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Tipping - who, how much, and why?

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Okay I am definitely missing something here. What do you guys mean by the term "barista"? Is it the person handling the coffee machine and making your drink (i.e the guy who calls your name at Starbucks?) or are we talking about sitting down cafés with waitresses that bring you coffee to your table and this is the person you call "barista"? Do any of you tip the drink makers at Starbucks? I never ever had. However I tip 20% at "sitting down" cafés since I consider them "waitresses". I am so confused.

Usually on the counter by the cash there is a cup for tips and people toss in a quarter or more. Some places I go to for coffee don't have tip jars and people just leave a few quarters on the counter, a lot like ordering a drink in a bar.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. I go into a restaurant to pick up an order I had called in, and the hostess or whoever handles it, retrieves my meal from the kitchen and I pay her. In the particular restaurant I'm thinking of, there's a tip jar, and a line for tips on the credit card slip. Until a few years ago, I never tipped in these situations because I thought "they weren't really doing anything," just ringing up the order and taking payment. Then I read some discussion forums on the topic and realized this person may be reliant on tips also (due to below minimum wage), and that there may be other restaurant staff who typically fall between the cracks who may be sharing in that tip. So, I started tipping 10 - 15 percent in those situations.

But the point is, why should I have to understand all these intricacies of the restaurant business, or worry about whether the tip I give is being equitably distributed? There's just so much unnecessary complication. All I want to do is pay for my food.

Here's an analogy: at the grocery store, I buy organic, free-range chicken, mainly because it makes me feel better about myself, and about the chickens, lol.. It's more expensive, but it's worth it to me. In the same way, I would be glad to pay higher prices at the restaurant if I knew the staff (all of them) were being compensated adequately and fairly.

I agree it is more complicated than it needs to be. I heard an interview on the radio a while ago with a restaurant owner who raised their prices and made a no-tipping policing. I don't know what he was paying his staff but it obviously had to be something much higher than minimum wage. I think as long as people are getting minimum wage, tipping isn't going to go away. I worked in a place last year, as a cook, where the servers and kitchen staff were paid the same wages and the tips were dived equally, which I think was great. It was a way to say the work up front and in the kitchen is valued equally. We did a lot of take out at that place and we noticed that if we had a lunch rush that was mostly take out, we would make shit tips. I understand the rational to not tip for take out. Just know that your tips are truly appreciated!!
 
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....I heard an interview on the radio a while ago with a restaurant owner who raised their prices and made a no-tipping policing. I don't know what he was paying his staff but it obviously had to be something much higher than minimum wage.

I've heard of that, too. He's a prominent restauranteur in NYC. I don't know how that worked out; I'll have to check into that.

Somewhat OT, there's also the well known case of the CEO/founder of a company in Seattle who raised the minimum salary at the company to $70K. It met with initial enthusiasm, but then some employees became disgruntled due to perceived fairness issues. Here, too, I don't know what the current status is.
 
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I always tip waitstaff and delivery drivers, in my state they make $3 less than minimum wage, which is absolute bullshit. My delivery drivers always get $8, which working in a pizza place I know is generally higher than they usually get, but I also know how excited they get over higher tips, so it makes me happy knowing I probably made their night. With servers in restaurants I tip 10% if the service was off, 15% if it's good, and 20%+ when they go above and beyond. I know some think it's silly to tip if the service was bad, but it's not usually the servers fault and they usually go above and beyond to fix things for me, most mistakes are the kitchens fault, and most kitchens make a living wage, so I'm not gonna punish the underpaid server because someone who gets paid the same either way doesn't care enough to check their tickets.
I typically don't carry cash though, so I always forget to tip batistas and other "counter service" places, especially if I use debit instead of credit.
 
OH I FORGOT ONE... Because I never go out anymore lol. But the bathroom attendants in like bars/night clubs!
That's the weirdest thing ever. But they sorta keep it clean, have lollipops and hair spray and deal with crazy drunk people all night.
That would get weird sometimes because I'm a frequent pee-er and overly generous when drinking. So if it's like a dollar every time I'm in there over the course of a few hours that could be like 4-5 dollars. And then sometimes it's like you're in there not tipping but it's like I SEE YOU I WILL PEE 10 MORE TIMES TONIGHT I PROMISE

And then if I'm hammered and the place seems crazy or someone I'm with is taking too long or being insane I'll like throw $5 in the basket like a weirdo.

OH! and I just remembered another one. Because I don't gamble anymore (my own money anyways... sometimes other peoples heheh)

But casinos! like at table games. I tip a $5 or $10 in chips every time I hit a significant win, or a bit at the end if I get up from the table a winner, to the dealer. But with those games I sit down with around $200 or so to play with. So say I lose a few hands( like $50 down) then hit a win for $100 or something and tip. And usually keep going. That's also good because if you end up losing all your money but have fun for a couple hours, you still tipped for entertainment. That's why it's better to do it at intervals than wait til the end.

People forget to do that sometimes and it looks bad. Plus the dealers all share tips, so I do it whether their nice and funny or act like a wet mop.
 
That is weird. And the tip doesn't seem truly excessive. I mean, if your pizza was $13 and you tipped $100.... Maybe there's been a rash of tip fraud (whatever that means). Maybe restaurant staff are editing peoples' signed charge slips. Idk.

My dad actually had a waiter at his restaurant who was fired over tip fraud, so.... Yeah.

as a former bar manager our computers used to require manager approval for entering tips over a certain percentage of the bill. That's not a huge tip but it's over 30% so that's prob the credit card company's default alert amount.

Huh, I didn't know places did that! I chronically over tip at bars, 30% minimum, often 50% or more, they must love/hate me for it.



I'm generous with my delivery folks because my apartment complex is set up very strangely, and often people's GPS won't take them to (or remotely near) my building, even with the exact address. Plus, we have tons of speed bumps, so it's like "thanks for finding me, sorry about your shocks!"
 
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Usually on the counter by the cash there is a cup for tips and people toss in a quarter or more. Some places I go to for coffee don't have tip jars and people just leave a few quarters on the counter, a lot like ordering a drink in a bar.



I agree it is more complicated than it needs to be. I heard an interview on the radio a while ago with a restaurant owner who raised their prices and made a no-tipping policing. I don't know what he was paying his staff but it obviously had to be something much higher than minimum wage. I think as long as people are getting minimum wage, tipping isn't going to go away. I worked in a place last year, as a cook, where the servers and kitchen staff were paid the same wages and the tips were dived equally, which I think was great. It was a way to say the work up front and in the kitchen is valued equally. We did a lot of take out at that place and we noticed that if we had a lunch rush that was mostly take out, we would make shit tips. I understand the rational to not tip for take out. Just know that your tips are truly appreciated!!

Oh so I did get you guys correctly. Sounds nuts to me. In my mind tip jars are for small coins you don't want to take with you, and I will never tip a "barista" if I am standing up and waiting for my drink to be prepared. It isn't a bar, the barista isn't a sexy girl in leather pants and high heels flirting with me while juggling 5 bottles to make a complicated drink. A "barista" is a kid in a Starbucks uniform with unkempt hair who doesn't look at me at all and yells my name wrong. So no, sorry, no tip for you. I am sure they are all fine people but if your job doesn't involve having to hold a conversation with me I don't feel like I have to tip you. That goes for the kitchen people as well. If I have no contact or minimal contact with you, my tip is not required.
 
I really don't think of baristas as someone people need to tip. I'll toss whatever change is handed back to me and I may include $1 but in my small town it's one girl taking your order, making your drink, talking to you and handing you your drink, it just feels a bit different than Starbucks. In a Starbucks I can't imagine tipping anything. In a bar, I usually have to shuffle my way to the bar, wait and then later the girl will repeatedly come check to see what I need and then bring it to me, so it just feels like more of a waitress situation. To me, a barista is no different than someone who works at a fast food restaurant. Granted, I have never worked as one but I did work in fast food in high school and I just don't see the difference.
 
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I really don't think of baristas as someone people need to tip. I'll toss whatever change is handed back to me and I may include $1 but in my small town it's one girl taking your order, making your drink, talking to you and handing you your drink, it just feels a bit different than Starbucks. In a Starbucks I can't imagine tipping anything. In a bar, I usually have to shuffle my way to the bar, wait and then later the girl will repeatedly come check to see what I need and then bring it to me, so it just feels like more of a waitress situation. To me, a barista is no different than someone who works at a fast food restaurant. Granted, I have never worked as one but I did work in fast food in high school and I just don't see the difference.

I've never worked in a cafe or restaurant that is a chain or a fast food place, and likewise I don't go to Starbucks unless there is no other choice cause I've never really like their coffee. I can see people thinking it's not necessary to tip at a place like that if they consider it in the category of fast food. The bar comparison I made was referring to places where you order at the bar and wait for drink from the bar tender and then leave a tip on the counter for the bar tender.

A "barista" is a kid in a Starbucks uniform with unkempt hair who doesn't look at me at all and yells my name wrong.

You really missing out by only going to places like Starbucks! There are a ton of cafes with flirty baristas who are very well kempt!
 
Yah.. well it's the credit card really. When you swipe the card at a restaurant/bar/takeout whatever and the little line comes up to enter a tip on the receipt, that means and authorization is on the card for an additional amount beyond the cost. Because the tips are entered at the end of the day and charged separately. But only a certain percent is authorized. So anything beyond that will create an alert. I once knew someone who got a $1000 tip on a credit card and they had to get on the phone with the credit card company over it.

It's the same reason why, if you have a AMex gift card or even like a payoneer prepaid card and don't have enough additional balance for the tip, it will be declined. Say you have a $50 check and you want to use a $50 gift card and tip in cash. It will be declined, because there's not enough balance to authorize a tip.
 
Too late to edit. But there's ways around this in the software as well, but idk sometimes at that point people get frazzled. It's hard for an employee to tell the difference between someone whose cards are maxed out and someone who's using a prepaid card so it can be major awkward.

Because I could just run the card for $40, balance paid in cash and the tip charged as $10 and the cash/tip/card totals would all even out at the end of the day. BUT... you know... not everyone might realize that right away etc etc. But if you ever had one of those cards declined at a restaurant now you know why! You can tell them you know how to get around it Luckysmiles told you so but I don't know if that will work haha.
 
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I usually tip at least 20% no matter what service I'm getting, but if I have an especially pleasant experience, I tip up to 30%. But no matter how horrible a service is, I can't bring myself to tip below 20%. It makes me feel super guilty. :(
 
The reason I love the concept of tipping is because it gives an incentive for waitstaff to please you. In countries where tips are not expected like in Europe you tend to get shittier service, the waiters know they will get their salary regardless of how they treat you. This could be fixed if the owners would be free to fire and hire as they see fit, it would be a matter of finding the right staff, but in Europe laws are so draconian that there are heavy penalties for laying off an employee that could make a business go bankrupt. So they are stuck with the person they first hired.

The exception is Japan. The difference is that the incentive to do your job well in Japan is cultural. There is a very thick social expectation to perform to the best of your capacities in Japan and if you are seen as someone who slacks off you get shamed and shunned. So in this scenario you replace the positive monetary incentive by a negative social punishment. In both cases you are rewarding and punishing behaviors. Perhaps the only difference is with tips you get to set the standard individually while with Japan it is set collectively and quite hard to change.

Naturally tips only work as a positive reinforcement when people don't assume they are actually mandatory. Which is my main problem with some people who think you should tip 20% even if you get treated like dirt, you simply "never again go to that establishment". But that defeats the whole purpose of tipping, if you assume that you need to tip everyone a standard 20%. When I get treated really poorly I tip nothing. If I get mediocre service I tip 10%. I only tip 20% when I am really satisfied, and if the waitstaff went above and beyond, only then, do I tip more than 20%.
I'm going to play my own devil's advocate for a second. I'm the sort of person who will always tip decently, even if the service was really bad. There was this one Mexican restaurant by my house I used to go to. Mainly I went by myself and brought a book, but when friends were in town I would bring them. I noticed the service when I was alone got progressively worse, I'm assuming because they thought I was more hassle than I was worth being alone, but I was really low maintenance and always tipped well. So even when I decided to stop going there I tipped well to make a point that they were being scummy in thinking I wouldn't. I also probably don't look like the sort of person to tip well, I'm kind of a mess irl and wear clothes that are 15 years old. But I guess I have some sort of pride in not allowing them to be right about me?

Anyway, back to my point. It could be argued that if someone is a bad server, maybe they shouldn't do well, because there is likely another job out there that is better suited for them that they will never discover if they keep making good tips being bad at their job. When I was a server I was lousy and made no money and that made me realize it wasn't the job for me. Likewise I was a terrible stripper and made little in tips and left that to cam, which I love. And the lack of tips I've received in camming during various times have motivated me to be better and use my strengths. I sometimes wonder if people had always tipped me generously regardless of service if I wouldn't still be at some job I was bad at and didn't push me to become better.
 
I actually do tip at least a buck when I go to coffee shops because very often I'll customize my drink (not like a TON) but that automatically takes it out of the category of fast food to me and into like bar service.

I also tip at sandwich places for the same reason.

If you are giving me an extra service, I'll compensate for it.
 
Earlier this month, there were a couple of posts in this thread about a restauranteur in NYC who was eliminating tipping in his restaurants. I decided to do a little research and see how that was going.

First, here's the original article, in October 2015. Here's an excerpt:

By increasing prices and ending tips, Mr. Meyer said he hoped to be able to raise pay for junior dining room managers and for cooks, dishwashers and other kitchen workers. Compensation would remain roughly the same for servers, who currently get most of their income from tips. Under federal labor laws, pooled tips can be distributed only to customer service workers who typically receive gratuities, and cannot be shared with the kitchen staff or managers.

“The gap between what the kitchen and dining room workers make has grown by leaps and bounds,” Mr. Meyer said. During his 30 years in the business, he said, “kitchen income has gone up no more than 25 percent. Meanwhile, dining room pay has gone up 200 percent.”

The wage gap is one of several issues cited by restaurateurs who have deleted the tip line from checks. Some believe it is unfair for servers’ pay to be affected by their race and age, their customer’s moods, the weather and other factors that have nothing to do with performance.
. . . .
Many customers remain deeply attached to the right to reward attentive service, or to withhold that reward. And servers often say that the bonanzas they take home after busy nights far outweigh the risk of getting nothing once in a while.

Here's a NY Times editorial from a couple of days later, generally favoring the new practice.

Here's an interview with Danny Meyer, the restauranteur, in February of this year. An excerpt:

Do you think there is an industry that could be improved by switching to a tipping model? No. I don’t know too many tipped professions where, as a parent, I would say, ‘‘I really want my child to go into that profession.’’ It just feels unprofessional. It’s sad. It’s not that I want my kids to be doctors and lawyers — we don’t have any in our family — but would you tip your doctor? Would you tip your lawyer? Would you tip your architect? Would you tip the airline pilot? Implicit in the very custom of tipping is that the person on the receiving end would not have otherwise done as well for you, had you not tipped. It’s just . . . it’s icky.

That's the last thing I've seen on Danny Meyer's no tipping policy, so I assume it's still going. On the other hand, Joe's Crab Shack, a casual seafood chain, tried a no tipping experiment but reverted to the old, tipping system six months later. An excerpt:

Company research had found that 60 percent of the restaurants’ customers disliked the change in tipping, Mr. Merritt [CEO] said. They wanted to inspire good service with their tips and they didn’t trust management to pass on the money to its employees, he said. “The system has to change at some point, but our customers and staff spoke very loudly,” Mr. Merritt said. “And a lot of them voted with their feet.”

So, it may be that a no-tipping model is more feasible at higher end restaurants.

A couple of observations:

(1) It seems like one of the attractions of tipping for customers is the feeling/perception that they are rewarding or inspiring good service with their tips. I don't understand this perspective, especially since so many commenters above have said something to the effect that they will tip 15 or 20 percent regardless of the quality of service. As I mentioned in a previous post, the only time I feel like I am rewarding or encouraging good service is when I am a regular repeat customer and I'm dealing with the same person(s) all the time, and they know me. That's a very small proportion of my tipping encounters. At a restaurant that I go to semi-frequently, it's very unlikely that the server and I will know each other from my previous meals there, so the only reason I tip in that situation is to help make sure the server is being paid adequately. I would give them the same tip if their service was poor. But it shouldn't be my responsibility to pay the restaurant's employees; that's the owner/manager's responsibility. I don't want to deal with two transactions, two service providers every time I go to a restaurant or other tipping-expected business.

(2) As some of the articles posted above mention, the low-wage supplemented by tipping model is historically rooted in the prevalence of women and minorities in those types of jobs, and the willingness of society to pay them poorly. Surely we are well past the point where that attitude is acceptable as a basis for compensation decisions.

(3) Danny Meyer made a comment in that interview that I find interesting: "Implicit in the very custom of tipping is that the person on the receiving end would not have otherwise done as well for you, had you not tipped." That may be the perception of many customers, who apparently enjoy being able to reward or punish the person receiving the tip. Maybe they feel that the tip gives them leverage with the restaurant or whatever. I don't understand that perspective, and it seems like an abuse of the tipping custom. If I have a problem with a restaurant server or other tipped employee, I will talk to the manager, owner or other responsible person. But I also wonder whether tipped employees see a connection between level of service provided and tips received. If they tailor their performance to the expected tip amount, they simply aren't doing their jobs. It's unprofessional, as Danny Meyer said.
 
I always do 20% no matter what. Either way I figure if they treated me badly it's like a "Smack in the face" somewhat because they will possibly ask themselves "Damn, I didn't deserve this" etc or sometimes it's not their fault but the kitchen. Either way it's bound to bring good energy to my life. :Fans
 
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