Smart people sometimes do stupid things

[camstory]

I could be the poster child for smart ppl doing stupid shit, so I think I know how Kathy Griffin is feeling right about now. At the same time, I am aware that I can not understand truly what she is going through. Not all of us have made mistakes of a career destroying magnitude, but I have and know that one, twice. What I do not know is celebrity, and I can only imagine how that weights as a huge part of the emotional baggage Griffin has packed for herself.

When Don Imus referred to the Rutgers girls basketball team as having a lot of "nappy headed hos" in 2007, I felt it was pretty outrageous. The comment was both racist and sexist. It was also a popular phrase with some in the hip-hop culture at the time. Imus had plucked that phrase out of the pop culture of the day, and it was outrageous - outrageously stupid!

Imus, a shock jock, made his living pushing the boundaries of what the ppl of the time would allow. The line he crossed was pretty clear, and " you would have to be an idiot" to not realize you were crossing that line, might be, and I think was, most people's reaction. But you clearly don't have to be an idiot to make a stupid mistake. Personally Imus is not my room of choice, but he is no idiot, and neither is Kathy Griffin.

Fame is a tough gig. Sure it has all those wonderful benefits, but it comes with some pretty big pitfalls too, if you are not careful, ALL THE TIME. Both Don Imus, and Kathy Griffin, a shock jock and a stand-up comedian are relevant because they push the boundaries. They say shit that often gives us a clearer perspective, or a new POV from which to view the world around us. When they stay within the lines we value them as insightful, even brave. When they make a foolish, thoughtless mistake, I think we all too quickly forget the stage these ppl are on 24/7, and either participate, or quietly stand by as they are vilified to the point of depriving them of their livelihood. What is amazing to me is not that smart ppl in the spotlight of celebrity sometimes do stupid things, but that so many manage to navigate without ever running aground on the unforgiving rocks of popular moral judgment. I can not make a year without at least one major act of stupidity, but if our celebrities make a stupid mistake many gather with their pitchforks and torches at the ready to condemn them for life.

At the risk of being too wordy, something I rarely take caution to avoid anyway, I would like to point out one more similarity. Both Imus, and Griffin were influenced to a degree, more or less by the prevailing culture of the day. That does not excuse them for behaving badly, or make their mistake any less stupid. Though, I have to wonder if Imus would have used the same racist, misogynistic language if it had not been a popular hip-hop phrase? I also wonder if Griffin might not have thought better than to insult the president, regardless of her feelings of dislike, if the president acted remotely presidential?

Your thoughts please.

 

[JoleneBrody]

People give way too many shits about what comedians and celebrities are doing and saying lately, I don't understand it. almost every time I open my apple news app the top trending (trending as in what is most being read not promoted) fox news article is about a celebrity while all this other important shit is going on and being reported elsewhere. I have no idea when comedians suddenly became ambassadors... they are comedians, and they make fun of things in ways that will sometimes (horribly) fail. Who gives a shit?
People don't care about politics, they just want something to be mad about, a devil to target.

 

[Shutterbuck]

Peeps upset at a celebrity? When there are more important issues at hand?

 

[dilligaf0]

Two things related to this.
1) Yes, Griffin made a big mistake in judgement but consider this, the same people that are so upset about her are the same ones displaying Obama hanging in effigy.
2) Those the whine that the image is so offensive are reposting the image to raise money for the next election. (Yes, for one the California GOP).
Being offended is one thing but this is putting way too much value on the opinions of others instead of forming one's own opinion.

 

[Deleted member 37064]

Your thoughts please.

We all do a lot of stupid shit, I know I get caught every once in a while for doing stuff...

Regarding those in the "spotlight", my thoughts:

Comments such as Imus' statement, is dangerous waters. Why is it okay for a segment of people to refer to themselves (meaning demographic group) in such a way that when another does it it's taboo? For example, why is it okay for Chris Rock, and other blacks to refer to themselves as "nigger" or the slang "nigga"? Yet, if a white person says it, they are demonized for it? Holds true for many special interest groups. Personally, I think that if said demographic has an issue with the word, they should check themselves and NOT use it.

Kathy Griffin... Her, and the dumbass teacher who was filmed "shooting" at a video of Trump with a squirt gun should be subjected to a full investigation by the Secret Service. Why? Because these can be construed as violent acts against the President. Yes, Freedom of Speech, blah blah blah.. Don't like Trump, and I seriously disliked Obama. But, there is a distinct difference between speaking out about a President and portraying violent acts towards a President via an effigy. Regardless of if you like a particular President or not, at least show respect to the Office. Seems people have forgotten what it means to show respect, while still voicing disapproval...

As to people in highly public positions such as actors, athletes, politicians, etc. Regardless of what they think, they should be held to a higher standard of sorts. Comes with the territory. How many children view athletes as role models (right or wrong), and emulate what they see them do on and off the court? Why is it okay for actors and entertainers such as radio hosts and personalities to use the media to influence the vote? Would any of us be allowed to? Why are some politicians demonized for certain actions, yet their counterparts on the other part are given a free pass when they do the same thing?

People need to understand that if you want equality, and I mean true equality, it's not okay to give a free pass to some while demonizing others. Hold everyone accountable for the shit they say and do, regardless of affiliations. This is why some don't like me in that I don't care about who you are, your affiliations, etc. and I will hold you accountable. Justice is supposed to be blind when it comes to dealing punishment. Meaning, doesn't care about race, ethnicity, demographics, etc. It's applied equally and justly to all.

 

[Lucid1]

Did everyone's toes suddenly get longer, or is this just the natural progression of Political Correctness run-a-muck?

The same thing happened to satirist Bill Maher back in 2001 when he criticized the United States by saying a few days after 9/11 that "we have been the cowards, lobbing cruise missile's from hundreds of miles away", referring to the use of Tomahawk missle's prior to the 9/11 attack. If he has said this just a few days before 9/11 no one would have even batted an eyelid. Yet, he had to endure a long and drawn out apology to satiate the masses who took offense. Advertisers like Sears and Federal Express pulled their advertising revenue from his show in response to his comment. It's nice to see these companies supporting capitalism and all, but they sure do forget that in doing so, they pull the rug out from underneath the mechanism that supports him being able to say such things in the first place. Imus is a shock-jock, just as Maher's show is labeled as satire, so do people watch/listen to these shows just to get a hollow victory "Gotchya" moment, or what? I would say that the people who watch or listen to these types of shows, just so they can get offended and inject their own agenda into the fray are much worse than what was actually said, especially in the cases of Maher and Imus, who are both -very- clear about why they do what they do. I could care less what celebrities have to say or think about politics and social issues. The only people I hold to a higher standard in that regard are elected/appointed public officials, as once elected/appointed, they become representatives of everyone and should choose their words wisely.

 

[camstory]

Regardless of if you like a particular President or not, at least show respect to the Office. Seems people have forgotten what it means to show respect, while still voicing disapproval...

I agree with much of what you say. This ^^^^^ I strongly agree with. Respect had a whole lot of ugly bed fellows tho, and i think it suffers greatly the baby being thrown out with the ugly bath water. And, yes, the office should be shown respect. I think that becomes debatable when the person who holds that office gives it no respect.

 

[camstory]

Didn't make the time cut, but here it is, a little low.

Edit: I am old enough and have been interested enough in politics, that its now a,,, well lets say a batch of presidents I've formed an opinion on. I very much disliked one or two before Trump, but on their worse day I felt they gave more respect to the office than Trump on his best.

You're going to be the president, and you make the statement that you will prolly not stay at the White House very much, because it is not as nice as your fancy ass hotel - show some fucking respect!

 

[Deleted member 37064]

Didn't make the time cut, but here it is, a little low.

Edit: I am old enough and have been interested enough in politics, that its now a,,, well lets say a batch of presidents I've formed an opinion on. I very much disliked one or two before Trump, but on their worse day I felt they gave more respect to the office than Trump on his best.

You're going to be the president, and you make the statement that you will prolly not stay at the White House very much, because it is not as nice as your fancy ass hotel - show some fucking respect!

Respect is a two way street, no doubt. It seems that many over the years have destroyed the reputation of the Presidency. As well as those whom are opposed to some Presidents have taken it to a whole different level in terms of extremism. Both need to be corrected.

In this election, we had our choices between a shrewd business man and entertainer. Or, a career crooked politician whom showed her true nature early on in her career at Watergate. Either way, the American people lose.

 

[Influenced]

Who gives a shit?

I totally agree with this, but if the failed news media crams it down peoples throats for long enough the sheep will keep running to the trough so to speak, they tell us what we should and should not give a shit about.

 

[Luckyfoxxy]

Kathy Griffith is a boring attention whore who masquarades as an artist. It was nothing but a publicity stunt.

 

[eyeteach]

Two things related to this.
1) Yes, Griffin made a big mistake in judgement but consider this, the same people that are so upset about her are the same ones displaying Obama hanging in effigy.
2) Those the whine that the image is so offensive are reposting the image to raise money for the next election. (Yes, for one the California GOP).
Being offended is one thing but this is putting way too much value on the opinions of others instead of forming one's own opinion.

Totally disagree with your #1. I found Griffin's photo totally classless, without merit, and a show for her liberal/progressive target audience that went nuclear and exploded in her face. Her "apology" and subsequent press conference were an extension of her 15 minutes of fame where she ultimately showed she had absolutely no remorse for her actions. As for President Obama, not once have i hung a likeness of him in effigy; nor wished someone would've gone ISIS on him with and beheaded him. I did not vote for him in either the 2008 election or in 2012, he and I share polar opposite positions on nearly every issue. But I have not now nor ever wish ill will on he or his family, I'll not lower myself to the practices of the hypocritical leftist elite or some D-list, never was, comedienne.

 

[justjoinedtopost]

The triumph of spectacle. Cult of the self.

Spoiler

I don't care about Imus or Griffin. Their jokes didn't amuse me, nor did they anger me.

This is what I know; the Al Sharpton crowd howling after the Imus incident, and the Hannity crew bemoaning Griffin's wtf-er, they both want the same thing.

Kathy Griffin... Her, and the dumbass teacher who was filmed "shooting" at a video of Trump with a squirt gun should be subjected to a full investigation by the Secret Service. Why? Because these can be construed as violent acts against the President. Yes, Freedom of Speech, blah blah blah.. Don't like Trump, and I seriously disliked Obama. But, there is a distinct difference between speaking out about a President and portraying violent acts towards a President via an effigy. Regardless of if you like a particular President or not, at least show respect to the Office. Seems people have forgotten what it means to show respect, while still voicing disapproval...

I think that is utterly daft.

You are misconstruing things. This was a ridiculous photoshoot and a teacher acting dumb. These were not violent acts; only a fool, or someone with ulterior motives would label them as such.

Whether they represent a credible threat or not, I wouldn't be surprised to hear the Secret Service has already inquired. Who knows.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2010/08/in_the_line_of_ire.html

There's a long history of threatening presidential representations. Hanging in effigy was a common form of political protest in the 18th and 19th centuries. Presidents Washington, Adams, and Jefferson were all hanged in effigy; and before the civil war, "Hang Abe Lincoln on a Sour Apple Tree" was a commonly sung parody of "John Brown's Body."

Flippant verbal threats against the president are similarly OK. In 1966, 18-year-old Robert Watts was at a public rally by the Washington Monument when he said, in reference to the draft, "If they ever make me carry a rifle the first man I want to get in my sights is L.B.J." He was arrested and prosecuted, but his conviction was overturned by the Supreme Court in Watts v. United States—the justices ruled that jokes about killing the president do not present a credible threat. Nearly two decades later, Ardith McPherson, a clerical worker in the office of the Constable of Harris County, Texas, was fired after she told her boyfriend, following reports of the Reagan assassination attempt, "If they go for him again, I hope they get him." McPherson sued for reinstatement claiming her First Amendment rights had been violated. The Supreme Court agreed, reiterating that comments or jokes made with no intent to act are perfectly legal free speech.

You want to show respect for the office of president, go right ahead. Demand it of others? Sounds like you want some blasphemy laws to me.

 

[JoleneBrody]

I totally agree with this, but if the failed news media crams it down peoples throats for long enough the sheep will keep running to the trough so to speak, they tell us what we should and should not give a shit about.

Being told to care about something doesn't mean you have to. We are the most intelligent beings on this planet (as far as it appears) and we are better than this.

Edit: We SHOULD be better than this.

 

[justjoinedtopost]

...she ultimately showed she had absolutely no remorse for her actions.

Seems to me faux remorse ought to be plenty sufficient in the face of faux outrage.

 

[dilligaf0]

Totally disagree with your #1. I found Griffin's photo totally classless, without merit, and a show for her liberal/progressive target audience that went nuclear and exploded in her face. Her "apology" and subsequent press conference were an extension of her 15 minutes of fame where she ultimately showed she had absolutely no remorse for her actions. As for President Obama, not once have i hung a likeness of him in effigy; nor wished someone would've gone ISIS on him with and beheaded him. I did not vote for him in either the 2008 election or in 2012, he and I share polar opposite positions on nearly every issue. But I have not now nor ever wish ill will on he or his family, I'll not lower myself to the practices of the hypocritical leftist elite or some D-list, never was, comedienne.

I never said her action was "classy". In fact I said it was bad judgement on her part. It was a dumb thing to do.
The fact that you didn't display any tacky images of Obama does not change the fact that many did (and there's plenty of photographic evidence of it). Many (not necessarily all) of those same people that are so "offended" by Griffin's action are the same people that did display such images.

 

[dilligaf0]

Didn't make the time cut, but here it is, a little low.

Edit: I am old enough and have been interested enough in politics, that its now a,,, well lets say a batch of presidents I've formed an opinion on. I very much disliked one or two before Trump, but on their worse day I felt they gave more respect to the office than Trump on his best.

You're going to be the president, and you make the statement that you will prolly not stay at the White House very much, because it is not as nice as your fancy ass hotel - show some fucking respect!

The same guy said while conning the country that he'd never leave the White House to go golfing because there's too much work that needs to be done.

You want to show respect for the office of president, go right ahead. Demand it of others? Sounds like you want some blasphemy laws to me.

Why should we respect the office of the President when the office holders don'y respect it?

 

[Deleted member 37064]

I don't care about Imus or Griffin. Their jokes didn't amuse me, nor did they anger me.

This is what I know; the Al Sharpton crowd howling after the Imus incident, and the Hannity crew bemoaning Griffin's wtf-er, they both want the same thing.

I wasn't angered nor amused by either of them, and I agree they are basically the same thing. Which, is what I was saying.

Whether they represent a credible threat or not, I wouldn't be surprised to hear the Secret Service has already inquired. Who knows.

The teacher was investigated. Griffin, who knows. In a sense, don't really care as she's irrelevant and looking for a few seconds of her supposed 15 minutes of fame.

You want to show respect for the office of president, go right ahead. Demand it of others? Sounds like you want some blasphemy laws to me.

What are your talking about? What a completely dumbass comment to make. you want to talk about misconstruing a statement? There you go, you just did it...

We have enough laws on the books, I certainly don't want more bullshit laws. My comment of respecting the office, even if you don't like(respect) the one currently holding is extremely valid. Think of it this way, you still show a manager at work some respect, even if you don't report to them. You still treat them with some level of decency and dignity, and don't go dragging a burning effigy into the office proclaiming you have zero respect for them and they should die for it Nor do you throw bags of feces or urine around because you disagree with a group of managers. You don't put a bandanna on your face and throw Molotov cocktails, turn over their cars in riots, or do property damage. Do you?

That is the kind of respect I'm talking about. Do I show respect to the PoTUS? Yes, because of the office. Even when it was someone I vehemently disagreed with, I did not call them names, make derogatory comments, etc. Am I demanding others do the same? No. But, I am asking for them to do so. Whether they choose to do so or not, is not my call. Even then, while I may disagree with what and how they are saying something, I respect their right to peaceably do so.

 

[Deleted member 37064]

The same guy said while conning the country that he'd never leave the White House to go golfing because there's too much work that needs to be done.

Why should we respect the office of the President when the office holders don'y respect it?

Why should we respect career politicians in the first please? Especially those whom have been corrupt since long before day 1? Or, only vote "Present" on things?

For the record, I despise both parties. They ar both corrupt and need to go.

 

[paige_orion]

That is the kind of respect I'm talking about. Do I show respect to the PoTUS? Yes, because of the office. Even when it was someone I vehemently disagreed with, I did not call them names, make derogatory comments, etc. Am I demanding others do the same? No. But, I am asking for them to do so. Whether they choose to do so or not, is not my call. Even then, while I may disagree with what and how they are saying something, I respect their right to peaceably do so.

Taking things down a toooootal side-tangent, but this line really stood out and set me thinking, so here's a bunch of rambles related to it!

I can understand asking to respect someone based on the simple fact that we are all humans, and as a whole, I'd like to think that human beings merit being treated with decency and respect. In the grand scheme of things, I think that's a pretty admirable goal. I mean, personally, I can't imagine a situation where death threats or reenactments can solve anything, but that's just me. However, I think the idea of respecting the PoTUS simply for the fact that they are the PoTUS is dangerous thinking. A title doesn't make someone worthy of respect. I mean... Look over at North Korea. Respect is DEMANDED of Kim Jong-un BECAUSE he is the Supreme Leader. Dissent is not allowed. That frightens me.

Just as it frightens me when I see people say that we must respect our country's leader simply because he holds the title. I think that is such a dangerous line of thought. When someone is given such power and responsibility, I think it is our duty to be critical. Look at how many world leaders have abused their power. Look at how much damage has been caused all around the world, in so many different cultures, just because a country's leader abused their privilege - or they weren't fit to wield it in the first place. Even if the country's leader is our own, we need to look at their actions and their words - and determine whether they, as an individual, are worthy of respect. We should judge a human based on their individual merits - their thoughts, their actions, their decisions. Judge them as a human being, and not because of a title.

It is hard for me to give respect to a man who has voted against the interest of me and mine. Who has dehumanized people I care about. Who shows no qualms about sexually assaulting women, and acts entitled to do so. Whose health care bill will spell the death of someone I love very much. None of those actions deserve my respect, and all of them are unforgiveable in my book. It is hard to take it kindly when someone tells me to show respect to someone who is supposed to represent my needs and my country, yet will cause me to lose so much. And I know so many others who are far more affected than me. I cannot blame them for their frustration, their dismay, their fury. I get it. And they shouldn't be expected to be silent, or to be polite, or to protect the feelings of someone who has hurt them so badly.

We are a country build on dissent. We did not agree with a king and so we rebelled. The Revolutionary War wasn't respectful nor polite - but as a people, we decided what was and wasn't acceptable to us anymore. We determined something was unfair and we rose up, and created something new in its place. America wouldn't be here without that ideal: standing up against what we do not believe in, what does not benefit our people as a whole. I think that being critical of our political system and our leaders... It's our responsibility as citizens. Bad things happen when everyone believes that a government can do whatever they way, simply because they are the government. But those politicians are supposed here to represent us, and if we are not happy, then it's kind of American tradition to Not Be Silenced about it.

And while I am all about peaceful disagreement and protesting... I also recognize the fact that peaceful protesting very rarely causes change. Sometimes, for people to realize that something is unfair, they have to stand up and demand change. They have to make it inconvenient or in-your-face, because it's not a comfortable topic. Injustice isn't comfortable. Change isn't comfortable. And humans, as a whole - we tend to close our eyes to things to things we don't want to address, brush them under the rug until something comes around and MAKES us open our eyes. I don't always agree with the way that dissension goes down, but I recognize the fact that often, there's no other way. You go up against enough injustice, get brushed away enough times and it becomes impossible to smile and be nice about it. Sometimes, you've got to scream to be heard.

 

[Deleted member 37064]

Taking things down a toooootal side-tangent, but this line really stood out and set me thinking, so here's a bunch of rambles related to it!

I think you focused solely on the one line, and didn't consider the rest of what I said as it is in alignment with what you said....

Just as it frightens me when I see people say that we must respect our country's leader simply because he holds the title. I think that is such a dangerous line of thought. When someone is given such power and responsibility, I think it is our duty to be critical. Look at how many world leaders have abused their power. Look at how much damage has been caused all around the world, in so many different cultures, just because a country's leader abused their privilege - or they weren't fit to wield it in the first place. Even if the country's leader is our own, we need to look at their actions and their words - and determine whether they, as an individual, are worthy of respect. We should judge a human based on their individual merits - their thoughts, their actions, their decisions. Judge them as a human being, and not because of a title.

You're misunderstanding what I said as there is a distinct difference, which I covered in at least a couple of different posts. But, nowhere am I saying that you have to be silent, and not speak out. In fact, I even say the opposite in this from my original post:

Regardless of if you like a particular President or not, at least show respect to the Office. Seems people have forgotten what it means to show respect, while still voicing disapproval...

What this means is that you can openly speak your mind, without fear of repercussions while still calling him "Sir" or "Mr. President" as that is his title. In short, that is what it means to respect the office. It is the various people whom have held that title which has caused damage to the title. They are the people whom I don't respect for what they did. But, this doesn't mean that I disrespect the office.

We are a country build on dissent. We did not agree with a king and so we rebelled. The Revolutionary War wasn't respectful nor polite - but as a people, we decided what was and wasn't acceptable to us anymore. We determined something was unfair and we rose up, and created something new in its place. America wouldn't be here without that ideal: standing up against what we do not believe in, what does not benefit our people as a whole. I think that being critical of our political system and our leaders... It's our responsibility as citizens. Bad things happen when everyone believes that a government can do whatever they way, simply because they are the government. But those politicians are supposed here to represent us, and if we are not happy, then it's kind of American tradition to Not Be Silenced about it.

And while I am all about peaceful disagreement and protesting... I also recognize the fact that peaceful protesting very rarely causes change. Sometimes, for people to realize that something is unfair, they have to stand up and demand change. They have to make it inconvenient or in-your-face, because it's not a comfortable topic. Injustice isn't comfortable. Change isn't comfortable. And humans, as a whole - we tend to close our eyes to things to things we don't want to address, brush them under the rug until something comes around and MAKES us open our eyes. I don't always agree with the way that dissension goes down, but I recognize the fact that often, there's no other way. You go up against enough injustice, get brushed away enough times and it becomes impossible to smile and be nice about it. Sometimes, you've got to scream to be heard.

Can I ask what your thoughts on things such as the ranchers whom took over Fed property because they felt they were being treated unjustly? Or, what if the veterans, LEO and others rose up during Obama's presidency and over threw the Gov't. Or, had Clinton got into office, and they did it then. Would you be as supportive?

 

[justjoinedtopost]

What are your talking about? What a completely dumbass comment to make. you want to talk about misconstruing a statement? There you go, you just did it...

We have enough laws on the books, I certainly don't want more bullshit laws. My comment of respecting the office, even if you don't like(respect) the one currently holding is extremely valid. Think of it this way, you still show a manager at work some respect, even if you don't report to them. You still treat them with some level of decency and dignity, and don't go dragging a burning effigy into the office proclaiming you have zero respect for them and they should die for it Nor do you throw bags of feces or urine around because you disagree with a group of managers. You don't put a bandanna on your face and throw Molotov cocktails, turn over their cars in riots, or do property damage. Do you?

That is the kind of respect I'm talking about. Do I show respect to the PoTUS? Yes, because of the office. Even when it was someone I vehemently disagreed with, I did not call them names, make derogatory comments, etc. Am I demanding others do the same? No. But, I am asking for them to do so. Whether they choose to do so or not, is not my call. Even then, while I may disagree with what and how they are saying something, I respect their right to peaceably do so.[/QUOTE]
Kathy Griffin's shock art and the teacher's moment of stupidity were not same as feces/urine throwing, throwing Molotov cocktails, rioting etc...No, I don't do these things. But here is how much respect I have for the office of the presidency at this point...

Fuck the office. Fuck the polite speech. Fuck your desires to see people investigated for not showing respect.




Is it the suggestions of violence that bother you with the Griffing/teacher depictions? If so, that is the height of hypocrisy.

 

[justjoinedtopost]

We have enough laws on the books, I certainly don't want more bullshit laws. My comment of respecting the office, even if you don't like(respect) the one currently holding is extremely valid. Think of it this way, you still show a manager at work some respect, even if you don't report to them. You still treat them with some level of decency and dignity, and don't go dragging a burning effigy into the office proclaiming you have zero respect for them and they should die for it Nor do you throw bags of feces or urine around because you disagree with a group of managers. You don't put a bandanna on your face and throw Molotov cocktails, turn over their cars in riots, or do property damage. Do you?

That is the kind of respect I'm talking about. Do I show respect to the PoTUS? Yes, because of the office. Even when it was someone I vehemently disagreed with, I did not call them names, make derogatory comments, etc. Am I demanding others do the same? No. But, I am asking for them to do so. Whether they choose to do so or not, is not my call. Even then, while I may disagree with what and how they are saying something, I respect their right to peaceably do so.

Kathy Griffin's shock art and the teacher's moment of stupidity were not same as feces/urine throwing, throwing Molotov cocktails, rioting etc...No, I don't do these things. But here is how much respect I have for the office of the presidency at this point...

Fuck the office. Fuck the polite speech. Fuck your desires to see people investigated for not showing respect.




Is it the suggestions of violence that bother you with the Griffing/teacher depictions? If so, that is the height of hypocrisy.

Botched the quoting on that post. Too late to correct.

Why should we respect career politicians in the first please? Especially those whom have been corrupt since long before day 1? Or, only vote "Present" on things?

For the record, I despise both parties. They ar both corrupt and need to go.

This we agree on. Two brands of the exact same product.

 

[Deleted member 37064]

Kathy Griffin's shock art and the teacher's moment of stupidity were not same as feces/urine throwing, throwing Molotov cocktails, rioting etc...No, I don't do these things. But here is how much respect I have for the office of the presidency at this point...

Fuck the office. Fuck the polite speech. Fuck your desires to see people investigated for not showing respect.

This is where I personally differ from others. I recognize freedom of speech, I recognize the right to peaceably assemble, and I firmly believe in the right of the people to hold the Gov't (at all levels) accountable (firm 2A believer). However, I don't agree with pictures such as above, nor do I agree with belittle or mocking positions or people.
I personally believe there are much better ways to show disapproval, voice dissent, etc. without the levels of extremism that people have taken it to. Is it the fault of those whom were elected into office? Yes, but not solely. It is also the fault of the media and those whom would rather pay more attention to pop culture than what their own Gov't is doing to them.

Is it the suggestions of violence that bother you with the Griffing/teacher depictions? If so, that is the height of hypocrisy.

Given what I stated above, how is it "the height of hypocrisy" from me. When it is usually those whom are crying foul about lack of tolerance of the special interest group flavour of the day, bullying of children, police brutality, "death panels", etc. are doing the very same thing such as the teacher, Griffin, and others?

My point in all of this is that we, as a society, have become so polarized by politics and it's media due to their agendas and those "behind the scenes" if you will. We all need to take a step back and see things from a slightly different view.

 

[Deleted member 37064]

Botched the quoting on that post. Too late to correct.

It's all good. I figured it out.

This we agree on. Two brands of the exact same product.

Exactly. No difference between them, only in how they market themselves and to whom. To take it one step farther, and on the same lines, those whom are on the extremes of the political parties/views do the exact same thing. So, it's not just the politicians, it's also the "followers" if you will

 

[eyeteach]

I never said her action was "classy". In fact I said it was bad judgement on her part. It was a dumb thing to do.
The fact that you didn't display any tacky images of Obama does not change the fact that many did (and there's plenty of photographic evidence of it). Many (not necessarily all) of those same people that are so "offended" by Griffin's action are the same people that did display such images.

What you said was that all of those who were/are upset at Griffin are the same people hanging Obama in effigy and that is not true. Again, I found what Griffin did, and her subsequent "apology", totally offensive but I have never hung a likeness of Obama in effigy.

 

[justjoinedtopost]

Given what I stated above, how is it "the height of hypocrisy" from me. When it is usually those whom are crying foul about lack of tolerance of the special interest group flavour of the day, bullying of children, police brutality, "death panels", etc. are doing the very same thing such as the teacher, Griffin, and others?

My point in all of this is that we, as a society, have become so polarized by politics and it's media due to their agendas and those "behind the scenes" if you will. We all need to take a step back and see things from a slightly different view.

Because it is hypocritical. Simple as that.

Look what the office of the presidency has become. I'm not talking about Trump, but Trump all the way back to at least Reagan. But in the case of Trump, a man who openly called for the killing of the families of terrorists, lest we be accused of political correctness? Please.

Or what about his predecessor? How much respect does this warrant?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...27eea8-12ea-11e6-8967-7ac733c56f12_story.html

The one before him, the one who Obama offered a change from? Listen to this man describe the respect he had for Bush2 and his office. I don't believe his statistics are accurate, but I know he speaks the truth when he talks about the hypocrisy.


If we are going to be a blood-thirsty, war mongering nation, then fine. For all I know it may be a matter of necessity at this point. Stooping to the level of asking others to maintain a pretentious illusion of civility though, well that makes me a little queasy. From where I stand, it is the height of hypocrisy.




If the corporations decide their President needs respect, they can send folks like this out to ask Griffin for it. Or, they can get another smooth talker like Obama in the office to pacify people while their agenda moves ahead. I no longer care which, and I don't feel particularly compelled to speak up on their behalf. Let them do their own fucking dirty work.

I agree with you about the polarization that has occurred. I have been on the right and fumed at the left, and vice versa; both sides lie, exaggerate, misrepresent, play the victim, then turn right around and white knight when it suits them.

Unfortunate. Things have gone too far to be undone easily I think. I suspect you and I may agree more than disagree about the sad state of affairs with the media and its how it is used to promote agendas though.

Take heart. At least one media outlet opined that Griffin's photo brought unity...
https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...-beclowns-herself-dave-berg-column/102330054/
So there is that, if you don't have anything else to wipe your butt with at the moment.

 

[dilligaf0]

2) Those the whine that the image is so offensive are reposting the image to raise money for the next election. (Yes, for one the California GOP).

I chose my words poorly.
I hereby amend my statement.
2) Many of those that whine about Kathy Griffins photo being so offensive are reposting that photo to raise money for the next election. One of which is the California GOP.

 

[Deleted member 37064]

I agree with you about the polarization that has occurred. I have been on the right and fumed at the left, and vice versa; both sides lie, exaggerate, misrepresent, play the victim, then turn right around and white knight when it suits them.

Unfortunate. Things have gone too far to be undone easily I think. I suspect you and I may agree more than disagree about the sad state of affairs with the media and its how it is used to promote agendas though.

Overall, I think we agree far more than we disagree. If you knew me more, you would probably understand better where I'm coming from regarding the respect aspect.

 

[n_i_c_u]

I do stupid stuff all the time. I should really just keep my mouth shut and tape my finger digits up so as not to type.

(before I tape my fingers up) I feel bad for Kathy Griffin only because I think whoever was taking those pics talked her in to it. The whole thing is weird because a severed head is more linked to ISIS than anything else these days and her holding a severed Donald Trump head would kind of correlate to her being a jihad extremist. There is just no good spin one can put on it. Honestly, there is no way around that perception from the heartland of America. That was just a horrible photo shoot that anyone disliking Griffin will never ever let go. I've seen her on Seinfeld and heard her on Howard Stern and she always has this bit that she will tell the world what happened when she was hanging with you (which makes celebrities wary about hanging with her because they can become a part of her bit), but, I haven't read anything about that photo shoot from her. I don't know why she is protecting the photographer. I just feel like she got caught up in the moment.

I know she lost some endorsements and gigs (something on CNN and a Squatty Potty gig) but what can one do when her message was so convoluted? What in the hell was she trying to say? She hasn't ever really explained what her meaning was. I get it though, because, even here I go off on stuff and sometimes it doesn't make any sense to no one but me (and the photographer if I had one). I am able to get away with mistakes just because I am not a celebrity and what I type isn't picked up by good morning Americal

Don Imus sucks. I remember when that happened (different apartment) and I remember hearing it and I thought it was just a natural thing to come out of his mouth. Kinda like a Bill Maher, but with less knowledge of why he was saying it (Maher seemed to know he was breaking some boundaries). He just seemed to say it because that is who he is and that is how he would talk to anyone. Not even sure why he his being discussed because he really isn't all that relevant these days. Even Howard Stern and Robin Quivers say he was racist when they worked with him--and that is wild because Howard and Robin are so considered as a bunch of bad things by many.