Will piracy on tube sites kill the porn Industry?

[Poison_Ivy21]

What did you dislike about MFC?

The expectation of social interactions and public shows. I'd rather just cum one on one over and over all day than deal with hustling to make countdowns. I hate the expectation that models should be selling our snap/kik/phone number/whatever else on MFC. No outside contact allowed on SM, that's beautiful.

Every way the SM and MFC differs, is what I dislike about MFC and love about SM. Honestly, I really fucking hated MFC. It's so emotionally draining, I can't handle it.

 

[Guy]

The expectation of social interactions and public shows. I'd rather just cum one on one over and over all day than deal with hustling to make countdowns. I hate the expectation that models should be selling our snap/kik/phone number/whatever else on MFC. No outside contact allowed on SM, that's beautiful.

Every way the SM and MFC differs, is what I dislike about MFC and love about SM. Honestly, I really fucking hated MFC. It's so emotionally draining, I can't handle it.

Were a lot of the members mean to you?

 

[Poison_Ivy21]

Were a lot of the members mean to you?

No. Just time wasters and freeloaders.

 

[AmberCutie]

Does that mean the SM layout doesn't work? Does that mean that reuploading content isn't super fucked up?

Doesn't SM upload performers' videos to particular tube sites for traffic? I think you can opt out of that or something but by default isn't that included?

 

[Poison_Ivy21]

Doesn't SM upload performers' videos to particular tube sites for traffic? I think you can opt out of that or something but by default isn't that included?

I've heard that was the case with LiveJasmin in particular, but when a capped show of mine ended up on there I got it taken down with no problem.

So, I don't know. I've never seen anywhere to opt in or out of that.

 

[AmberCutie]

I've heard that was the case with LiveJasmin in particular, but when a capped show of mine ended up on there I got it taken down with no problem.

So, I don't know. I've never seen anywhere to opt in or out of that.

I know we've had a discussion here somewhere about the fact that SM allows affiliates to use model videos to drive traffic in, or even directly uploads videos themselves to other sites.

I just wanted to point out that while MFC is much more obvious about using the "free" structure, SM and other sites do similar stuff, just in a less obvious way.

 

[Poison_Ivy21]

I just want to reiterate something real quick. Yes, a lot of the large tube sites have paid membership options. Yes, quite a few of them drive traffic to SM's live streams. But my problem with tube sites is what they have done to so many men's attitudes. Tube sites (and people just being shitty in general) are the reasons why 9 times out of 10, when I meet a guy around my age and tell him what I do, I'm given this response,

"Who the fuck pays for their porn!?"
"What fucking losers pay for their porn!?"

Tube sites have cultivated such a disgusting sense of entitlement in people when it comes to porn. They are honestly baffled that anyone pays for it at all, and that's fucking enraging. Granted, male entitlement is nothing new and tubes sites aren't the only cause, but goddamn they aren't helping one bit. That's why I'm so damn frustrated. That's why, regardless of the traffic Pornhub brings to SM, I FUCKING HATE THEM.

And, as that video pointed out, they make it incredibly easy for underage people to watch our content. Not cool and not good.

 

[Poison_Ivy21]

I know we've had a discussion here somewhere about the fact that SM allows affiliates to use model videos to drive traffic in, or even directly uploads videos themselves to other sites.

I just wanted to point out that while MFC is much more obvious about using the "free" structure, SM and other sites do similar stuff, just in a less obvious way.

Just live preforming for people who haven't paid makes me super uneasy. At least capped videos I can get taken down. I'm really uncomfortable with the fact anyone could be watching me live, you don't even need an account. I can't handle that.

 

[mynameisbob84]

I just want to reiterate something real quick. Yes, a lot of the large tube sites have paid membership options. Yes, quite a few of them drive traffic to SM's live streams. But my problem with tube sites is what they have done to so many men's attitudes. Tube sites (and people just being shitty in general) are the reasons why 9 times out of 10, when I meet a guy around my age and tell him what I do, I'm given this response,

"Who the fuck pays for their porn!?"
"What fucking losers pay for their porn!?"

Tube sites have cultivated such a disgusting sense of entitlement in people when it comes to porn. They are honestly baffled that anyone pays for it at all, and that's fucking enraging. Granted, male entitlement is nothing new and tubes sites aren't the only cause, but goddamn they aren't helping one bit. That's why I'm so damn frustrated. That's why, regardless of the traffic Pornhub brings to SM, I FUCKING HATE THEM.

And, as that video pointed out, they make it incredibly easy for underage people to watch our content. Not cool and not good.

I think this is just true of younger people in general. I work in a record store and "what? People still pay for records?" isn't an entirely uncommon response when I tell people that for the first time. Digital natives have grown up with computers and the internet and a world of media readily available to them for free if they know which buttons to press and what to click on. I don't think it matters whether they're male or female, or whether it's porn, music, films, or games, or anything else... to many people, the idea of voluntarily paying for something that's easily obtainable for free is a strange one.

 

[Poison_Ivy21]

I think this is just true of younger people in general. I work in a record store and "what? People still pay for records?" isn't an entirely uncommon response when I tell people that for the first time. Digital natives have grown up with computers and the internet and a world of media readily available to them for free if they know which buttons to press and what to click on. I don't think it matters whether they're male or female, or whether it's porn, music, films, or games, or anything else... to many people, the idea of voluntarily paying for something that's easily obtainable for free is a strange one.

In my experience, these people generally don't have much problem paying $8 a month for Netflix or Hulu. Or paying $5-10 for Spotify Premium. But the moment your bring up paying for porn, "OMG WHY WOULD I DO THAT!?!"

Tube sites just make it waaaaay too easy. At least if you're gonna illegally download music or movies, that takes some time, effort and potential risk of infecting your computer with something. All you gotta do is go pornhub.com and you have anything at your finger tips.

I don't have a record player, as cool as that'd be, but I do still buy CD's! Gotta have something in my car incase my phone dies.

 

[Zoomer]

Traffic does not equal paying traffic.

But... it can; and it does... actually. Here is some proof from two of my MFC accounts (I have 4 - mainly incase the ones with BAF got banned it wouldn't be my "real" account that I actually buy tokens and chat via!).

Number of Free Accounts Registered: 637
Number of Premium Accounts Registered: 189
Bonus Tokens Pending: 460
Tokens Credited Account: 50540

Number of Free Accounts Registered: 659
Number of Premium Accounts Registered: 178
Bonus Tokens Pending: 560
Tokens Credited Account: 48780


Those are people signing up to MFC as basics, and then how many of those converted from basics to premium.

Okay, the samples aren't MAHOOSIVE - but it still shows a near 25-30% conversion ratio of basic -> premium members. Obviously I have no indication as to how many went onwards to being repeat spenders, nor how many guests there were (perhaps it's 1:1, 10:1, 100:1, 1000:1 conversion of guests to basics!).

But yes, advertising and getting people in the front door works. The above figures are derived from people searching a model name, finding my site, joining and then going premium. How did they find the model names? Probably via forums and tube sites.

Incidentally, also how I found MFC. Now I've got approx 30,000 rewards points across two accounts - and then when you add the below on top... that's a shit load of tokens that came from just lil old ME finding Mary (Goldenlady, Crazysysy, Crazy_m) back in 2010? That doesn't even start to account for how many of those 367 premium members spent more than $20 either!

All because 1 guy saw a free video of Mary, and joined MFC.

"Traffic does not equal paying traffic" - not necessarily no; but it can. And a percentage of it... does.

Before anyone thinks I'm advocating piracy - I'm not. I have a very strong belief and annoyance at people who use the line "But I wouldn't have bought it anyway" with regards to movies/games. The feeling of self entitlement based on "But I wouldn't... so it doesn't cost anything..." is insane.

But there are nuanced differences in business models, and I have no doubt that tube sites and/or various sites does indeed bring in far more than basic advertising can achieve. Do I agree with en-mass hosting of content? No. But I do believe that (perhaps) in not being majorly vigilant, they're actually gaining traffic, profit, and some models livelihoods... where otherwise there would not have been any.

If it hadn't been for MFC's free model I wouldn't have ever stayed. And all the above would have never happened...

 

[VeronicaChaos]

In my experience, these people generally don't have much problem paying $8 a month for Netflix or Hulu. Or paying $5-10 for Spotify Premium. But the moment your bring up paying for porn, "OMG WHY WOULD I DO THAT!?!"

Tube sites just make it waaaaay too easy. At least if you're gonna illegally download music or movies, that takes some time, effort and potential risk of infecting your computer with something. All you gotta do is go pornhub.com and you have anything at your finger tips.

I don't have a record player, as cool as that'd be, but I do still buy CD's! Gotta have something in my car incase my phone dies.

I feel like Netflix doesn't quite hold up, as there is not a porn equivalent. MFC doesn't keep your credit card information and rebill you each month. Paysites do, but they lack the variety or quantity of something like Netflix. I find buying things on Amazon easy because it saves your card and has one click ordering. I wish the adult industry would/could adopt some of these more modern business models but with how weird credit card companies are with porn I'm not sure what the limitations are.

But I do agree that there is a weird ego/bragging thing when it comes to not paying for porn. I think the key to that is to continue to emphasize the fact that payment ensures ethics. A lot of people think of the porn world as seedy and fail to realize that by watching videos free on pornhub they're experiencing and contributing to that part of the industry.

We should start adultflix hehehe. All indie porn all the time!

 

[weirdbr]

Tube sites just make it waaaaay too easy. At least if you're gonna illegally download music or movies, that takes some time, effort and potential risk of infecting your computer with something. All you gotta do is go pornhub.com and you have anything at your finger tips.

That's not very different from music/movies to be honest - go to piratebay, type your search and voila. Or for music,you can even go to youtube, search the title of an album/song and find the whole CD there without paying anything (*maybe* the copyright owner will get paid if there's ads shown, but not always there's ads).

The difference is that the movie/music industry waged the war against piracy differently, by targeting both sites and users while the porn industry in general just stayed around crying about lost profits while Manwin went around taking their business. As a result of those two differing approaches, you now have Hulu/Netflix/Itunes/Google Play for music/movies/series while for porn there's only the tube sites and whatever paid sites are left that weren't absorbed by manwin (yet).

MFC doesn't keep your credit card information and rebill you each month. Paysites do, but they lack the variety or quantity of something like Netflix.

The closest you get to a netflix are the sites that partner together so you get 'free' access to the others by signing up to one of them , but even then it's a small selection - you might get access to less than 20 sites, while on a service like Netflix the inventory is on the order of thousands of titles. Maybe it could work if for example a clip site like Manyvids or Clips4sale offered a streaming-only option for a flat fee, but I bet there would be a huge pushback from some models (just like happened when Netflix and friends showed up).

 

[AmberCutie]

The closest you get to a netflix are the sites that partner together so you get 'free' access to the others by signing up to one of them , but even then it's a small selection - you might get access to less than 20 sites, while on a service like Netflix the inventory is on the order of thousands of titles.

There are netflix type membership sites made for porn, but I think they're all the more popular big budget studio porn vids.

 

[Guy]

There are netflix type membership sites made for porn, but I think they're all the more popular big budget studio porn vids.

Sadly, Pornhub Has launched a Netflix like streaming service.

 

[Serenity_Tam]

http://www.salon.com/2013/05/30/is_success_killing_the_porn_industry_partner/
http://www.vice.com/en_ca/read/porn-stars-want-you-to-stop-jacking-off-for-free

In many ways yes.

But on the other hand the internet gives us a platform for our work and the way it works piracy will ALWAYS happen. We deal with it, and accept there will always be honest people with a soul who realise this is an industry made of people who have to feed themselves and their families and that we are a valued form of entertainment just like vanilla films.

 

[AmberCutie]

Sadly, Pornhub Has launched a Netflix like streaming service.

Why sadly? It's just another company doing what others have done for years: accept a monthly membership fee to watch streams of porn videos. If you notice, it's big name studios who are participating in it.

No sadly, it's great. If anything it's HELPING the porn industry. Must stay with the times and be relevant.

 

[AmberCutie]

I also think it's funny that articles are claiming that PornHub is revolutionizing anything, as this sort of service is old news. I belonged to a porn membership for streaming and dvd rentals in the mid 2000's for fuck's sake.

 

[mynameisbob84]

Maybe it could work if for example a clip site like Manyvids or Clips4sale offered a streaming-only option for a flat fee, but I bet there would be a huge pushback from some models (just like happened when Netflix and friends showed up).

I could have sworn Clips4Sale had a streaming service but I just tried to look it up and can't see anything. Maybe they trialled it and decided against it.

 

[Guy]

Why sadly? It's just another company doing what others have done for years: accept a monthly membership fee to watch streams of porn videos. If you notice, it's big name studios who are participating in it.

No sadly, it's great. If anything it's HELPING the porn industry. Must stay with the times and be relevant.

Pornhub is owned by MindGeek. MindGeek is a huge monopoly thats taking over the porn industry. Did you watch the video I posted on this thread?

 

[AmberCutie]

My friend, I feel like you're too worked up over this, lol.

 

[Puffin]

MIndGeek is a fucking Monopoly!

Less then 10 years ago, MySpace was also a monopoly.

 

[Guy]

Less then 10 years ago, MySpace was also a monopoly.

I never used MySpace. MindGeek is a lot like Walmart.

 

[Gen]

I could have sworn Clips4Sale had a streaming service but I just tried to look it up and can't see anything. Maybe they trialled it and decided against it.

Each studio (model) can set up their own so you'd stream videos from that store only. The studio can change the price for a monthly subscription anywhere from around $12 to over $100. So the models choose both the price and what content is included.

 

[AlanaTaylor]

Oh monopoly.

 

[mynameisbob84]

Each studio (model) can set up their own so you'd stream videos from that store only. The studio can change the price for a monthly subscription anywhere from around $12 to over $100. So the models choose both the price and what content is included.

I thought it was like, a site wide thing but maybe it was just individual stores. That would make more sense actually. I guess there's a lot of stores on there and it would be next to impossible to get each store owner to agree to their content being streamed.

 

[SaffronBurke]

Maybe it could work if for example a clip site like Manyvids or Clips4sale offered a streaming-only option for a flat fee, but I bet there would be a huge pushback from some models (just like happened when Netflix and friends showed up).

C4S does offer this as an option to all their studios (it's called C4SLive), but it's not as commonly purchased. I only get very sporadic subscriptions, and they usually make the most of their month and don't re-subscribe. It's also a pain in the ass for studios to maintain.

 

[Jesse0328]

It's one thing to blame the dominant player in an industry segment if they are actively preventing someone from competing. It's a whole different ballgame if certain parts of an industry refuse to adapt to market changes, and blame the same dominant player for their woes.

 

[LuckySmiles]

Plus it's the model's job to turn traffic into paying traffic, at least sites provide it. Are there going to be some people who will never no way pay ever? Sure. But every paying site member was a "freeloader" first.

Most models know the satisfaction of converting a newb to a tipper/contributor. Not that veteran members aren't appreciated, but I'll put up with a bunch of newbie faux pas any day to get someone genuinely just plain ol excited to see some titties and chat with a sexy lady. It's refreshing as fuck.

 

[Guy]

MetArt is suing DrTuber.com for copyright infringement http://www.xbiz.com/news/202052