Ferguson shooting grand jury verdict

[Bocefish]

Yeah, from what I understand... it's extremely unorthodoxed for the defendant to give testimony to the GJ and the prosecutor to present exculpatory evidence. It's kinda backassward, but being that it's such a sensitive case is most likely why he did so along with making all the evidence available to the public. Not that it meant anything to the people that all ready had their minds up.

That said, there's no way (imo) that a jury would convict because there is overwhelming reasonable doubt, if not downright proof Wilson is innocent.

@camstory... we're basically saying the same thing, just in different ways. I know very well what the GJ's duty is.

Just FYI... There was a recent Blue Bloods episode about a police officer supposedly turning his personal camera off at a critical time of the arrest. Unfortunately, I fell asleep halfway into it so I'll probably watch that episode again.

Personally, I'm all for LEOs wearing cams and I'm surprised nobody recorded the Brown/Wilson incident with all the people around with cell phones.

 

[camstory]

Yeah, from what I understand... it's extremely unorthodoxed for the defendant to give testimony to the GJ and the prosecutor to present exculpatory evidence. It's kinda backassward, but being that it's such a sensitive case is most likely why he did so along with making all the evidence available to the public. Not that it meant anything to the people that all ready had their minds up.

That said, there's no way (imo) that a jury would convict because there is overwhelming reasonable doubt, if not downright proof Wilson is innocent.

@camstory... we're basically saying the same thing, just in different ways. I know very well what the GJ's duty is.

Just FYI... There was a recent Blue Bloods episode about a police officer supposedly turning his personal camera off at a critical time of the arrest. Unfortunately, I fell asleep halfway into it so I'll probably watch that episode again.

Personally, I'm all for LEOs wearing cams and I'm surprised nobody recorded the Brown/Wilson incident with all the people around with cell phones.

[I may come back and actually reply to some of the points in your post if I can convince myself it would make any difference to anyone except me, and I may anyway. But for now I'm all Flabbergasted, and my post is all This shit right here is bull shit.]

Let me say I am not convinced of murder or self defence, and Wilson being part of a manipulation of the system that really did burn something other than a tri colored bit of cloth, something as sacred as anything we have, a most fundamental tool of our justice system, and benefiting from that rape, does not color how I feel, or cause me to wish him ill. Guilty or Innocent, he can not be blamed for riding the trick pony. Below the post I wrote last evening.

Very congenial, thank for that. Thank you for deciding for us, on which same page we should be. But I know if you really think about it, you know how much bull shit that ^^^^^^ is. Or maybe you don't – I am struggling with it.

I guess who I really am, minus all the pretension, and amateur effort to be eloquent, screams, Really! Fuckin Really! Can you Really believe what has happened is, if not the best way things might have gone, at least not a bad way for things to work out? I understand where everything has ended up, is most likely how it would have ended up anyway. Or, that, that is pretty clear to you anyway. And there are ways it could have gone worse, considering the money, time, duration of public discourse, danger of violence, all that. Just as well we put it all to bed, so everybody can get on with their lives. Yea, it could have been much worse.

Could it have been much worse? I'm going with NO on much worse. Could it have been any worse? Every scenario I can imagine that might be worse, is firmly in the genre of fantasy or syfi and is very dark, even apocalyptic. (I only exaggerate a little bit) I can not yet reply to the huge steaming mountain of bovine ruminant of what has been done, of which your attitude seems to be, it all worked out fine – pretty unusual, but what's the harm in that..

It is not what you express - what you express, considered in a vacuum, irrelevant of anything else, seems reasonable. But it is exactly what you do not express, seem not to be aware of, or, have absolutely no concern of; anyone other than yourself, or those who have the same POV as yourself. You don't even have to put your feet in their shoes, to see this is an awful chain of events, much bigger than the event from which they grew, but from the same twisted stalk. Hell you don't even have to think about the path they walk. All you have to do is be aware there are others with feet, and that they have and continue to walk a different path than you. If you have never acknowledged the feet of others or tried to see along their path, you should clamber to the top of this steaming shit mountain,(careful you don't step on your own attitude during your accent) and look back along their path, you will see this is just the most recent mountain in a chain of shit mountains stretching beyond the horizon.

I don't think you were trying to get me upset. I even think you probably don't see a lot wrong with what has taken place. I think you are wrong, but what I think matters not. But there are countless others more relevant than I who think it is very wrong, and they are a little more angry, a little more alienated, a little more convinced, a little more hateful, and sadly a little less friendly or brotherly, a lot less color blind now then before. In the calculated attack and denial of the rights of one group of humans, it is we who have become less human.

I do not mean to attack you – your core person, but I do think your attitude was developed with no consideration of anyone else, and in a vacuum because it really sucks.

 

[Bocefish]

There's the blatherskite we all know. :lol:

Off your meds or just stoned?

 

[Bocefish]

:thumbleft: :thumbleft:

PORTLAND, Oregon (AP) — An African-American boy holding a "Free Hugs" sign stood crying in front of a police barricade at a Ferguson protest rally in Portland. A white police officer motioned for him to come closer. The officer then asked the boy for a hug — and they embraced, the boy's anguished face streaming with tears.

 

[eclipse76]

#JustPortlandThings

 

[camstory]

OK, let me try to briefly explain why I am upset with the Ferguson Grand Jury proceedings. It appears the highly unusual evidence dump orchestrated by prosecutor McCulloch was not illegal, or even unethical in viewing this Grand Jury procedure alone.

Though our system of criminal law has been built around one guiding principle, Justice for all. The goal being the fair application of law. What does “fair” mean in this context? Ppl can debate endlessly about the fairness of any given law, and prolly will. But for the rule of law to fair overall it must be administered in a fair and equal way. That is, to be fair—you must treat similarly situated people, similarly. That has most clearly not been the case in Ferguson.

If the manipulation of the standard Grand Jury process by McCulloch was not unethical in viewing this Grand Jury procedure alone, I can accept that. (Though, I personally believe any allowable manipulation of the law, that for all practical purposes erects a criminal trial proceeding, absent the adversarial conditions that defines our justice system, to be in need of reform that it not be allowable. It is, for lack of a better term, a loophole, that can exploited to circumvent one of the fundamental rules of law in our system.)

One could argue McCulloch's manipulation is not ethical if you consider the fairness of such manipulation as it relates to the overall picture of fair and equal treatment, and I do. But what I can see no argument over, is the message this sends to everyone, everywhere who have historically been treated differently, less well, and unfairly. That is what I am very upset about. Can we expect anything other than resentment and mistrust from ppl who we continue to treat unfairly, demonstrating we care less about their justice than we do others? I think not!

 

[Shaun__]

I saw this comic today.

 

[Bocefish]

Charles Barkley says Ferguson grand jury got it right and he tells it like it is.

“The true story came out from the grand jury testimony,” Barkley said, adding that he was made aware of “key forensic evidence, and several black witnesses that supported Officer Darren Wilson’s story…” He continued, “I can’t believe anything I hear on television anymore. And, that’s why I don’t like talking about race issues with the media anymore, because they (the media) love this stuff, and lead people to jump to conclusions. The media shouldn’t do that. They never do that when black people kill each other. ”

He also called those who rioted after the decision was announced “scumbags,” and said “There is no excuse for people to be out there burning down people’s businesses, burning down police cars.”…

“[W]e have to be really careful with the cops, because if it wasn’t for the cops we would be living in the Wild, Wild West in our neighborhoods,” he said. “We can’t pick out certain incidentals that don’t go our way and act like the cops are all bad…. Do you know how bad some of these neighborhoods would be if it wasn’t for the cops?”

 

[eyeteach]

Somebody please explain to me something. How would Officer Wilson wearing a body camera change Michael Brown's actions just minutes before he died? Would that camera magically have made Brown more respectful? Less confrontational? Less belligerent?

No, it wouldn't have. How do I know? Because I saw Michael Brown on a surveillance tape being Michael Brown. You don't have to take my word for it, look at that tape for yourself. The "Gentle Giant" was anything but gentle when he robbed that convenience store and assaulted it's owner. I understand that there are those you that will NEVER believe the evidence presented to the grand jury, you're constitutionally incapable of doing so; why common sense in this matter escapes you I have no clue but I get that you're just not going to believe your own lying eyes when evidence is presented with facts. You're going to blame Officer Wilson and probably will do so for one, if not two, of the following reasons: 1) Wilson was a police officer and 2) Wilson is white.

Want to know what the real tragedy is in Furgeson? It's that the people of that city let race baiters and poverty pushers in and allowed them to incite more hatred and damage than what should have ever been tolerated. It's that people take no personal responsibility for their own actions, actions that led to Michael Brown taking his very last breath at the age of 18. Let's sacrifice young people who are just coming of age for personal and political reasons. Let's do those things that tear a city and community apart...it's easy to do, especially since we don't have to live in Furgeson. Let's believe the lies that the MSM perpetuate at the expense of black people. Let's believe Barack Obama and Eric Holder have our best interests at heart even though they themselves are race baiters and poverty pushers. Let's sell our collective souls because someone else somewhere else tells us that we have to.

Wake the fuck up people.

 

[Bocefish]

Bodycams would end the bullshit so-called eyewitnesses lying about Brown being shot in the back or that he had his hands up saying don't shoot resulting in the irresponsible lame stream media and race racketeers blowing lies out of proportion prompting subsequent riots... It will put an end to the lies and also provide proof when legitimate police brutality occurs.

Chicago police Superintendent Garry McCarthy said Monday that the department would begin testing body cameras on officers within about 60 days as part of a pilot project.

McCarthy offered few specifics at a news conference called to highlight crime statistics, but he made it clear he backs the test.

"We have a number of officers who have volunteered because that's how we're going to handle it initially," McCarthy said. "I endorse the program. I would say within 60 days we'll be up and running."

The White House has asked for $263 million in funding for police body cameras and training in the wake of the shooting death of unarmed 18-year-old Michael Brown.

The program, which would need congressional approval, would offer a total of $75 million over three years to match state funding for the cameras by 50 percent, helping to pay for more than 50,000 of the devices.

The announcement came as Obama held a series of meetings with law enforcement personnel, civil rights leaders and Cabinet officials to discuss possible reforms to ease mistrust towards police, particularly in minority communities.

 

[SenaLuna]

No, it wouldn't have. How do I know? Because I saw Michael Brown on a surveillance tape being Michael Brown. You don't have to take my word for it, look at that tape for yourself. The "Gentle Giant" was anything but gentle when he robbed that convenience store and assaulted it's owner.

I won't fully address your first statement because Boce already did it pretty clearly. Just as an addendum though: Russia has dash cams on cars because of how much driver chaos there is, between reckless drivers and people trying to take advantage of hit and run insurance claims, those cameras exist to ensure that there is a clear record of what happened so no one tries to twist events and obstruct justice. Police cams would serve the same exact purpose. My only fear is that the corrupt cops would still work around it.

I saw the surveillance video when it was first released and there are multiple interpretations of what's going on in it. Regardless of what was going on, to me it doesn't make a difference in the case because humans are not one-dimensional and it's completely out-of-touch to judge a person's entire being based off a brief video of them.

You did not see Mike Brown being "Mike Brown". You do not know Mike Brown, neither do I, and neither do 99% of the people claiming he was a bad kid or a good kid. There is absolutely no way for anyone other than Mike Brown and a couple close people within his life to know what kind of a person he was in and out.

It's likely that Brown was a troubled kid. I've worked with troubled kids, I've gone to school with troubled kids, and I've attended summer programs with troubled kids. These kids have rough lives for various reasons- sometimes it's due to their home life, sometimes its due to their community, sometimes both. These kids are pushed to be defensive and confrontational because its the only way they've learned how to deal with the hand they've been dealt. I have met kids who truly were out of control monsters, but most kids I've met who lash out at adults or when things don't go their way aren't little devils at all, they just don't know how to handle unfairness in a calm, rational manner. Its also worth mentioning that the part of the brain responsible for decision making and understanding consequences doesn't fully develop until the mid-twenties which is why bright kids do stupid shit.

Just because we have one video showing him impatiently reaching over a counter and shoving a store clerk that laid hands on him doesn't mean Mike was evil, and it absolutely does not mean he deserved to have his life ended early just because he possibly got confrontational with a cop. Why was it even necessary to bring up this video?

I understand that there are those you that will NEVER believe the evidence presented to the grand jury, you're constitutionally incapable of doing so; why common sense in this matter escapes you I have no clue but I get that you're just not going to believe your own lying eyes when evidence is presented with facts.

Were you there? Then you don't even have all the facts and you have no grounds to criticize anyone else's interpretation of events that we only know about through hearsay. This statement is rife with indirect personal attacks and rather cantankerous.

You're going to blame Officer Wilson and probably will do so for one, if not two, of the following reasons: 1) Wilson was a police officer and 2) Wilson is white.

"Blame" him? Whether or not he's a murderer or racist can't be accurately determined, but he committed manslaughter and that's a fact. There's no blame here; he was responsible for the death of Mike Brown and no one can really dispute. Blame is rooted in uncertainty. We don't know why Wilson chose to do what he did, but we know he did it. Anti-Wilson'ers are a diverse group and there are plenty who are against his actions for reasons which have nothing to do with his race or career. Seriously, the heck kind of a point are you even aiming for here?

Want to know what the real tragedy is in Furgeson? It's that the people of that city let race baiters and poverty pushers in and allowed them to incite more hatred and damage than what should have ever been tolerated.

The racial tension between law enforcement and civilians in Ferguson has actually been an ongoing issue; Ferguson was simply the straw that broke the camel's back and managed to get a ton of publicity. Wilson's original police force (Jennings) was disbanded due to racial tension, though there were no charges specifically against him.

While I feel that the nationwide discourse brought on by Ferguson should be more about the militarization of police rather than a constant back and forth about whether or not police brutality is purely a racial issue, I don't think the racism outcry in Ferguson was left-field or brought on solely by the media.

Let's sacrifice young people who are just coming of age for personal and political reasons. Let's do those things that tear a city and community apart...it's easy to do, especially since we don't have to live in Furgeson. Let's believe the lies that the MSM perpetuate at the expense of black people.

How was Brown "sacrificed for personal and political reasons"? It's not like Brown was lost in the midst of some sort of political chaos, his cause of death just happened to spark a huge controversy. I guess you could say the public turned him into a bit of a martyr, but sacrificing him implies that someone else caused his death to happen solely to push their agenda.

I'm really not sure where you're going with this post anymore as its beginning to read less like a contribution to the discussion and more like the soap-boxing of a disgruntled person. I mean, maybe its the fact that I've been awake for over 24 hours and am sputtering along on energy shots but I'm more lost than the city of Atlantis.

Also I find it a little silly to be criticizing the mainstream media's lies when just a few sentences back you were claiming to know what kind of person Brown was based on a video that was released for the sole purpose of that mainstream media shit-stirring.

Ferguson is such a chaotic topic because we can't know what really happened (as evidenced by that PBS chart and witness accounts being all over the board) and it's hard to have a discussion about it that isn't just circular back and forth of opinions and perceptions. Regardless, complaining about the main stream media, the actions of the protesters, the racial tension, and politician responses doesn't really help solve anything, nor does it really contribute anything other than another giant distraction on top of the distractions you're complaining about.

 

[GracieHart]

@SenaLuna not sure thanking your post was enough. :text-goodpost: :text-thankyouyellow: :text-yeahthat:

 

[Bocefish]

SenaLuna, I agree with most of your post. However, this is far from the first time the lame stream media has stirred the proverbial pot just because they're desperate for ratings. They've even fabricated some stories just like the so-called eye witnesses did. It's a good thing that POS recanted his story about Brown having his hands up saying don't shoot, otherwise he'd likely be charged with lying to the GJ. Unfortunately, the damage was all ready done and the media ran with it. This whole "movement' is based on lies from that tragic day. If it was a peaceful movement, I wouldn't give such a shit, but people's lives have been ruined from idiotic morons and professional race baiters who have fanned the flames inciting violent riots.

In addition, I know all I need to to know about Michael Brown from that video. It showed his frame of mind and how he thought about people that didn't give him what he wants. Whether that was totally out of character for him or not, I don't care. It's not as if we were going to be buds or anything. His demeanor and actions that day were that of the typical street thug, period.

Lastly, it doesn't mean a damn thing if he had a rough life, or not. His actions that day are what led to his demise. And it wasn't because he stole some cigarillos either like the bleeding heart libs like to say, it's because he assaulted a police office, tried to steal his weapon and later charged said officer after repeated warnings and shots fired. The physical evidence bears that out and physical evidence doesn't lie, so it really doesn't matter which witnesses people believe.

 

[Bocefish]

OMFG! I almost agree 100% with something on MSNBC

 

[eyeteach]

Senaluna, I also have worked with troubled kids. The worse kid I can remember was a 15 year old named Harvey, and he was a bad ass. This kid could not be put in a regular classroom because he was an honest threat to the other students. One week after turning 16, Harvey was finally expelled from school for attempting to rape a freshman girl in the girl's restroom...on a day he skipped school. He showed that day for one reason and one reason only. He ran and left campus and before he could be tracked down and arrested Harvey shot and killed a 36 year old man in a drug deal; he just didn't give a shit.

I know all I need to know about Michael Brown from that surveillance video and the three autopsies performed on his body. In the video Brown doesn't just "impatiently" reach across the counter and grab a handful of cigarillos, he stole an entire box. He then proceeds to assault the owner of the store. Of all the things in that store he could have shoplifted why did he take tobacco? He took the blunts to smoke pot; which, incidentally, all three autopsies showed was already in his system. As I mentioned in an earlier post the robbery, the assault on the store owner, and the assault on the police officer were three felonious acts that Brown engaged in that day before he lost his life. Or rather, just three that we know of.

Why was the video released? IMO, it was released to show what events led to Michael Brown's death and was also released partly to show that the standard argument the MSM was making towards that particular police officer and the Furgeson Police Dept were baseless and without merit. Again, my opinion but after what I've seen from the media covering this story I feel good forming my own, personal opinion.

Maybe you don't have relatives who are in law enforcement, I do. One of them was involved in a hostage situation where a shoot-out occurred, another was actually shot in the act of what should have been a routine traffic stop. The militarization of the police force? I was proudly part of the United States military, discharged with a medical discharge (having an IED blow the vehicle you're traveling in has a want to do that.) Have you ever given any thought why police officers with twenty years on a force retire? You probably haven't but ask one, ask him/her about a typical day on their job and see what response you get. Ask their spouse, maybe even their ex-spouse what it was like for them when their loved one went off to work a 12 hour shift where someone like a Michael Brown physically threatened to take the officer's sidearm and use it against that officer. Listen to them as they tell you the fear they had, or have, that their loved one might not make it home because some thug though the po po dissed them. If coming home safely to one's family after discharging one's chosen duty of protecting and serving their community is "the militarization of the police force" then I say give the cops more armor to protect themselves.

 

[Shaun__]

If coming home safely to one's family after discharging one's chosen duty of protecting and serving their community is "the militarization of the police force" then I say give the cops more armor to protect themselves.

You know cops may kill over 1000 people a year? I have to say may, because the government does not think keeping track of people killed by cops is a worthwhile thing to do. That is a best guess estimate based on numbers pulled from multiple sources by researchers.

Maybe cops need to realize this is not a war zone, and people are innocent until proven guilty. Maybe they could take three seconds instead of two in difficult situations.

 

[Bocefish]

If coming home safely to one's family after discharging one's chosen duty of protecting and serving their community is "the militarization of the police force" then I say give the cops more armor to protect themselves.

You know cops may kill over 1000 people a year? I have to say may, because the government does not think keeping track of people killed by cops is a worthwhile thing to do. That is a best guess estimate based on numbers pulled from multiple sources by researchers.

Maybe cops need to realize this is not a war zone, and people are innocent until proven guilty. Maybe they could take three seconds instead of two in difficult situations.

More irresponsible reporting... the police in that video were NOT relayed the key information that the gun in question was probably fake as the 911 caller had mentioned. If you're at all familiar with toy guns, they are remarkably realistic... thus the end of the barrel is blazoned with orange paint. Apparently, this kid removed all remnants of the orange paint so it looked like a real gun to the officers who have split seconds to react. Another totally avoidable tragedy if they had only listened to police.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Cops want to go home at the end of the day just like everyone else.

 

[Shaun__]

More irresponsible reporting... the police in that video were NOT relayed the key information that the gun in question was probably fake as the 911 caller had mentioned. If you're at all familiar with toy guns, they are remarkably realistic... thus the end of the barrel is blazoned with orange paint. Apparently, this kid removed all remnants of the orange paint so it looked like a real gun to the officers who have split seconds to react. Another totally avoidable tragedy if they had only listened to police.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Cops want to go home at the end of the day just like everyone else.

I think open carry is legal there, so having a real gun in public is not a reason to shoot someone.

 

[Bocefish]

More irresponsible reporting... the police in that video were NOT relayed the key information that the gun in question was probably fake as the 911 caller had mentioned. If you're at all familiar with toy guns, they are remarkably realistic... thus the end of the barrel is blazoned with orange paint. Apparently, this kid removed all remnants of the orange paint so it looked like a real gun to the officers who have split seconds to react. Another totally avoidable tragedy if they had only listened to police.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Cops want to go home at the end of the day just like everyone else.

I think open carry is legal there, so having a real gun in public is not a reason to shoot a someone.

You think? Really? Look up what is allowed for open carry since you're so knowledgable. Open carry does not give anyone the right to wave a gun around randomly in public parks and point the dangerous end at whatever strikes their fancy, which includes police officers. Any other dumbass questions?

 

[Bocefish]

To late to edit, but for all we know that kid may have thought suicide by cop would get him positive national recognition just like the Michael Brown shooting. It doesn't matter if the kid was a minor, anyone in their right mind will drop a gun they're holding and put their hands in the air when cops arrive on scene unless they intend to shoot it out with the police.

:twocents-02cents:

 

[JoleneBrody]

To clarify what Boce is saying, there is a HUGE difference between open carry and brandishing a weapon. It's not the same number everywhere but everywhere with open carry does have a certain number of actions required for open carry. Actions meaning steps required to actually use the firearm. This includes everything from the safety to a holster to a locking holster depending on the area. Brandishing a weapon (though what's put under brandishing varies state to state) is illegal everywhere as far as I'm aware as that is careless handling or threatening behavior. Basically, anticipating a need to use a weapon before proper personal threat has actually been made in public is highly illegal.

If a person is brandishing a weapon in public it is to be assumed that person means to be the attacker, not the defender or protector. That was a horrible tragedy that I'm sure will haunt that police officer until the day he dies.

To late to edit, but for all we know that kid may have thought suicide by cop would get him positive national recognition just like the Michael Brown shooting.

Making such wild and insulting guesses at the motives of a dead kid feels pretty icky.

 

[JerryBoBerry]

To late to edit, but for all we know that kid may have thought suicide by cop would get him positive national recognition just like the Michael Brown shooting. It doesn't matter if the kid was a minor, anyone in their right mind will drop a gun they're holding and put their hands in the air when cops arrive on scene unless they intend to shoot it out with the police.

:twocents-02cents:

This is the full video. And yes TRIGGER WARNINGS apply since it shows the shooting part too. It's longer, the shooting part starts around 7 minute mark.

At first watching my reaction was the police shot really fast on getting to the scene. I was ready to go against the cop on this one. But I re-watched it several times on full screen. Tamir is walking up to the police car as it's coming into frame, he doesn't appear to have the gun in his hand at that time. But if you watch the 7:11 mark closely it really looks like he raises his coat and is reaching for it in his pants. I guess a police officer on a call where someone is seen waiving a gun around in a public park (the caller said it may be fake, he didn't know. So that part is irrelevant.) Then when the cops pull up he comes straight toward them and reaches for something in his waistband, I'd have to say the cop looking at it from 4 feet away probably had a good reason for firing.



Admittedly this is all based on really shitty camera footage.

 

[Teagan]

To clarify what Boce is saying, there is a HUGE difference between open carry and brandishing a weapon. It's not the same number everywhere but everywhere with open carry does have a certain number of actions required for open carry. Actions meaning steps required to actually use the firearm. This includes everything from the safety to a holster to a locking holster depending on the area. Brandishing a weapon (though what's put under brandishing varies state to state) is illegal everywhere as far as I'm aware as that is careless handling or threatening behavior. Basically, anticipating a need to use a weapon before proper personal threat has actually been made in public is highly illegal.

If a person is brandishing a weapon in public it is to be assumed that person means to be the attacker, not the defender or protector. That was a horrible tragedy that I'm sure will haunt that police officer until the day he dies.

Exactly. I can walk into Walmart with my gun in a holster here and not have an issue with anyone and expect them to not have an issue with me having one. It is safe, I am being safe with it, and I pose no obvious threat to anyone. Im abiding by the law. But if I go around that Walmart with it in my hand and i'm waving it around or pointing it at people I should expect others to have an issue with that. They have every right to feel their safety may be in danger from me and I should expect consequences of those actions.

 

[Bocefish]

Thanks for posting the entire video, but that only helps confirm my suicide by cop theory, icky as it may be. The way he initially hides the gun in his waistband when police are pulling up, then walking up to the squad car the way he did without hesitation, lifting his shirt revealing the gun while reaching for it basically left the officers no choice.

That's the way I saw it anyway.

:twocents-02cents:

 

[camstory]

My head feels like it is about to explode. The one fact that remains clear to me is that the white prosecutor treated the white police officer much differently than he would have or does treat a black man in similar circumstances! And I'll accept that there might be some reason to treat a police officer a bit differently, but we aren't talking about a "bit", he was treated drastically different. In the prosecution of the law all men are equal, and if you are fair you treat them likewise. Regardless of the outcome, and whether or not you think that was right, you are just refusing to see the facts if you think the process that got at that conclusion were fair. You can not blame black ppl for feeling cheated. You may feel they are wrong if they think Wilson was guilty, and you may be right, but you are as wrong as you think they are if you don't see any reason for them to feel cheated.

 

[Bocefish]

My head feels like it is about to explode. The one fact that remains clear to me is that the white prosecutor treated the white police officer much differently than he would have or does treat a black man in similar circumstances!

And you know this as a fact how? Do you know for a fact that he would he have done things differently if the officer was black and Brown was white?

You can not blame black ppl for feeling cheated. You may feel they are wrong if they think Wilson was guilty, and you may be right, but you are as wrong as you think they are if you don't see any reason for them to feel cheated.

How am I, or anyone here blaming black people for feeling cheated? Is it because the GJ decided upon a preponderance of evidence not to indict officer Wilson and thereby avoid wasting the taxpayers time and considerable money on a case that didn't have a snowball's chance in hell? Isn't that their duty, after all?

For all I know there may very well be good reason to investigate the Ferguson PD. That does not mean the facts and evidence in this case should not be based solely on this incident alone and not what may or may not transpired have in the past.

I try to make decisions best I can based strictly upon the facts and irrefutable forensic evidence leaving emotions out of it, in case you haven't noticed by now.

Americans of all colors, race and creed can protest as much and often as they want AFAIC and even burn the American flag provided they do it legally without destroying other people's livelihoods, properties, hopes & dreams in the process.

Now I've recently heard that some black teenagers were beating a white man with hammers for no apparent reason nearby Ferguson, but of course, that's not immediately assumed as racially motivated for some reason.

Perhaps white people need some pale faced versions of race baiting, tax evading, lying SOBs to cozy up with the next POTUS in order to get justice for hate crimes against white people.

 

[Shaun__]

I guess that 12 year old boy should not have looked like he may have been opening his coat while black. Or do they treat white people the same?

 

[Teagan]

If people wanna discuss Rice who got shot I think they should make a new thread for it. Not try to lump it in with this one like they are anywhere near the same thing or instance. Or try to prove guilt in one case by guilt possibly being there in another.

He had what looked like a real gun. He made it look like one on purpose. He was shot by a rookie cop who thought he was going to be shot by the kid going for a gun in his waistband. The other case is a grown man who was attacking a seasoned cop. The only factor in common is race and the fact the one who wound up dead went to grab for something where commonly guns are held.

 

[mynameisbob84]

And now a police officer has avoided an indictment after choking an unarmed black man to death despite being warned numerous times that the man couldn't breathe. There's apparently video of it online but I didn't have the stomach to watch. Oh, the guy who shot the video, he's being indicted. The cop who choked the unarmed black man to death isn't. And yet there are people (mostly white people) who'll tell you that America doesn't have a race problem.

 

[Bocefish]

And now a police officer has avoided an indictment after choking an unarmed black man to death despite being warned numerous times that the man couldn't breathe. There's apparently video of it online but I didn't have the stomach to watch.

Why do people automatically infuse racism into black/white cop encounters when they don't know the entire story and especially when they don't even have the stomach watch what happened themselves? Do you ever make up your own mind or do you always let others do it for you?



I wholeheartedly believe this case should have gone to trial but not due to racist overtones, it's because the cop not only violated police procedure, but applied the wrong type of choke hold with his forearm applying pressure over the trachea which will cause it to swell up, sometimes immediately or hours later, cutting off his airway. The M.E. even said it was a homicide.

How this GJ decided not to indict is a mystery to me and smells a little fishy unless there is info we are not privy to. I heard there were at least 8 minorities on the GJ for whatever that's worth.

Definitely need more info but resisting arrest never ends well for the perp and this guy had 31 previous arrests so he should have known better.

Proper choke hold technique: