New Chaturbate Promotion Service. I'm looking for testers and reviewers.

[dilligaf0]

On a separate note, I have some beachfront property in Arizona I'll sell you cheap.

 

[Puffin]

How will bots make you go to the first page if greys are NO longer counted for??

It seems, reading between the lines of Steve's replies that it is now going to be full membership bots.

Purpose of the 'bots' is to increase placement, with the idea that increased placement come increased real members and thus increased tokens.

1. I personally find this to be really unethical.

Agreed.

For any model considering this, I would draw attention to Clause 19 of Chaturbate model terms which allows termination without any reason.

 

[Violet Dawn]

I've had like 2000 people in my room once and didn't make anything. But I've had 40 in my room multiple times with making very good payouts. I say this because it's a pretty common experience, and I really don't think anyone would pay for more viewers because it doesn't guarantee money.

 

[SteveR]

I have some beachfront property in Arizona I'll sell you cheap.

I forgot to mention, bots can help you sell real estate too! Of course, I'd want to take 100% of the profits while you do all the work

I personally find this to be really unethical.

Is that because you see it as cheating Chaturbate's system when everyone else is playing by the "rules?" What does it mean when Chaturbate changes those rules arbitrarily, like it just did? Suppose a performer worked hard to build a large anonymous audience, and they pay her mostly in Amazon gifts? She would never rank well under the current system.

Or what about performers that have a really small group of loyal and generous fans? Should they be listed lower then someone that has a large number of users with tokens but they never tip?

Or what if someday Chaturbate ranks viewers from certain countries as worth more? Like they currently do for referral/affiliate payouts?

What about a new performer that ranks higher than someone that's being a loyal Chaturbate performer for years? Do you find that fair?

The ranking algorithm is arbitrary and the rules are what Chaturbate says they are today. Is it ethical to break those rules? I agree that it's unethical to break many rules in life (stealing, harming people, etc.), I personally do not find it unethical to manipulate arbitrary algorithms in business. My goal is to help a worthy performer that isn't getting noticed because of that arbitrary algorithm decision.

If you're happy with how Chaturbate ranks rooms (and the fact that they can change that at a whim) and don't want to rock the boat, then great, carry on with life. If you understand the risks and potential rewards of using bots and want to venture into that grey area, then maybe a service like mine is of interest.

Bots are a complex issue. If nothing else, I hope this discussion raises everyones awareness about what is possible and makes them think a bit. If it's not me doing it, someone else will do it or is already using them. I had hoped that independent performs would be interested, but I'm getting the impression that for many of you that isn't the case. That's fine. There will always be a few willing to take risks if the rewards make sense. Studios might also be a better fit.

To everyone that has offered constructive feedback and criticisms: Thank You. I've learned a lot from the discussion.

I also appreciate everyone being cautious and warning newcomers to be wary of scams. If you believe my bot service falls into the category of "scam" then please continue your efforts.

 

[SteveR]

I've had like 2000 people in my room once and didn't make anything. But I've had 40 in my room multiple times with making very good payouts. I say this because it's a pretty common experience, and I really don't think anyone would pay for more viewers because it doesn't guarantee money.

Thanks for sharing that insight LunaTuna! It makes sense and is exactly the type of thing I am planning to test out.

I wonder if it's a type of bystander effect? If there are many people in a room then everyone assumes someone else will tip, so no ones does. But if it's a small room then the viewers feel more personally responsible. I hadn't considered that. Maybe I should work on bots that can rank you lower so you aren't noticed as much and get smaller rooms? That would be different!

 

[Empress Mika]

I forgot to mention, bots can help you sell real estate too! Of course, I'd want to take 100% of the profits while you do all the work


Is that because you see it as cheating Chaturbate's system when everyone else is playing by the "rules?" What does it mean when Chaturbate changes those rules arbitrarily, like it just did? Suppose a performer worked hard to build a large anonymous audience, and they pay her mostly in Amazon gifts? She would never rank well under the current system.

Or what about performers that have a really small group of loyal and generous fans? Should they be listed lower then someone that has a large number of users with tokens but they never tip?

Or what if someday Chaturbate ranks viewers from certain countries as worth more? Like they currently do for referral/affiliate payouts?

What about a new performer that ranks higher than someone that's being a loyal Chaturbate performer for years? Do you find that fair?

The ranking algorithm is arbitrary and the rules are what Chaturbate says they are today. Is it ethical to break those rules? I agree that it's unethical to break many rules in life (stealing, harming people, etc.), I personally do find it unethical to manipulate arbitrary algorithms in business. My goal is help a worthy performer that isn't getting noticed because of that arbitrary algorithm decision.

If you're happy with how Chaturbate ranks rooms (and the fact that they can change that at a whim) and don't want to rock the boat, then great, carry on with life. If you understand the risks and potential rewards of using bots and want to venture into that grey area, then maybe a service like mine is of interest.

Bots are a complex issue. If nothing else, I hope this discussion raises everyones awareness about what is possible and makes them think a bit. If it's not me doing it, someone else will do it or is already using them. I had hoped that independent performs would be interested, but I'm getting the impression that for many of you that isn't the case. That's fine. There will always be a few willing to take risks if the rewards make sense. Studios might also be a better fit.

To everyone that has offered constructive feedback and criticisms: Thank You. I've learned a lot from the discussion.

I also appreciate everyone being cautious and warning newcomers to be wary of scams. If you believe my bot service falls into the category of "scam" then please continue your efforts.

I think it's safe to say that many of the cam girls and boys that use this forum do caming as their full time career or serious side job. I have yet to see ONE person here respond favorably to your post. I think that says a lot and should inspire you to re-think about what you're doing. I can only re-state my original conclusion in that I hope you do not implement this service and instead try to find something positive to contribute to our caming community. If your goal is to really and I quote, "help a worthy performer" - I think there are much better ways to do that then what you are currently suggesting. At the very least, there should be no potential risk of getting banned nor should it disrespect those models that have worked hard for a consistent page 1 placement.

Questioning my ethics was not the point of my post. Of all the points I brought up to you, this is the one piece of my post that you chose to focus on? Come on.

 

[gudheadt]

i think we can all agree that you are just trying to justify what you are doing...

Suppose a performer worked hard to build a large anonymous audience, and they pay her mostly in Amazon gifts? She would never rank well under the current system.

i will bet you a my top hat that this have Literaly never happend to any, i have gotten giftcards from anon users, but it have Neve been my main sorce of income that way. more like 00.0000000001% lol.

What about a new performer that ranks higher than someone that's being a loyal Chaturbate performer for years? Do you find that fair?

as sour it might be for a camgirl/camguy to relize, then people want new stuff, and there for new people that are decent looking will be rankede high, thats just how it is. do i think its fair? Yes ofcourse i do.... i had the Exact same thing happend to me when i where new..
experience does not mean quality.

If it's not me doing it, someone else will do it or is already using them

yes and if you are not the one person stealing from the grosery store then some one else will do... just because some one else does it Do not make it okay. and its a weird way to think in my eyes...

There will always be a few willing to take risks if the rewards make sense.

there will surely be some naive cam people out there that might fall for this and thats just the world we live in. but i will also bet that if you told them about how Other stream industries treat people that bot, then they would say no to your offer....

further more, you said that you where going to contact the suport about this, did you do it and what where there response? that is one thing that would be nice to know before any one is going to jump in to this projekt...

 

[gudheadt]

i mean, all these things that you Clearely have not done research about, would have been a good start before posting on this forum.
stuff like.
Is this even legan in the eyes of Chaturbate?
is there anything that could prevent this from working? ("new angerythm" even tho it have been there for over a month i think)

like just that you have not done a little research about this, just further tells me that you are trying to scam people or that you are Extremely naive, and think you can make a quick buck off a cam girl/boy.

 

[Puffin]

Bots are a complex issue. If nothing else, I hope this discussion raises everyones awareness about what is possible and makes them think a bit. If it's not me doing it, someone else will do it or is already using them. I had hoped that independent performs would be interested, but I'm getting the impression that for many of you that isn't the case. That's fine. There will always be a few willing to take risks if the rewards make sense. Studios might also be a better fit.

To everyone that has offered constructive feedback and criticisms: Thank You. I've learned a lot from the discussion.

Thanks. The discussion has taught me a few things and made me think a lot - way more then covered in this post.
It is only the last few days that it became known to me how widespread bots on Chaturbate had become and hence Chaturbate's change in the room count algorithm. However, such a change on CB is only a temporary fix because bots with full membership are not difficult to create. Maybe Chaturbate of the future will use something token based like camscore.

Studios are likely to show interest in gaming the system, many of them are unethical from inception.

So here is an idea. Contact studios, get them to use your bots, then either through detection or being directly reported they get banned on CB.
Getting unethical studios banned would be a positive contribution to the camming community!
Maybe even CB would be interested in creating a type of honeypot and paying you along the way?!

 

[gudheadt]

such a change on CB is only a temporary fix because bots with full membership are not difficult to create. Maybe Chaturbate of the future will use something token based like camscore.

there new system is baced on people in the room that currently have tokens in there account, not membership/verifacation or if you have upgradede your spending limit. so unless you can produce a large enougn amounght of bots with tokens in the account (mind you the smallest amounght of money you can spend on tokens is 9dollars i think) so unless you can somehow get those tokens destrubetede out to accounts, or want to spend a 9dollars pr bot times how many bots you want. then there new system is actully pretty bot proof so far.

 

[Puffin]

Having to have tokens in the account certainly highers the bar. One effect will be to increase the significance on accounts with tokens, so just a handful of bots with tokens will have a big effect on placement. It seems likely that gaming of the system will continue.

 

[DeezNA]

Anyone stupid enough to buy into this snake oil salesman's bullshit is shooting their own foot.

Why there is even a conversation giving this guy attention or debating the topic is utterly mind-blowing, more so why someone who literally leeches income off of the naivety and ambition of newer models is not fucking banned here yet.

If anyone is still reading this and is thinking "hmm... maybe this guy's service has a point...", think of your room like a restaurant. You have quirky regulars, you have window shoppers, etc. This guy wants to basically fill your restaurant with mannequins so that it looks like people want to go there... but really, it's just full of creepy mannequins. Now, on the off chance that some kinky tourists kinda like eating next to a table full of mannequins and you miraculously make some money off of this... and that's a big "if" that you are paying this scumbag money for after his incredibly generous Two-day Trial (TM)... other models will immediately copy you. The default number for what is a "good room count" will double, the front-page you were on will be gone within days. You are not helping your room by perpetuating this bullshit, you are hurting the community and, subsequently, yourself.

There's a reason why other live-streaming communities shun these practices. "Oh, well it's technically not illegal..." Fuck right the hell off.

 

[Gen]

Why there is even a conversation giving this guy attention or debating the topic is utterly mind-blowing, more so why someone who literally leeches income off of the naivety and ambition of newer models is not fucking banned here yet.

Having a discussion about it, and sharing concerns/reasoning why it's a bad idea, seems useful for future newbie models who come along (or who read but don't post) and think it seems like a good idea. More useful than just saying "fuck off" and banning him, anyway, in my opinion. I agree with your point about "if this really worked, everyone would do it" and think it's a useful point to add as to why it's a bad idea!

 

[DeezNA]

My point being, @GenXoxo , that we can still have a conversation on the topic without having to listen to him justify exploitation. If this trap is so alluring and these salesmen are so charismatic, it doesn't really matter what we say - he'll just PM them or find some other grimy tactic.

I'm all for helpful and informative discussions, trust me, my history on this forum should attest to that. I just don't see what he really has to contribute when all of us (himself included) know he's just here to try to take advantage of us. Every time he speaks he justifies his sales pitch - if we're really concerned about models that would fall for this on the first sales pitch, the more he bolds and italicizes "FREE", the more alluring his little scam looks. It feels any questions to him directly (at this stage in the discussion) are either rhetorical or ones that anyone with experience could answer and rather then gain clarity, they just provide new venues for him to manipulate. So, really, the only reason to keep him around is to kick him some more.

I'm in no way suggesting to lock the thread or halt discussion at all, in fact I was participating in it by adding a new analogy and I highly support education on the matter, I just don't see why he is given more time to advertise his "product", that's all. Obviously it's not my call anyway, so.... *shrug*

 

[Teagan]

Im just gonna reiterate what Bianca said. Any ladies reading this please do not do anything like this. From this guy or any other ever. If CB finds out, and they WILL, CB will ban you immediately without any warning, will never let you back on their site, and whatever money you made during that pay period will disappear cause you broke the rules. There is no ifs ands or buts about this. You will lose your job there permanently. CB doesnt have to spell something out in their TOS either to ban you so do not listen to anyone telling you that you are fine cause it's not there in big bold letters. They can ban you for anything at anytime with no reason no matter what the TOS says and using bots is absolutely something they will do it for.

These guys come along all the time with their ideas and plain and simply it is always just to piggy back off of our money. Do not let them. They can put the words rules or scam in quotes as a sales tactic, they can try to make you think it's so unfair where you are ranked, they can try to make you think the rules where you work are arbitrary and it's not unethical to break them, they will try to call it a grey area when it is anything but, they will pretty much say and do anything to try to get in your pocketbook and that's all it is. They want a cut of your money. This guy is transparent as fuck and a complete scam that is risking your job on an entire site. We all know camming has good days and bad days and do you really feel like handing over money from your good nights to someone who did nothing for you?

And to you Steve....just stop. Anyone with a brain can see what you are trying to do. If you are such a person as to go through with this ridiculous idea and put models in the position to be banned (and you know it will) then you are nothing more than an asshole. Create something within CBs rule system to actually help models instead of trying to get something for nothing that you know will only end in across the board bannings for all. You trying to actually justify any of this as maybe not being so bad or that you just need some rebellious camgirls to test it out is pathetic.

 

[SteveR]

Questioning my ethics was not the point of my post. Of all the points I brought up to you, this is the one piece of my post that you chose to focus on? Come on.

I chose to focus on the ethics because I think that's at the heart of the matter. And for me personally, if I'm convinced that using bots is in fact unethical, then I would stop.

think of your room like a restaurant. You have quirky regulars, you have window shoppers, etc. This guy wants to basically fill your restaurant with mannequins so that it looks like people want to go there... but really, it's just full of creepy mannequins.

DeezNa, I like the restaurant analogy. And you are correct, but you missed the main reason why the bots are helpful. Yes, having a big crowd in your room might help, but to continue your analogy, your restaurant is located in the middle of small town Iowa (no offence to anyone from Iowa) so no one sees it or visits you. Because of the Chaturbate ranking algorithm works, when your restaurant is full (of humans or bots), it's magically relocated to Times Square in New York City and now you have thousands of real people that will see your restaurant and take a look. If your food is no good, they aren't going to stay or buy anything, but the point of the bots is to put you in the prime location.

The default number for what is a "good room count" will double, the front-page you were on will be gone within days.

You are right, if everyone did it then it would be a useless battle to keep up. Not to mention it's an arms race with Chaturbate who will change their ranking algorithm (as they've already done) or find a way to block the bots, which the bot maker then works around.

highly support education on the matter, I just don't see why he is given more time to advertise his "product", that's all.

I agree that the discussion is helpful for the community. I'd prefer to keep things civil and avoid name calling, but I understand your anger.

And you are correct that continuing the discussion does help to promote my service, although that wasn't my intension, I was continuing the discussion primarily to correct misunderstandings. It has also given me a lot to think about and as you will see in my next post...

 

[SteveR]

You’ve convinced me. I will no longer pursue offering bots.

The feedback has been very clear that this is not something the community wants. And the risk to performers that could potentially get banned is too high.

I do honestly want to create something that is helpful for cam performers, and I will be starting a separate thread asking for suggestions. This is what I should have done in the first place instead of going off to spend time/money developing something that clearly isn’t wanted.

I realize this discussion might have colored your view of me, but I truly hope that you can forgive me for my misguided error.

If you do have any helpful suggestions for how I might actually make things better for performers, I’d really like to hear them. Let’s try to create something positive from this.

I sincerely apologize to anyone that was offered by my proposed bot idea or that perceived that I was trying to take advantage of anyone or put them at risk unknowingly.

Again, thanks everyone for the healthy discussion.

Sincerely,
Steve

 

[Teagan]

And there it is. Always the same. Keep notes here ladies and gents who cam. You will see it time and time again. It's a pattern by people who want in on your game and hard earned money. Dont fall for it. The first idea is a failure no one would want so they try to turn it into something else. Bait and switch kinda deal. Still a scam though every time. Here we have the classic switch to starting a new thread of asking for help for an idea of something we would want in a transparent attempt to get your money. Keep your wits about you and do not give them anything. They will again just use key buzzwords and phrases like "help me help you," "lets do this together," "free trial," and so on.

Sorry Steve I will not give you ideas. Immerse yourself in this business and get to know it inside and out. Know the RULES and follow them of the sites. Figure out something new and innovative that this business is lacking and create it. Earn it and the only way you do that is by putting in the time, effort, and work yourself. We are not here to give you ideas to get you money out of our pockets. That's ridiculous to expect from other people frankly and again just shows who you are and what your true intentions are here. You want anyone to have a different view of you and who you are then actually prove it and the way to do that is not asking for us to come up with ideas for you. Nor is it by saying things like "could potentially get banned" or "perceived that I was trying to take advantage" cause it would get anyone banned and you know and were told that and it's not a perception we have but what you are actually trying to do. Own up to your shit man at the very least. You are clearly trying to come up with something we would pay you for.

 

[Poison_Ivy21]

If you do have any helpful suggestions for how I might actually make things better for performers, I’d really like to hear them.

Make a member account, load it with tokens, and tip some models.

 

[SteveR]

Here is why I hope people will believe that I was not and am not trying to scam anyone:

1. I was offering my service for free. In fact, I wasn't even an official service yet, I was hoping to find people willing to test it out and see if it made them more money.

2. I proposed asking for a percent of any increase in earnings. That way if the performer didn't make any additional money, I wouldn't either. I wasn't asking for any money upfront or a flat fee.

3. If the performer made money, I was completely trusting them to pay me. How easy would it have been for someone to use my service for two weeks, make lots of extra money, then decide not to pay me?

4. Instead of approaching girls directly in the apparent hopes of "scamming" them, I posted it here in a public forum for feedback and debate. I think everyone would agree I would have probably had more success talking to unsuspecting girls directly. But instead I did it here in public.

5. I listened to your feedback and concerns and I changed my mind. This is at a substantial cost in terms of money (servers, proxies, about $300) and my time (about 3 weeks of development). I have mouths to feed and mortgages to pay as well.

6. I'm not going to sell my bot software to any studios. I could easily try to recoup some of my costs by letting my system lose on Chaturbate without any regard for the consequences. I'm not going to do that.

7. I'm sticking around to defend myself. Wouldn't a scammer just have left or created a new account under a different name?

8. I'm asking for advice on how I can apply my abilities for something that would genuinely help.

Teagan, I understand where you're coming from. Camgirls have been taken advantage of since the beginning of Internet history and it requires that you be skeptical until you have proof otherwise. I hope that you'll keep an open mind.

Immerse yourself in this business and get to know it inside and out.

I do appreciate that you are actually trying to help and giving me good advice. So thank you.

Immersing myself in the industry is what I've been doing (and I don't mean watching shows, I mean reading and listening). Let me share the story of how I came up with the bot idea.

In researching the industry and looking for problems that performers need help with, I found a lot of threads of girls (usually new) looking for advice on how to get more viewers. A pretty common question/problem I think you'll agree. I imagine that camming for hours without any tips isn't a lot of fun. So, the problem I thought worth trying to help with is to get more viewers. The most obvious way I could think of is to get on the first page, so you are seen by more viewers. On most sites the numbers drop off pretty dramatically, so that supported my theory that it's all about getting on that first page. On average Chaturbate has about 2000 peformers, and the top 20 (1%) of performers seem to be making most of the money. To get in that top 1% you need a lot of viewers (or now, viewers with tokens). Using a bot to artificially increase your viewers, and get in that top 1% seemed like a good solution. It wasn't again the TOS. Of course, my mistake was not understanding that it would probably get a performer banned even though it wasn't strictly against the rules. I'm glad I posted here and asked first like an honest and responsible person.

Here's an idea:

For any performers looking to get on the first page, the new system seems pretty easy to game if you're willing to spend about $100-$200. Get 10-20 friends to create accounts and give them money to buy tokens. Then have them watch your shows.

Another variation, would be for a group of camgirls (who have tokens in their accounts and I assume count towards the rankings) to work together and watch each others shows. If everyone watched each others shows (had a window open) a group of 10-20 could probably ensure they were all on the first page, or at least a lot higher in the rankings. Would that work?

Steve

 

[RebeccaT]

Another variation, would be for a group of camgirls (who have tokens in their accounts and I assume count towards the rankings) to work together and watch each others shows. If everyone watched each others shows (had a window open) a group of 10-20 could probably ensure they were all on the first page, or at least a lot higher in the rankings. Would that work?

I remember broadcasters trying this on another website...they even had a daily rota for whose room they would sit in. They were all banned.

 

[DeezNA]

1. I was offering my service for free. In fact, I wasn't even an official service yet, I was hoping to find people willing to test it out and see if it made them more money.

2. I proposed asking for a percent of any increase in earnings. That way if the performer didn't make any additional money, I wouldn't either. I wasn't asking for any money upfront or a flat fee.

3. If the performer made money, I was completely trusting them to pay me. How easy would it have been for someone to use my service for two weeks, make lots of extra money, then decide not to pay me?

4. Instead of approaching girls directly in the apparent hopes of "scamming" them, I posted it here in a public forum for feedback and debate. I think everyone would agree I would have probably had more success talking to unsuspecting girls directly. But instead I did it here in public.

5. I listened to your feedback and concerns and I changed my mind. This is at a substantial cost in terms of money (servers, proxies, about $300) and my time (about 3 weeks of development). I have mouths to feed and mortgages to pay as well.

6. I'm not going to sell my bot software to any studios. I could easily try to recoup some of my costs by letting my system lose on Chaturbate without any regard for the consequences. I'm not going to do that.

7. I'm sticking around to defend myself. Wouldn't a scammer just have left or created a new account under a different name?

8. I'm asking for advice on how I can apply my abilities for something that would genuinely help.

1. No. "Free trial" is not "free service". You are selling a service, lying now just sullies your character even more.

2. Earnings are not in any way predictable. Some nights a model makes nothing, some they make a lot. One simply cannot prove that "your system" was a cause for any variation in earnings. Given that, we could absolutely use your system, tell you that we had a 'fluke good night' or literally any other reason and not give you any cut at all. Unfortunately, we have to risk losing our business to do so - I'm pretty sure everyone here is smarter than to take that risk.

3. See above. You are asking for a percentage cut of any earning increases incurred by your product, asking models who use your service to put themselves at the risk of losing their business and everything they have worked for by rigging pantomime rooms and you have the balls to say you are taking a risk? Risk means potential loss, the worst you get is no gain - that's not loss. If you were stupid enough to invest money in this before seeing if it was a good/ethical/legal idea, that's entirely on you.

4. If you had no intent of manipulation, you have no reason to make a specific bullet-point to say "I had no intent of manipulation". I didn't say you were a good snakeoil salesman, I just said you were one.

5. You are investing in illegal activity and that is your conscious decision, making it seem like we're not 'grateful' for your investment in illegal shit is just sad. If you have mouths to feed, don't spend $300 on servers and proxies which will get you and any known associates banned from a camsite. Spend that shit on food. /facepalm

6. Selling this to studios will sink them. Threatening to go loose on CB "without any regard for the consequences" is just fucking sketchy. Would you hang out with me if I put my arm around you and said "dude, I could totally murder you in all of these specific ways right now, but I totally wouldn't do that, lol"...

7. Why are you defending yourself? Why are you still here? We are telling you that your proposed service is unethical and will result in not only bans but loss of model businesses and you are still trying to push it. The "con" in "conman" is short for "confidence" - they build trust, a bond, build a facade of comradery... and then fuck you out of everything you own. You're literally trying to make money off of other people making money, that is the definition of a parasite. If you want to be part of this community, by all means try to clear your name and stop selling this broken 'service' - but you're still in salesman mode and that's fucking off-putting.

8. Sell your $300 servers, buy tokens and spend them on models you like. Encourage your friends to do the same. Tell as many people you know about how much fun you had in <insert model's name here>'s room and how tipping is not just a gesture of kindness, but a payment for services rendered.

You don't have to cheat the system to help people out - models don't become and stay successful by using cheap tricks and sleight of hand, they are just good entertainers who were smart, lucky and worked hard enough to build an honest and generous fanbase.

 

[justjoinedtopost]

If you do have any helpful suggestions for how I might actually make things better for performers, I’d really like to hear them.

You could say "Great show!" in a tipnote...

On a side note: could this army of bots be trained to turd my posts?

 

[Magnolia]

You’ve convinced me. I will no longer pursue offering bots.

The feedback has been very clear that this is not something the community wants. And the risk to performers that could potentially get banned is too high.

I do honestly want to create something that is helpful for cam performers, and I will be starting a separate thread asking for suggestions. This is what I should have done in the first place instead of going off to spend time/money developing something that clearly isn’t wanted.

I realize this discussion might have colored your view of me, but I truly hope that you can forgive me for my misguided error.

If you do have any helpful suggestions for how I might actually make things better for performers, I’d really like to hear them. Let’s try to create something positive from this.

I sincerely apologize to anyone that was offered by my proposed bot idea or that perceived that I was trying to take advantage of anyone or put them at risk unknowingly.

Again, thanks everyone for the healthy discussion.

Sincerely,
Steve

Oh no, don't stop now. I just finished making my popcorn.

 

[Zoomer]

Nearly all understood it was 50% of the increased earnings. The ones who'd likely use the "service" are those that struggle. The implication is therefore that they don't make much anyway; there's no reason for those making hundreds of dollars a night to use bots; they're already popular. The chances are it's the ones who need to boost earnings AND the boost would make a significant difference to their income.

So those that make $40 normally in a night, and with bots make $150...

The site takes 50% of the $110 increase, and you then take another 50% from the remainder - leaving them just 25% of their increased earnings. Apart from the initial set up cost, your running costs are very low. Same IP can visit multiple rooms too, so really does scale fine.

The way you pitched it seemed to try giving one impression, whilst you eventual percentage cut indicated the real reason.

Greed.

Lesson learned - know your market, perhaps do some research before sinking funds in. It appears you got so excited at the prospect of making easy cash that you just ploughed in.

Good luck with future "Helpful" ideas - perhaps sound out those you wish to help in advance eh? I think it's called market research - but I wouldn't know, I'm a programmer not a business-type person.

p.s. if you spent a lot of time + money on this, then do further research - you could have done most of it for free.

 

[SteveR]

I’ve spent the last two days to reflecting on what all of you have been telling me repeatedly, as well as taking a good hard look at my self and my motivations. I thought I was helping, but the deeper I looked the more I realized how wrong I’d really gone. Now I’m left with a sick feeling inside.

I expect you to be suspicious and doubtful of anything I say, but I felt it was worth saying anyway.

I see now that all the horrible names that I’ve been called here in this forum are actually true. I was trying to con you. I was trying to take advantage and prey on those naive enough to fall for my so called “help.” I was trying to exploit you, and I was saying anything I could to convince (con) you.

I thought I had apologized before, but as Teagan rightly pointed out, I didn’t really. So I will try again.

Sorry.

Sorry for trying to con and scam you.

Sorry for trying to take advantage/exploit you and profit from your hard work.

Sorry for putting many of your livelihoods at risk, especially those that are most vulnerable and desperate.

Sorry for thinking I knew better.

Sorry for wasting your time and energy.

Sorry for being an ass.

Thank you again everyone that commented in this thread and has very patiently helped me see what I was doing for what it really was, a scam.

My plan is to leave this forum, as I know my presence to this point has been more harmful then good. However, if you will allow it, I would like to finish the discussion in the other thread I started about problems that are in need of fixing. I realize I'm probably not the person to fix them, but my hope is that by making it clear the things that do need fixing it might help others focus their efforts on useful things and avoid another painful experiences like this one.

Sincerely,
Steve

 

[CharlotteLace]

If this is a genuine apology, good for you for owning up to it. Glad you can understand why seasoned cam models are skeptics in general.

 

[justjoinedtopost]

I’ve spent the last two days to reflecting on what all of you have been telling me repeatedly, as well as taking a good hard look at my self and my motivations. I thought I was helping, but the deeper I looked the more I realized how wrong I’d really gone. Now I’m left with a sick feeling inside.

I expect you to be suspicious and doubtful of anything I say, but I felt it was worth saying anyway.

I see now that all the horrible names that I’ve been called here in this forum are actually true. I was trying to con you. I was trying to take advantage and prey on those naive enough to fall for my so called “help.” I was trying to exploit you, and I was saying anything I could to convince (con) you.

I thought I had apologized before, but as Teagan rightly pointed out, I didn’t really. So I will try again.

Sorry.

Sorry for trying to con and scam you.

Sorry for trying to take advantage/exploit you and profit from your hard work.

Sorry for putting many of your livelihoods at risk, especially those that are most vulnerable and desperate.

Sorry for thinking I knew better.

Sorry for wasting your time and energy.

Sorry for being an ass.

Thank you again everyone that commented in this thread and has very patiently helped me see what I was doing for what it really was, a scam.

My plan is to leave this forum, as I know my presence to this point has been more harmful then good. However, if you will allow it, I would like to finish the discussion in the other thread I started about problems that are in need of fixing. I realize I'm probably not the person to fix them, but my hope is that by making it clear the things that do need fixing it might help others focus their efforts on useful things and avoid another painful experiences like this one.

Sincerely,
Steve

now I am really suspicious

 

[DeezNA]

@SteveR - If you genuinely have benevolent intentions and just want to help out models, I'm gonna let you in on an apparently well-kept secret to help support your favorite models while simultaneously enjoying the entertainment they provide. I know, it seems too good to be true, right? I promise you, it's real! Feel free to tell your friends this industry secret, as it may bring about the exact effect you are seeking to provide for models you endorse.

You ready?

...gosh, now I'm not sure I should say it...

Fuck it, here it goes! The 100% best way you can help models achieve success:

*drumroll*



Tip.


--As for the forum stuff, if you want to exile yourself, feel free... or you can just, like, relax a little, be yourself, and just have a good time. It's really your call.--

 

[HoldItNow]

I think Steve picked the best picture possible to match the content of his posts.