ACF 2012 Presidential Election Poll

[Neudiin]

This thread needs a cat video =)

 

[Bocefish]

Curious what the women think of O's latest ad:

 

[tubby556]

Ha ha! You have GOT to be shitting me. Do you really mean to let the Fucking John Birch Society (the fascist fucks who produced this video) to teach you civics? I wouldn't trust them to bury a dog turd.

So you can't understand facts then?

Read the Federalist Papers. Then come talk to me.

But then again, $16 trillion in debt, $5.5 trillion in 3.5 years of it due to Obama, 23 million Americans unemployed, the country at war, and people are focused on abortions, gas prices, and socialist healthcare. America is fucked.

Except none of that is true. YOU read the federalist papers. They are opinions among many of the founders, they do not constitute law. You are moving the goal posts...someone posts a bunch of idiotic crap by a Bircher and when I point this out, you go off on some wild tangent.

FOCUS!

Yes those facts are true. America has that much debt, that many unemployed, not to mention almost 45 million on food stamps. You can't deny those facts. Furthermore, you misunderstand what the Federalist Papers are and what they represent. They are the thoughts and reasoning about why the US was created as a republic, why we have the rights we have, why the government role is limited in the Constitution. It's the entire spirit of the founding fathers of this country and why they gave us what they gave us. The Federalist Papers are not law and I never said that they were law.

 

[AmberCutie]

I'm not sure this thread will survive another 2 weeks til election day without going the way of the ponies...

 

[tubby556]

Yeah, you're a bit warped there, bud. I have my issues too but surely you realize your complete lack of remorse over killing so many people isn't the standard human reaction.

I have no remorse over killing my country's enemies. I had a job to do and I did it very well. I never hesitated while under fire. I took the fire to the enemy and destroyed every one of them that I could. Every enemy I killed meant more Americans would live. My only regret is the enemies I couldn't kill.

As for war, I'm anti-war and think everyone who is pro-war are sick, twisted fucks. Being anti-war to me means we do everything practical within our power to avoid going to war over an issue short of rolling over and taking it. We must defend ourselves but other solutions should be attempted before an act of war is taken. Unfortunately there are going to be wars so I'll support the ones that are justified and where attempts to avoid war were attempted and exhausted (e.g. the other rumble in the sandbox in Afghanistan). Even being anti-war, I am very much FOR supporting those who serve because I have an enormous amount of respect for the majority of them because of the commitment they've made to preserving this country and it's people.

Being anti war to me means under no circumstances is there to be war. Being pro war to me means when war is necessary, supporting that effort without question. The problem with the current war in the Middle East is the enemy we are fighting is not diplomatic. They will not stop until it's a Muslim world or Americans are all dead. They will not negotiate, they will not tolerate our values and our beliefs, they will not coexist. Diplomacy will not work, it must be war. They want to kill Americans. Period. The soldiers do not have the support of their homeland.

 

[schlmoe]

I'm not sure this thread will survive another 2 weeks til election day without going the way of the ponies...

I'll try to restrain myself :thumbleft:

 

[SatanJonez]

 

[Evvie]

:shock:

 

[ScarletVixen]

I cried laughing at the perfect timing of this :lol:

 

[Bocefish]

Thank goodness it's less than 2 weeks away! Countdown to the 2012 Presidential Election

 

[AmberCutie]

Thank goodness it's less than 2 weeks away! Countdown to the 2012 Presidential Election

Lol fuck yer face, I simplified. :mrgreen:

 

[JoleneBrody]

Curious what the women think of O's latest ad:

I'll admit I chuckled but I thought it was pretty tasteless. Sexual innuendos belong in sitcoms, not politics. With the super packs I know a lot of these ads are out of their hands but I really hope before the next election that something is done.
Plus Joe Biden had to publicly embarrass Obama to get him to endorse gay marriage. I love that angry little man. As far as personal preferences, not policy, I wish Biden was in the front seat. He doesn't fuck around!

 

[IsabellaSnow]

I have no remorse over killing my country's enemies. I had a job to do and I did it very well. I never hesitated while under fire. I took the fire to the enemy and destroyed every one of them that I could. Every enemy I killed meant more Americans would live. My only regret is the enemies I couldn't kill.

Sure in the heat of battle people kill quickly. But I have not met anyone in the army or marines who has had no remorse over killing and has had the attitude of "kill everyone who's against us". You've got an extremely warped mindset and to be honest it sounds like you just enjoyed the killing part of it and are justifying it to yourself by saying you're saving people in your country. You are one of the people who abuses power for your own gratification.

Being anti war to me means under no circumstances is there to be war. Being pro war to me means when war is necessary, supporting that effort without question. The problem with the current war in the Middle East is the enemy we are fighting is not diplomatic. They will not stop until it's a Muslim world or Americans are all dead. They will not negotiate, they will not tolerate our values and our beliefs, they will not coexist. Diplomacy will not work, it must be war. They want to kill Americans. Period. The soldiers do not have the support of their homeland.

You really do have absolutely no idea. These people are in fact people, they are not animals that reasoning will not work with! We invaded their countries, there is no decent reason for being there and the reasons are pretty twisted. "They" do not want to kill Americans. A small group of them do. You're American and I think you're a complete idiot/psycho. I am not going to go around saying that every American is like that. I can't see how a very small group of people from somewhere around the middle east being terrorists means that the rest of the countries around that area deserve to be invaded and have their homes ripped apart. I can't see how somehow you think that every soldier you would have killed is saving an American life, when you're the invader, you are the threat to their homes and families.

Anyway, there is no point trying to reason with someone who clearly has no reason of empathy. You are trying to make excuses for your bad acts and thoughts by blaming everyone else around you.

This thread has definitely been derailed so before Amber bans it, Tubby you have made your point, we will never agree with it, all you're going to do is upset everyone and maybe get yourself banned if you carry on telling people you enjoy killing and feel no remorse and the amount of other crap you've been spouting. We get it. You're a cunt. Now please move on.

 

[Anonymous]

 

[SatanJonez]

 

[Neudiin]

Republican Candidate Said What About Rape Now? this segment just baffles me....I mean completely. how can any sane person think like this? Bring on Project Mayhem please?


also

 

[mynameisbob84]

And there I was thinking the worst this thread could throw at me was Boce's political views (sorry Boce :dance... I'm so naive sometimes :?

 

[Evvie]

 

[MrRodry]

:handgestures-salute:

 

[Nordling]

Curious what the women think of O's latest ad:

I'll admit I chuckled but I thought it was pretty tasteless. Sexual innuendos belong in sitcoms, not politics. With the super packs I know a lot of these ads are out of their hands but I really hope before the next election that something is done.
Plus Joe Biden had to publicly embarrass Obama to get him to endorse gay marriage. I love that angry little man. As far as personal preferences, not policy, I wish Biden was in the front seat. He doesn't fuck around!

Being the biased person I am, I kind of think the existing team is pretty cool. Obama for the cool thoughtful, careful dignity and Biden as the enfant terrible (not really). Seriously, while for many, the President was slow in coming to the right conclusions about gay marriage, DADT and a few other things, I'm not sure things could have happened any faster if he'd acted like a bull in a china shop. His enemies on the right are very powerful and I am quite amazed at how much he's accomplished even WITH the filibuster going against him no matter what he does.

 

[Jupiter551]

Being anti war to me means under no circumstances is there to be war. Being pro war to me means when war is necessary, supporting that effort without question. The problem with the current war in the Middle East is the enemy we are fighting is not diplomatic. They will not stop until it's a Muslim world or Americans are all dead. They will not negotiate, they will not tolerate our values and our beliefs, they will not coexist. Diplomacy will not work, it must be war. They want to kill Americans. Period. The soldiers do not have the support of their homeland.

You uhh, do realise that you're talking about people whose country you invaded and occupied. By the way, it isn't the role of people in a free state to support a war, or those fighting it, regardless of the morals of that war. That's for dictatorships and it's called PROPAGANDA. By that logic, German citizens would have been fully supportive of the SS and their mission to murder millions of innocents, regardless of whether they personally agreed with it ("support the troops!"). Uhh no, how about let the troops know that they're responsible for their choices, and that "doing your job" and "just following orders" weren't valid defenses at any warcrime tribunal in the last 100 years, so why should they be for justifying participating in a meaningless war? That "support the troops" rhetoric has done nothing but serve the interests of those who declared and prolonged the war in the first place. You guys really did turn into a neo-fascist state for a while, and as for you tubby, you're just fucked in the head.
bscene-tolietclaw:

 

[Mirra]

Being anti war to me means under no circumstances is there to be war. Being pro war to me means when war is necessary, supporting that effort without question. The problem with the current war in the Middle East is the enemy we are fighting is not diplomatic. They will not stop until it's a Muslim world or Americans are all dead. They will not negotiate, they will not tolerate our values and our beliefs, they will not coexist. Diplomacy will not work, it must be war. They want to kill Americans. Period. The soldiers do not have the support of their homeland.

You uhh, do realise that you're talking about people whose country you invaded and occupied. By the way, it isn't the role of people in a free state to support a war, or those fighting it, regardless of the morals of that war. That's for dictatorships and it's called PROPAGANDA. By that logic, German citizens would have been fully supportive of the SS and their mission to murder millions of innocents, regardless of whether they personally agreed with it ("support the troops!"). Uhh no, how about let the troops know that they're responsible for their choices, and that "doing your job" and "just following orders" weren't valid defenses at any warcrime tribunal in the last 100 years, so why should they be for justifying participating in a meaningless war? That "support the troops" rhetoric has done nothing but serve the interests of those who declared and prolonged the war in the first place. You guys really did turn into a neo-fascist state for a while, and as for you tubby, you're just fucked in the head.
bscene-tolietclaw:

This just went way too off topic for me. I think people who want to discuss the recent wars and other military action should take it to a new thread. This is still supposed to be about the Election and while it's side tracked into a "HOW CAN YOU THINK THAT?" thread, let's not make it into a thread about the recent wars in the middle east, eh?

 

[Jupiter551]

Yeah, you're a bit warped there, bud. I have my issues too but surely you realize your complete lack of remorse over killing so many people isn't the standard human reaction. As for war, I'm anti-war and think everyone who is pro-war are sick, twisted fucks. Being anti-war to me means we do everything practical within our power to avoid going to war over an issue short of rolling over and taking it. We must defend ourselves but other solutions should be attempted before an act of war is taken. Unfortunately there are going to be wars so I'll support the ones that are justified and where attempts to avoid war were attempted and exhausted (e.g. the other rumble in the sandbox in Afghanistan). Even being anti-war, I am very much FOR supporting those who serve because I have an enormous amount of respect for the majority of them because of the commitment they've made to preserving this country and it's people.

Yes excuse me for going off-topic and mentioning the war Or was it because I questioned unconditional military support?

 

[Neudiin]

remind you of anyone?

 

[Nordling]

Yeah, honestly, how can we discuss the election without including the wars--and myriad other topics. They're all germane. Otherwise, everyone should have just voted in the OP poll and not posted anything else.

 

[Bocefish]

By the way, it isn't the role of people in a free state to support a war, or those fighting it, regardless of the morals of that war. That's for dictatorships and it's called PROPAGANDA. By that logic, German citizens would have been fully supportive of the SS and their mission to murder millions of innocents, regardless of whether they personally agreed with it ("support the troops!"). Uhh no, how about let the troops know that they're responsible for their choices, and that "doing your job" and "just following orders" weren't valid defenses at any warcrime tribunal in the last 100 years, so why should they be for justifying participating in a meaningless war? That "support the troops" rhetoric has done nothing but serve the interests of those who declared and prolonged the war in the first place. You guys really did turn into a neo-fascist state for a while

Sounds like you didn't support your troops that went to support the war effort then, right? Did you protest against sending one of the four most substantial combat force contingents during the 2003 invasion of Iraq?

The initial Australian force consisted of; three Royal Australian Navy ships, 500 special forces soldiers, P-3 Orion maritime patrol aircraft, C-130 Hercules transport aircraft and No. 75 Squadron RAAF (which included 14 F/A-18 Hornet fighters). Combat forces committed to Operation Falconer for the 2003 Invasion were withdrawn during 2003. Under the name Operation Catalyst, Australian combat troops were redeployed to Iraq in 2005, however, and assumed responsibility for supporting Iraqi security forces in one of Iraq's southern provinces. These troops began withdrawing from Iraq on 1 June 2008 and were completely withdrawn by 28 July 2009.[2]

 

[Mirra]

Yeah, honestly, how can we discuss the election without including the wars--and myriad other topics. They're all germane. Otherwise, everyone should have just voted in the OP poll and not posted anything else.

Discussing the war and how it pertains to the election works for me. Discussing the war and the ideas of misguided support for the troops as a whole is a completely different topic. Up to that point, I felt we were close enough to topic that we'd get back around to it. Once Jupiter brought up his opinions I felt like it was a clean departure from the wars and their relation to this election. I am not saying "Don't discuss the wars!" I am not saying "I don't like your opinion so gtfo!" I replied that way because as I was typing up my own reply to Jupiter I realized it didn't have anything to do with Obama, Romney, Johnson, or even how Boce and/or tubby can feel the way they do. Sorry about that. :roll:

Edit: Not to mention, Romney seems to have transformed into a parrot on the topic of the wars at this point. I don't know any of the "3rd party" candidates' opinions on it though so feel free to add those to the discussion so the wars can actually be a bit more relevant to anything besides tubby's horrifying statements.

 

[Jupiter551]

By the way, it isn't the role of people in a free state to support a war, or those fighting it, regardless of the morals of that war. That's for dictatorships and it's called PROPAGANDA. By that logic, German citizens would have been fully supportive of the SS and their mission to murder millions of innocents, regardless of whether they personally agreed with it ("support the troops!"). Uhh no, how about let the troops know that they're responsible for their choices, and that "doing your job" and "just following orders" weren't valid defenses at any warcrime tribunal in the last 100 years, so why should they be for justifying participating in a meaningless war? That "support the troops" rhetoric has done nothing but serve the interests of those who declared and prolonged the war in the first place. You guys really did turn into a neo-fascist state for a while

Sounds like you didn't support your troops that went to support the war effort then, right?

I love how there's veiled intimidation in that question, as if not declaring my undying support for the armed forces brands me a traitor.

We have never had that attitude of "agree with us or get out" that you guys seemed to be unable to seperate from your society since 9/11. Here, it is perfectly reasonable and normal to think the war is, and always has been a stupid, pointless exercise without having to justify that we "support the troops!" before we get lynched.

Ask yourself this - why is "support the troops" even a thing, unless it's a right-wing propaganda tactic to brand those objectionable to the war as unpatriotic?

Why does supporting the troops not mean getting them the FUCK out of a pointless war they should never have been exposed to, instead of an implicit excusal of having continued to occupy a foreign country?

 

[Jupiter551]

Yeah, honestly, how can we discuss the election without including the wars--and myriad other topics. They're all germane. Otherwise, everyone should have just voted in the OP poll and not posted anything else.

Discussing the war and how it pertains to the election works for me. Discussing the war and the ideas of misguided support for the troops as a whole is a completely different topic. Up to that point, I felt we were close enough to topic that we'd get back around to it. Once Jupiter brought up his opinions I felt like it was a clean departure from the wars and their relation to this election. I am not saying "Don't discuss the wars!" I am not saying "I don't like your opinion so gtfo!" I replied that way because as I was typing up my own reply to Jupiter I realized it didn't have anything to do with Obama, Romney, Johnson, or even how Boce and/or tubby can feel the way they do. Sorry about that. :roll:

Edit: Not to mention, Romney seems to have transformed into a parrot on the topic of the wars at this point. I don't know any of the "3rd party" candidates' opinions on it though so feel free to add those to the discussion so the wars can actually be a bit more relevant to anything besides tubby's horrifying statements.

Fine, but since you were talking about the war (and not in relation to the election) and Tubby replied (not in relation to the election), I'd appreciate not suggesting that I'm suddenly off-topic and I should start another thread.

 

[Bocefish]

By the way, it isn't the role of people in a free state to support a war, or those fighting it, regardless of the morals of that war. That's for dictatorships and it's called PROPAGANDA. By that logic, German citizens would have been fully supportive of the SS and their mission to murder millions of innocents, regardless of whether they personally agreed with it ("support the troops!"). Uhh no, how about let the troops know that they're responsible for their choices, and that "doing your job" and "just following orders" weren't valid defenses at any warcrime tribunal in the last 100 years, so why should they be for justifying participating in a meaningless war? That "support the troops" rhetoric has done nothing but serve the interests of those who declared and prolonged the war in the first place. You guys really did turn into a neo-fascist state for a while

Sounds like you didn't support your troops that went to support the war effort then, right?

I love how there's veiled intimidation in that question, as if not declaring my undying support for the armed forces brands me a traitor.

We have never had that attitude of "agree with us or get out" that you guys seemed to be unable to seperate from your society since 9/11. Here, it is perfectly reasonable and normal to think the war is, and always has been a stupid, pointless exercise without having to justify that we "support the troops!" before we get lynched.

Ask yourself this - why is "support the troops" even a thing, unless it's a right-wing propaganda tactic to brand those objectionable to the war as unpatriotic?

Why does supporting the troops not mean getting them the FUCK out of a pointless war they should never have been exposed to, instead of an implicit excusal of having continued to occupy a foreign country?

You sound like those assholes that spit on returning Vietnam vets with your rhetoric.

The US Military is now 100% volunteer, however, they have no choice but to follow orders once enlisted or face Court-martial.