Having a hard time saying no.

[Crimson_Peaks]

I don’t want to sound spineless, but I’m having a hard time saying no to heavier tippers, guys who talk a good game, and guys who seem like they genuinely need a friend. It’s only my first week in and I find myself breaking my own rules. It hasn’t gone too far, but it’s messing with my head a bit. How do you set good boundaries for yourself and others? Also, I find myself run down as I didn’t realize how much time and effort went into setting up and putting on a show. What do you do for self care, mentally, emotionally and physically?

 

[MallorieReese]

I feel you - I am the type of person who can easily say yes, both on cam and in real life. It's not even about the money, but about the fact that saying "no" makes me feel bad, really.
In this type of situation, persistence and trying is the key - yes, it is going to be somehow hard in the beginning, but it's worth your mental health. Nothing - and when I say nothing, I mean NOTHING - is as precious as your state of mind and mental health.

Learn to put yourself in the first place. When you find it difficult to say "no", think about what's more important - pleasing someone that you have no obligation towards or yourself.

 

[HarlowGolde]

When I see posts like this, my heart aches because when I started out, I also really struggled with those boundaries, despite rationally understanding that it's okay if I say no to something. It can be uncomfortable trying to enforce that kind of agency if you're not used to feeling like you're in a position to do so.

These days I'm better off, but I only started feeling confident in being assertive after practice and forcing myself to sit with the discomfort of doing it. I've never regretted blocking somebody or saying no - but I have regretted the opposite. (I hate that my best advice is something as cliche as practicing - but it's what has helped me the most.)

Something else that helps me feel better in general is scrolling through my little collection of wholesome memes and little things that I have saved on my phone for when I'm feeling lousy - it's like bite sized, affordable therapy. Speaking of therapy - in all seriousness, Pineapple Support is a great resource - Free/Affordable mental health support for sex workers! https://pineapplesupport.org/

Sending my love. It's tough but in my experience it gets easier with time. For times when it's not easy - this forum helps and posting like this is a good step to make. I'm happy you're here.

 

[RuthStrawberryblonde]

I learned the hard way, I now make it really clear in free that I do not do anything which hurts me, not into anything which makes me gag, not into anything which stretches my vagina, no anal, no spitting and money will not change that. I read posts early on saying many customers will appreciate this, many do not want an unhappy or coerced performer who bends or feels they have to do everything and anything. Doesn't mean you can't offer everything and anything but there are customers for everyone.

 

[ElektraDivine]

If you have a new model tag there'll be plenty of boundary pushers who try their luck with you because you're new (and because a lot of experienced models have already blocked them for their bs), its just part and parcel of being new unfortunately. Someone told me when I first started to have a list of yes, nos and maybes for kinks/fetishes/boundaries etc which I found helpful. Maybe write one of those out now that you've had a weeks experience and you know what's out there, because I'm sure you've learnt quickly that there's some wild kinks out there you'd never even heard of before.

Don't get wrapped up in the ones that seem like they need a friend, while I'm sure there's many who do need a friend there's also a lot of manipulators on there who will try to coerce you into doing things you don't want to do but they'll act like they're a "nice guy". Ultimately real nice guys don't make models do things they don't want to do, so I tend to say "I don't do xyz kink because I don't enjoy it, and if I do perform xyz kink then I'm not having a nice time and you're going to notice that and you're not going to have a nice time either. I'm open to ideas though if you have anything else in mind". Unfortunately for some I think seeing models being uncomfortable is a nice time for them, but at least it puts those ones off.

Also a part of being new to this is trying out stuff, and sometimes you're not really going to know what you're into until you give it a go, although I wouldn't recommend that with your "no" list. If you've done a show that's left you feeling a bit gross (happens to ALL OF US btw, and not just online sw either) then take some time for yourself. Acknowledge what you're feeling, know that you never have to do it again and don't beat yourself up over it. Go for a walk, chat to a friend, get verified and come chat with us in the models only section. If you tried something and it wasn't for you, now you know and next show you're going into it with more knowledge. Good luck

 

[AudriTwo]

i too had a very hard time saying no when i first started camming. elektra is right that you have a lot more scuzzy people are trying to take advantage of your naivety when new. i rarely get someone pushing my boundaries or trying to exploit me with money now.

when i was a baby cammodel, i wrote down all of my boundaries and taped them to the wall behind my monitor. that way i was always reminded by them. anytime a new boundary was created i would add it to the list. i needed that extra reminder that my boundaries are valid and stick to them. no is a complete sentence without needing explanation.

its a learning curve. in lots of religious or culturally conservative households, women are taught to be subservient to men. historically speaking society also likes to label women as hysteric if they act unfavorably. there was a whole medical diagnosis for females very cleverly named "female hysteria." (thanks patriarchy)

some great recommended reads
thriving in SexWork (this is pretty much the sexwork bible. if you arent a reader there is an audiobook.)
the art of saying NO
stop people pleasing

 

[THE MOLLIE MARIE]

Well you're only a week in, so I'd say you're in luck because that's not much time to cement bad habits. Plenty of opportunity to turn it around!

Setting and respecting your own boundaries will better your chances of a long-lasting career in this field. Pushing yourself past your own comfort is definitely the way to burnout. So any money you may feel you are losing out on by turning things/people down, remember, this is an investment in your longevity. There is always more money to be made. There are always potential clients who are perfectly happy to respect our boundaries and enjoy what WE enjoy performing.

Everyone else gave great advice and resources. With time and practice, you'll be able to do this stuff with ease! It will become natural. But, a lot of us are socially programmed to do exactly the opposite. So don't feel down on yourself for not finding it intuitive to establish your own ground rules in this way. I think a lot of people can relate to starting out with those same feelings!

 

[Helen Crimson]

I had a really, really hard time saying no at first to paying customers. I think it’s all the experience I’ve had with customer service that brain washes you into thinking the customer is always right. And of course what Audri said, it’s how we’re socialized as women. I would do shows that made me feel gross afterwards. I think having those experiences where I should’ve said no helped me realize I needed to just bite the bullet and say it. Now saying no feels so good. I say it nicely, but it feels awesome to be able to take back the power and turn someone down.

 

[Crimson_Peaks]

I feel you - I am the type of person who can easily say yes, both on cam and in real life. It's not even about the money, but about the fact that saying "no" makes me feel bad, really.
In this type of situation, persistence and trying is the key - yes, it is going to be somehow hard in the beginning, but it's worth your mental health. Nothing - and when I say nothing, I mean NOTHING - is as precious as your state of mind and mental health.

Learn to put yourself in the first place. When you find it difficult to say "no", think about what's more important - pleasing someone that you have no obligation towards or yourself.

Really good advice. Thank you!

 

[Crimson_Peaks]

When I see posts like this, my heart aches because when I started out, I also really struggled with those boundaries, despite rationally understanding that it's okay if I say no to something. It can be uncomfortable trying to enforce that kind of agency if you're not used to feeling like you're in a position to do so.

These days I'm better off, but I only started feeling confident in being assertive after practice and forcing myself to sit with the discomfort of doing it. I've never regretted blocking somebody or saying no - but I have regretted the opposite. (I hate that my best advice is something as cliche as practicing - but it's what has helped me the most.)

Something else that helps me feel better in general is scrolling through my little collection of wholesome memes and little things that I have saved on my phone for when I'm feeling lousy - it's like bite sized, affordable therapy. Speaking of therapy - in all seriousness, Pineapple Support is a great resource - Free/Affordable mental health support for sex workers! https://pineapplesupport.org/

Sending my love. It's tough but in my experience it gets easier with time. For times when it's not easy - this forum helps and posting like this is a good step to make. I'm happy you're here.

View attachment 90065

Thank you so much. I will definitely try to practice and I do think it will get easier eventually. Thank you for the link. I have it bookmarked and will definitely use it.

 

[Crimson_Peaks]

I learned the hard way, I now make it really clear in free that I do not do anything which hurts me, not into anything which makes me gag, not into anything which stretches my vagina, no anal, no spitting and money will not change that. I read posts early on saying many customers will appreciate this, many do not want an unhappy or coerced performer who bends or feels they have to do everything and anything. Doesn't mean you can't offer everything and anything but there are customers for everyone.

That’s a really good point, and for respectful people clarity makes both parties more comfortable.

 

[Crimson_Peaks]

If you have a new model tag there'll be plenty of boundary pushers who try their luck with you because you're new (and because a lot of experienced models have already blocked them for their bs), its just part and parcel of being new unfortunately. Someone told me when I first started to have a list of yes, nos and maybes for kinks/fetishes/boundaries etc which I found helpful. Maybe write one of those out now that you've had a weeks experience and you know what's out there, because I'm sure you've learnt quickly that there's some wild kinks out there you'd never even heard of before.

Don't get wrapped up in the ones that seem like they need a friend, while I'm sure there's many who do need a friend there's also a lot of manipulators on there who will try to coerce you into doing things you don't want to do but they'll act like they're a "nice guy". Ultimately real nice guys don't make models do things they don't want to do, so I tend to say "I don't do xyz kink because I don't enjoy it, and if I do perform xyz kink then I'm not having a nice time and you're going to notice that and you're not going to have a nice time either. I'm open to ideas though if you have anything else in mind". Unfortunately for some I think seeing models being uncomfortable is a nice time for them, but at least it puts those ones off.

Also a part of being new to this is trying out stuff, and sometimes you're not really going to know what you're into until you give it a go, although I wouldn't recommend that with your "no" list. If you've done a show that's left you feeling a bit gross (happens to ALL OF US btw, and not just online sw either) then take some time for yourself. Acknowledge what you're feeling, know that you never have to do it again and don't beat yourself up over it. Go for a walk, chat to a friend, get verified and come chat with us in the models only section. If you tried something and it wasn't for you, now you know and next show you're going into it with more knowledge. Good luck

Reading that just now really helped my peace of mind, especially that we’ve all done shows that left us feeling gross. I really appreciate that.

 

[Crimson_Peaks]

i too had a very hard time saying no when i first started camming. elektra is right that you have a lot more scuzzy people are trying to take advantage of your naivety when new. i rarely get someone pushing my boundaries or trying to exploit me with money now.

when i was a baby cammodel, i wrote down all of my boundaries and taped them to the wall behind my monitor. that way i was always reminded by them. anytime a new boundary was created i would add it to the list. i needed that extra reminder that my boundaries are valid and stick to them. no is a complete sentence without needing explanation.

its a learning curve. in lots of religious or culturally conservative households, women are taught to be subservient to men. historically speaking society also likes to label women as hysteric if they act unfavorably. there was a whole medical diagnosis for females very cleverly named "female hysteria." (thanks patriarchy)

some great recommended reads
thriving in SexWork (this is pretty much the sexwork bible. if you arent a reader there is an audiobook.)
the art of saying NO
stop people pleasing

Those are great suggestions. I think having a boundary list where I can see it could really help reinforce things for me. You’re right, we have been trained, and for someone who is also naturally submissive it can be a struggle to maintain my sense of self.

 

[Crimson_Peaks]

Well you're only a week in, so I'd say you're in luck because that's not much time to cement bad habits. Plenty of opportunity to turn it around!

Setting and respecting your own boundaries will better your chances of a long-lasting career in this field. Pushing yourself past your own comfort is definitely the way to burnout. So any money you may feel you are losing out on by turning things/people down, remember, this is an investment in your longevity. There is always more money to be made. There are always potential clients who are perfectly happy to respect our boundaries and enjoy what WE enjoy performing.

Everyone else gave great advice and resources. With time and practice, you'll be able to do this stuff with ease! It will become natural. But, a lot of us are socially programmed to do exactly the opposite. So don't feel down on yourself for not finding it intuitive to establish your own ground rules in this way. I think a lot of people can relate to starting out with those same feelings!

Thank you so much! That feels really encouraging. You’re right, I’ve actually met more people who are respectful and very cool than ones that want to push.

 

[Crimson_Peaks]

I had a really, really hard time saying no at first to paying customers. I think it’s all the experience I’ve had with customer service that brain washes you into thinking the customer is always right. And of course what Audri said, it’s how we’re socialized as women. I would do shows that made me feel gross afterwards. I think having those experiences where I should’ve said no helped me realize I needed to just bite the bullet and say it. Now saying no feels so good. I say it nicely, but it feels awesome to be able to take back the power and turn someone down.

That’s really awesome to hear. It’s just great knowing that others have also struggled with this and then conquered the issue.