't cotton to people bitching about the games that came after Morrowind, based on the experience they had with Morrowind. It mostly seems driven from nostalgia. People really seem to gloss over the suckier parts Morrowind's mechanics, as if they don't exist, or they're charmingly forgivable in some way. Morrowind's roll-based combat mechanics suck. If I'm swinging a stick at as shalk, I should be able to hit that fucking shalk. I may not be able to do much damage to it, but I should at least be able to hit it. Spending a long time trying to find a dungeon based on the shittiest directions ever given is not a fun challenge; it's obnoxious. It's especially annoying because you have to fight off a damned cliffracer every three steps.

People also forget that there's a lot to the mechanics of Oblivion and those games that came after that were merely optional for a person to use, or they were necessary to the function of the game. Marking a NPC as essential was more than just idiot-proofing the game for players, it was also necessary because Oblivion was no longer a static world space like Morrowind was. People moved a lot more as they kept schedules, characters traveled outside of cities, where they could run into real trouble along the way, and cities and towns themselves were less secure, and violent events could happen anywhere. Marking characters essential didn't just prevent them being killed by the careless player, it also prevented them from being killed by a dangerous world, thus breaking the game. As for stuff like fast travel and quest markers, don't use them if you don't like them. (Yes, I know that in Oblivion, quest markers are kind of forced on you, but there are quests that have no markers in the game. Set one as the active quest, et voila! No more quest markers. Or, you know, you could always just mod them away.)

And speaking of mods, that's something that has become integral to the full experience of TES, ever since Morrowind, to the point where I feel like at this point, people who can't or won't mod are playing about half the game. Everyone is aware of modding, and everyone talks about modding, but I find it weird that nobody ever openly acknowledges it as a fundamental aspect of TES gameplay. I think that making modding so important to the franchise, and yielding so much control over the product to the fandom is one of the most brilliant maneuvers Bethesda ever made. It was an experiment with Morrowind, but it has affected the BethSoft open-world games ever since. It's become clearer and clearer with the efforts put forth from Morrowind onward, including Fallout 3 and New Vegas, that with these sorts of games, the most important thing has been to create a persistent world space that felt alive, and that people could use as a jumping-off point for building and customizing to their own vision. I think they've done a pretty damned great job with exactly that, especially with Skyrim. To me, that's not dumbing down or going backwards. That's smartening up and moving forward. A real D&D-type of experience is one in which the players can write their own stories, and TES has grown stronger and stronger in its ability to give players that ability with each iteration of the franchise.
 
zippypinhead said:
(Yes, I know that in Oblivion, quest markers are kind of forced on you, but there are quests that have no markers in the game. Set one as the active quest, et voila! No more quest markers. Or, you know, you could always just mod them away.)

I used one of the HUDs that removed the compass. It was perfect.

zippypinhead said:
And speaking of mods, that's something that has become integral to the full experience of TES, ever since Morrowind, to the point where I feel like at this point, people who can't or won't mod are playing about half the game. Everyone is aware of modding, and everyone talks about modding, but I find it weird that nobody ever openly acknowledges it as a fundamental aspect of TES gameplay. I think that making modding so important to the franchise, and yielding so much control over the product to the fandom is one of the most brilliant maneuvers Bethesda ever made. It was an experiment with Morrowind, but it has affected the BethSoft open-world games ever since. It's become clearer and clearer with the efforts put forth from Morrowind onward, including Fallout 3 and New Vegas, that with these sorts of games, the most important thing has been to create a persistent world space that felt alive, and that people could use as a jumping-off point for building and customizing to their own vision. I think they've done a pretty damned great job with exactly that, especially with Skyrim. To me, that's not dumbing down or going backwards. That's smartening up and moving forward. A real D&D-type of experience is one in which the players can write their own stories, and TES has grown stronger and stronger in its ability to give players that ability with each iteration of the franchise.

I have not ever played an unmodded TES game from starting Morrowind to Skyrim. In fallout I disliked the gun damage and the rate they wore out at, so I stuck an extra zero on the gun damage and 3 zeros on the gun health. Gun combat is now deadly and critters an annoyance, which is how I like it.

So many mods for Oblivion. It was beautiful and rather pornographic with the right mods. Chainbeasts and Tortured Soul were two I very much liked.
 
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Red7227 said:
zippypinhead said:
(Yes, I know that in Oblivion, quest markers are kind of forced on you, but there are quests that have no markers in the game. Set one as the active quest, et voila! No more quest markers. Or, you know, you could always just mod them away.)

I used one of the HUDs that removed the compass. It was perfect.

Me too. I'm really not a fan of the compass. It's funny because my play style is definitely a holdover from spending over a thousand hours in Morrowind. I don't fast travel and I don't use the compass as a matter of habit and immersion. And, luckily, there are easy ways around these options, using mods or console commands, or just plain ol' creative play.

So many mods for Oblivion. It was beautiful and rather pornographic with the right mods. Chainbeasts and Tortured Soul were two I very much liked.

:lol: I was just looking through my mod lists for Morrowind and Oblivion before reading this, and the first thing that popped into my head was, "damn, I'm a virtual pervert!"
 
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A real D&D-type of experience is one in which the players can write their own stories, and TES has grown stronger and stronger in its ability to give players that ability with each iteration of the franchise.

^ that ^ :pray:

TES I think is slowly and slowly (ok, not so slowly) become more white-washed-for-the-masses but I won't deny it and say I'm not at least buying into it a little bit. (Okay, maybe more than a little).
Although I did like the levelling of Morrowwind (Oblivion levelling was awful but I'll hold strong with my unpopular opinion of Oblivion being my favourite TES, I don't care) I really love, and I mean really love, the fact I can start Skyrim with a giant lumbering Orc and come out with a shadowy-sneaky-tinkerbell. :dance:
 
HologramDonut said:
To your general point, DP667, this is becoming an ever-bigger problem in game development in general. As graphics become higher fidelity and production costs go up accordingly, so less time can be devoted to game features. Or at least there is a greater cost associated with any game feature to bring it up to sufficient quality to match the rest of the content. I really want to play Morrowind. I've heard so many people refer to it as their first and favourite TES game. I think it sat right on the tipping point where the graphics were good enough that it was accessible and attractive, without the cost of making assets being prohibitively high. Here's hoping that as the graphical arms races starts to slow down we can start to see games being differentiated more on their features and mechanics and less on how good they look.

It has so little to do with cost/time, it is all 100% to do with becoming mainstream. Bethesda saw the successes of COD games being so mainstream and bringing gaming to the masses, they wanted in on that cash cow so they followed suit. I doubt that many of the dev's wanted it to go that way, but corporations don't pander to the wants of the niche. Which is unfortunate because niche games such as Demon/Dark Souls can do really well. But of course it's much more risky, and risk is not something a company wants to take on when they can just play it safe. Gaming as a whole has become all about the mainstream, all about the casual gamer, fast travel everything and no penalties for fucking up. It's honestly a disaster and sadly the indie market is the only one still innovating. Don't get me wrong there are still some decent AAA game's out there, but TES series is no longer a part of that.

zippypinhead said:
Yeah, I really don't cotton to people bitching about the games that came after Morrowind, based on the experience they had with Morrowind. It mostly seems driven from nostalgia. People really seem to gloss over the suckier parts Morrowind's mechanics, as if they don't exist, or they're charmingly forgivable in some way. Morrowind's roll-based combat mechanics suck. If I'm swinging a stick at as shalk, I should be able to hit that fucking shalk. I may not be able to do much damage to it, but I should at least be able to hit it. Spending a long time trying to find a dungeon based on the shittiest directions ever given is not a fun challenge; it's obnoxious. It's especially annoying because you have to fight off a damned cliffracer every three steps.

People also forget that there's a lot to the mechanics of Oblivion and those games that came after that were merely optional for a person to use, or they were necessary to the function of the game. Marking a NPC as essential was more than just idiot-proofing the game for players, it was also necessary because Oblivion was no longer a static world space like Morrowind was. People moved a lot more as they kept schedules, characters traveled outside of cities, where they could run into real trouble along the way, and cities and towns themselves were less secure, and violent events could happen anywhere. Marking characters essential didn't just prevent them being killed by the careless player, it also prevented them from being killed by a dangerous world, thus breaking the game. As for stuff like fast travel and quest markers, don't use them if you don't like them. (Yes, I know that in Oblivion, quest markers are kind of forced on you, but there are quests that have no markers in the game. Set one as the active quest, et voila! No more quest markers. Or, you know, you could always just mod them away.)

And speaking of mods, that's something that has become integral to the full experience of TES, ever since Morrowind, to the point where I feel like at this point, people who can't or won't mod are playing about half the game. Everyone is aware of modding, and everyone talks about modding, but I find it weird that nobody ever openly acknowledges it as a fundamental aspect of TES gameplay. I think that making modding so important to the franchise, and yielding so much control over the product to the fandom is one of the most brilliant maneuvers Bethesda ever made. It was an experiment with Morrowind, but it has affected the BethSoft open-world games ever since. It's become clearer and clearer with the efforts put forth from Morrowind onward, including Fallout 3 and New Vegas, that with these sorts of games, the most important thing has been to create a persistent world space that felt alive, and that people could use as a jumping-off point for building and customizing to their own vision. I think they've done a pretty damned great job with exactly that, especially with Skyrim. To me, that's not dumbing down or going backwards. That's smartening up and moving forward. A real D&D-type of experience is one in which the players can write their own stories, and TES has grown stronger and stronger in its ability to give players that ability with each iteration of the franchise.

I definitely understand where you're coming from on the nostalgia thing, but I have re-installed this game time and time again just to give it another run as a different class, different plan of action, and different faction. I enjoy it every single time. The only thing that sucks is the graphic fidelity is pretty bad, but mods can definitely fix that.

For me the RNG system was great, I think it only needed some minor changes, it definitely turned a lot of people off from the game within the first few minutes of trying to play a melee character. However once you leveled it up a little you missed much more rarely, so it became a non-issue for me. I just think they should have started out the miss rate a little lower, say 20% miss rate and maybe some of the hits just do less damage to balance it all out, on top of that the system needed to be explained to the player first. Many of my friends I tried introducing the game to would quit until I had the chance to explain it, then they got it and had a blast.

About fast travel and "optional" things that is ridiculous. It is not easy to force yourself to not fast travel or use certain markers when they are in your face, if anything it should at least be a difficulty setting that you choose the moment you first start the game, not something the player has to constantly try to ignore and handicap themselves in the face of these gigantic blaring markers all over the map. I agree some of the directions were atrocious, and if your only goal was completing your current quest then yes it could be a little difficult. But I had a ton of fun getting lost while trying to find objectives, and stumbling upon sidequest after sidequest. I think with this the directions could simply be improved a little with things such as "if you come to balmora you've gone too far" and other landmark specific directions.

Anyways regardless of all of this, the biggest punch in the face for me was the extreme oversimplification of the leveling system, the lack of any skills that actually do much for the type of play you are trying to achieve - since you are stuck picking from a miniscule tree instead of leveling up the abilities you use the most directly. I loved grinding that stuff out and making an extremely well rounded character. Oh well, I know I'm just bitching to nobody because the mainstream eats that shit up and I'm in the miniscule population who actually fell in love with a game for it's unique qualities rather than the ones that it shares with every other AAA out there.
 
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