STDs and Shame

[CharlieCharma]

To begin, I do not think people should be sleeping with people with STDs, even curable ones(until they're treated)under almost any circumstance.

I notice that when it comes to things like HIV, herpes, and HPV, rather than having an "oh shit, that sucks, that's a forever disease, I'm sorry buddy" a lot people will hear that and think "gross, they probably slept around a lot." I had a very close friend in high school who was born with Hep C. A girl was interested in him, he told her to explain why he refrained from sexual activity, and rather than have some sympathy for the poor fellow, she told everyone. He was ridiculed constantly, called gay, etc. Some could say, yeah, well, high school, kids are assholes. The thing is, since becoming an adult I have seen the same behavior again and again. Where, when a person is discovered to have an STD they are ridiculed and seen as gross. I mean, it isn't leprosy or the flu. You aren't going to catch "the aids" by having a drink with someone. It's a bit silly.

So, my question is, STDs, why do you think people who are unlucky or maybe really did just make poor decisions in that regard are shamed rather than treated like any other illness that doesn't go away but isn 't spread through airborne kinds of ways?

I apologize that this post is a bit messy. I was discussing with a friend about how he is shamed in the gay community for having HIV, but he is up front with everyone before any kind of sexual contact. We were discussing how rejection is completely fine and expected, but it's the jokes and insults that are just shameful. This post is trying to get my thoughts out and hear others on a really sensitive topic.

 

[Vera]

Because Western society still has a Judeo-Christian bug up its ass about sex. Even the most progressive secular people can make subconscious judgments just because of those ingrained biases. It's unfortunate but the only thing to do is educate people on safer sex practices. America's fixation on abstinence only education doesn't help either.

I SO wish the general public were as stringent about STD testing as the adult community. Unfortunately because of stigma, laziness, and ignorance STDs go untreated in many cases, especially those with no effects on the carrier. (Cough, HPV, which, you know, causes CANCER.)

 

[CharlieCharma]

(Cough, HPV, which, you know, causes CANCER.)

The new HPV vaccine commercials are fantastic for this reason.

 

[Vera]

I didn't even know those commercials existed--- I don't have cable. But that is fantastic that they do. I remember the initial pearl clutching over Gardasil 10 or so years ago where the side effects were blown out of proportion so I am glad people are being receptive again.

 

[CharlieCharma]

For anyone uninitiated in the commercials, they play on Hulu all the time and pretty much shame lazy/anti-vaxxer parents.

 

[Diana Blake]

Oh yeah, and you get the vaccine and three years later you end up with the cancer causing HPV anyway. Woo!

But, yes, was reading up on a reddit thread the other day where people with STDs and the like talked a bit about how it affects them and others and one striking thing for me were the amount of men saying they had HPV and could never let themselves be with another woman again due to risking their lives. There are 100 strains of HPV, 40 are sexually transmitted. 7 are high risk, the 2 most common forms rarely result in cancer. So rarely that science can't prove that getting cancer while having HPV 6 and 11 is even related. And there are people out there, feeling miserable and alone, that don't understand the words "HPV Positive" at all.

It's like when I overheard a nurse in my ER (years ago but it's still MY ER) telling a patient that they had come back positive for herpes. When asking which the nurse said "Both" which...is an easy and crazy misleading answer. Patient popped positive on a blood test, not a swab of an active breakout. Blood test just says HSV positive, can't tell if it's 1 or 2. A culture from an active breakout is the only way to tell which you actually have. Patient was in hysterics. Two hours later labs for yeast infection comes back with elevated numbers which, after questioning from the doctor, seems to be the actual problem. Patient has never had a genital breakout though they have had cold sores in the past--not since middle school.

Honestly, I think a lot of this comes from abstinence based sex ed. How many of us were shown slides of STDs/STIs at their worst case scenario? There was one pic of HPV we all called "Cauliflower Dick" for years. And we weren't told anything about treatments; just how EASY it is the get STDs if you "give in to hormones." It was also never mentioned how many of these scary pictures we saw were actually 100% curable. For a lot of us, our very first introduction to the very idea of STD/STI boiled down to "if you have sex you will die diseased and alone" and early lssons are a very hard thing to unlearn.

 

[Emberblaze]

Something I find interesting is that you are WAY less likely to get HIV or genital herpes from someone on antivirals than you are to get it from people that don't even know they have it. The viral load can be so low that it becomes almost impossible to catch. So if you're going to catch it it's going to come from people that don't know they have it or aren't on antivirals.

Meanwhile people that have these and are on treatments are treated like they are dirty or gross when you are unlikely to catch anything from them.

We have decent sex ed where I'm from and it's still a major issue.

 

[BiancaBaker]

To begin, I do not think people should be sleeping with people with STDs, even curable ones

What about HSV2? or HSV1? You still think someone who has something like this should not sleep around? Im super curious because this topic is a little triggering for me and this line right here makes me extremely furious that you think people with STD's should not sleep around. People can be safe and careful and have healthy sex lives with certain diseases. This is again super triggery for me but I just want to know why you feel like this?

 

[CharlieCharma]

To begin, I do not think people should be sleeping with people with STDs, even curable ones(until they're treated)under almost any circumstance.

What about HSV2? or HSV1? You still think someone who has something like this should not sleep around? Im super curious because this topic is a little triggering for me and this line right here makes me extremely furious that you think people with STD's should not sleep around. People can be safe and careful and have healthy sex lives with certain diseases. This is again super triggery for me but I just want to know why you feel like this?

For HSV-1 and HSV-2 it depends on the person. If you work in porn or escorting, no, most certainly not. Definitely not if that person isn't getting treated and you aren't wearing condoms. But that, in the end, is a personal decision. I don't think a person shouldn't sleep around. I think they should be honest. "Hey, I get cold sores occasionally" is a pretty smart way to be. I understand HSV-1 is usually only in the mouth but can be spread with going down on somebody. Of course, you can be safe. But you should also be honest. I really should say, because of what I do, I would not sleep with someone with known STDs on any circumstance, but that is a personal decision for each person.

Rejection isn't persecution.

 

[BiancaBaker]

For HSV-1 and HSV-2 it depends on the person. If you work in porn or escorting, no, most certainly not. Definitely not if that person isn't getting treated and you aren't wearing condoms. But that, in the end, is a personal decision. I don't think a person shouldn't sleep around. I think they should be honest. "Hey, I get cold sores occasionally" is a pretty smart way to be. I understand HSV-1 is usually only in the mouth but can be spread with going down on somebody. Of course, you can be safe. But you should also be honest. I really should say, because of what I do, I would not sleep with someone with known STDs on any circumstance, but that is a personal decision for each person.

Rejection isn't persecution.

I am totally stepping out of this thread but please get more educated on STD's because man....My opinions & views are based on actual information and I'm not going to get into a huge argument with someone who is clearly un-educated with STD's (in general not even with just HSV, because HPV is another one I believe is over stigmatized). Being a sex worker I feel like we already are stigmatized and you are clearly stigmatizing STD's.

 

[CharlieCharma]

I am totally stepping out of this thread but please get more educated on STD's because man....My opinions & views are based on actual information and I'm not going to get into a huge argument with someone who is clearly un-educated with STD's (in general not even with just HSV, because HPV is another one I believe is over stigmatized). Being a sex worker I feel like we already are stigmatized and you are clearly stigmatizing STD's.

Uh huh. OK. I like to have sugaring set ups. I am not going to risk those on an std. That's my personal choice. I do not look down on others with an std, but wow. Why even come into this thread if you're so hell bent against discussion with others whose opinions differ from yours? You're not going to change anyone's mind by being condescending.

 

[Zana]

I feel like "people with std's shouldn't have sex" lines up with americas "let's only teach abstinence instead of educating". Because it's saying "don't have sex" instead of "be educated on your disease/infection and educate your partners on it too so everyone can have a safe experience". Just my thoughts.

 

[JickyJuly]

I think people jump to judgement for a couple of reasons. 1. Humans LOVE to feel like they're better than someone without doing anything of value. 2. Judging instead of thinking makes people feel like it couldn't happen to them. Our education leaves a lot to be desired in America. Even just teaching people more about STDs and STIs isn't enough. We need to go all the way back to biology and make sure people understand how the body works, what the names of the parts are etc. People who can't say vulva or penis without turning red are not going to run to the doctor willingly for checkups. To make talking about STDs less shameful, we need to be able to talk about our bodies.

Honestly, I didn't understand what hepatitis c was until I was 24. My husband shared a needle with someone who was HIV positive, and we had to be tested for both HIV and HC. I was sitting there in front of my computer thinking "holy shit! this stuff is just as bad as HIV." However, AIDS is stigmatized more and we hear about it all the time. Fortunately, we were both fine. (Even sharing a needle with someone who is positive only transmits the virus under 5% of the time I guess?)

I don't think it's right to judge someone for having an illness whether it came from their own choices or not. What's the point? Have compassion for other peoples' troubles. I would, however, judge a person who spreads illness without giving the other person a choice (by being less than up front or cheating for example). I also don't believe it is fair to say that someone who chooses not to have sexual relations with an affected person is judging though. Your health is important. You're not bound to risk your body for anyone.

 

[BiancaBaker]

Uh huh. OK. I like to have sugaring set ups. I am not going to risk those on an std. That's my personal choice. I do not look down on others with an std, but wow. Why even come into this thread if you're so hell bent against discussion with others whose opinions differ from yours? You're not going to change anyone's mind by being condescending.

Your opinion can differ but this is a huge trigger like I said and Im not going to go further into why I am very against how you see everything. I don't need to change anyone's mind nor will I try I am just explaining that without proper knowledge I can understand why your views are the way they are. So you have no real life experience living with an STD. You have no idea how it feels like to go your WHOLE life testing negative only to one day have your whole life changed because you were born with something that lays dormant in your body do you? no. Hence why this discussion is ending right here for me.

I responded because Im absolutely disgusted that you believe people with STD's should not sleep around (even if they are being safe and communicating) THAT is why I responded because that statement made me so absolutely furious.

 

[CharlieCharma]

I don't think a person shouldn't sleep around. I think they should be honest. "Hey, I get cold sores occasionally" is a pretty smart way to be. I understand HSV-1 is usually only in the mouth but can be spread with going down on somebody. Of course, you can be safe. But you should also be honest. I really should say, because of what I do, I would not sleep with someone with known STDs on any circumstance, but that is a personal decision for each person.

I feel like "people with std's shouldn't have sex" lines up with americas "let's only teach abstinence instead of educating". Because it's saying "don't have sex" instead of "be educated on your disease/infection and educate your partners on it too so everyone can have a safe experience". Just my thoughts.

I responded because Im absolutely disgusted that you believe people with STD's should not sleep around (even if they are being safe and communicating) THAT is why I responded because that statement made me so absolutely furious.

I didn't say they shouldn't sleep around. I said they should be honest so that way the person they chose to sleep with can choose for themselves whether they want to risk it. I worded it poorly, but I just don't think rejecting someone because they have an STD is a form of persecution or stigmatizing. It's just a personal decision. It sucks if you have an STD. Truly, but some of us have income riding on us not having an STD.

 

[CharlieCharma]

"To begin, I do not think people should be sleeping with people with STDs, even curable ones(until they're treated)under almost any circumstance. "

I put this at the very top because I didn't want anyone thinking that I was advocating for sleeping with someone with an STD if you don't want to be at risk. Worded poorly. If you feel like it's worth the risk with a condom and treatment, do you. If you have an STD I don't think you should lock yourself in a chastity belt, just be up front. If you don't want to fuck someone with an STD, just reject them, but they still deserve respect.

 

[JoleneBrody]

It is estimated that up to 90% of the human population carries HSV-1. 90!
While yes, I think it's good to be open if you have had cold sores in the past, truth is the vast majority of HSV-1 will never have an outbreak. And passing it on without an active outbreak is almost impossible but yay for protected sex!

 

[VeronicaChaos]

It is estimated that up to 90% of the human population carries HSV-1. 90!
While yes, I think it's good to be open if you have had cold sores in the past, truth is the vast majority of HSV-1 will never have an outbreak. And passing it on without an active outbreak is almost impossible but yay for protected sex!

It's also incredibly difficult to get tested for. The tests are super unreliable, so your chances of getting it from someone who gets cold sores but isn't having an outbreak vs. getting it from someone who doesnt is only nominally higher, since they are far more likely to have the virus and not know, and that chance is even lower than average if they're on anti-viral suppressants. It's not as though those who have outbreaks vs. those who don't have a stronger virus; it's completely dependent on the individual's body and it's ability to fight the virus.

 

[Val Vega]

I feel like "people with std's shouldn't have sex" lines up with americas "let's only teach abstinence instead of educating". Because it's saying "don't have sex" instead of "be educated on your disease/infection and educate your partners on it too so everyone can have a safe experience". Just my thoughts.

This! I have a friend that's open about his HIV diagnosis and he still regularly has sex with partners that are educated on his illness.