Russian Cut Off from Payments

[NerdyZoey]

Ok so I am seeing a lot of models saying accounts are being deleted from Russia and the Ukraine. What I have found is that Russia has been cut off from using SWIFT

White House and EU nations announce expulsion of 'selected Russian banks' from SWIFT

The White House, along with the European Commission, France, Germany, Italy, the United Kingdom and Canada, announced Saturday evening that they would expel certain Russian banks from SWIFT, the high-security network that connects thousands of financial institutions around the world, pledging to...

amp.cnn.com

SWIFT block deals crippling blow to Russia; leaves room to tighten

A decision by Western allies on Saturday to block "selected" Russian banks from the SWIFT payments system will inflict a crippling economic blow, but also cause much pain to their own companies and banks. And the allies still have room to do more.

www.reuters.com

EU, UK, Canada, US pledge to remove selected Russian banks from interbank messaging system SWIFT

Exclusion from SWIFT means key banks cannot communicate securely with banks beyond its borders.

www.cnbc.com

What SWIFT is : Society for Worldwide Interbank Financial Telecommunication, SWIFT is a messaging system thst started in the 70s that allows large financial institutions to send money to each other. The Belgian-based cooperative is used 11,000++ banks and financial institutions 200 ++ countries and territories, including Russia. Russia makes up about 3% of its usage as it seems.

America , the European Commission, France, Germany, Italy, the United Kingdom and Canada are all imposing financial restrictive measures against Russia so they cannot operate globally.

As of now it looks like Onlyfans and possibly Streamate are the first to shut off model accounts as they cannot pay them. Last payments aren’t being sent out for the same reason, they have no way of doing so. I have seen nothing stating specifically that this changes things for Ukrainian models but I also have no idea how banking works with them or how/if it is tied to Russian banks

Please post more information if you have it. Know my heart goes out to those models in the Ukraine and in Russia who aren’t supporting this war. I wish there was something companies could do to change individual situations.

 

[CheeseMoon]

I could certainly see them cutting off payments to at least those regions if there's any chance whatsoever that the document could be read that way.

No point speculating, really. From right about now it's technically impossible to transfer money into and out of Russia, even if you wanted to.

 

[AmberCutie]

I haven't heard anything outside of this thread that's specifically to do with SM, but I have seen a thing or two about this executive order: https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing...reignty-and-territorial-integrity-of-ukraine/ (I think I saw it in reference to possible implications for Twitch streamers, although I don't know if Twitch has taken any action--the poster was just speculating that they might).

I can no longer find the post, but the interpretation was that it may now be illegal either to pay anyone or to broadcast streams from Luhansk or Donetsk. Maybe both? I'm not about to try to parse that legalese properly for myself right this moment, but SM has always been ridiculously conservative when it comes to the law. I could certainly see them cutting off payments to at least those regions if there's any chance whatsoever that the document could be read that way.

The article I read this morning referred to both Twitch and OF halting accounts from Russian users, but it didn't go into much detail.

 

[CheeseMoon]

The article I read this morning referred to both Twitch and OF halting accounts from Russian users, but it didn't go into much detail.

LIkely because it's impossible to have any sort of financial dealings with Russian companies and citizens if you're outside Russia now. Short of exchanging cash, you can't take their payments and you can't send them any money.

 

[NerdyZoey]

LIkely because it's impossible to have any sort of financial dealings with Russian companies and citizens if you're outside Russia now. Short of echanging cash, you can't take their payments and you can't send them any money.

This is my understanding. Not every site is shutting accounts down but it seems like they will not be able to send any kind payments to any Russian. I’m not sure about if it’s illegal or just not possible I’m not savvy in the politics and legal speak in that depth.

 

[AmberCutie]

LIkely because it's impossible to have any sort of financial dealings with Russian companies and citizens if you're outside Russia now. Short of echanging cash, you can't take their payments and you can't send them any money.

Yeah that was exactly my take.

Sites completely suspending creator accounts because there's no point in keeping them open for anyone to "earn" on them since they won't be able to actually cash out those earned funds.

But you know people are taking the opportunity to villainize the sites instead of thinking rationally. (i.e. the other thread calling the sites Nazi for doing so.)

 

[CheeseMoon]

But you know people are taking the opportunity to villainize the sites instead of thinking rationally. (i.e. the other thread calling the sites Nazi for doing so.)

Yeah, shooting the messenger was always the more comfortable option

Keeping the Russian model accounts open now would make little sense since the various sites would eventually end up sitting on hundreds of thousands of other people's dollars they can't hand over. Nobody wants that headache, and worst case (depending on jurisdiction, I guess) the authorities will just show up and confiscate the money. The point of all this is of course to make the Russian economy suffer on a macro level. I'm guessing major credit cards have stopped working inside Russia as we speak since it's well into Monday this side of the pond.

Edit: we have no Russian customers where I work, but I've been hearing about other local businesses who can't get outstanding invoices paid by Russian customers. That is now the law of the land. Some alternative method of doing money transfers to/from Russia is probably possible, e.g. via China or other (as of yet) "friendly" nations, but we'll see ...

 

[Smoothie]

In a situation like this (a war that results in far-reaching economic sanctions and restrictions), I’m thinking cam sites aren’t left with much choice or control over the matter.

They can leave accounts open but potentially unable to cash out, or close the accounts preemptively. Both options suck for the models, and it’s very unfortunate.

Even if Russian models could potentially still cash out their earnings (and I don’t know if that is or is not the case), it’s reasonable to think a cam site might choose to close those accounts anyway to avoid even the perception of providing a way for international money to be sent to that country.

 

[Lintilla]

LIkely because it's impossible to have any sort of financial dealings with Russian companies and citizens if you're outside Russia now. Short of exchanging cash, you can't take their payments and you can't send them any money.

Well, you can. Crypto, at the very least, still exists, and many sites already pay out in crypto. A StripChat rep on this forum brought it up the other day in that context. However, if it's made illegal in whichever country a camming site is hosted in, that's a whole other thing.

 

[AmberCutie]

They can leave accounts open but potentially unable to cash out, or close the accounts preemptively. Both options suck for the models, and it’s very unfortunate.

I agree every side of it sucks for the models affected.

But I also know, if 2 weeks from now models couldn't cash out the earnings they made by being online/doing shows/selling content, they'd be even more upset that they aren't getting paid for their work. Better to not let them work, in that case. The lesser of 2 evils I suppose.

 

[NerdyZoey]

Well, you can. Crypto, at the very least, still exists, and many sites already pay out in crypto. A StripChat rep on this forum brought it up the other day in that context. However, if it's made illegal in whichever country a camming site is hosted in, that's a whole other thing.

Yeah it seems like if the payment method is outside the SWIFT system it is acceptable at the moment but it looks like many other options(banks and financial institutions) are choosing to follow even without a direct order to do so yet. It also seems like there are very limited options: like you can pay crypto. I’m not sure how turning crypto into Rubles will work as far as fees and what not or if that will be effected here shortly due to banking stuff. It does look like you can get paid with a few other services in USD but that you couldn’t turn that into Rubles or use it because of the banks … which essentially makes it useless for the time being

I am by now means an expert or even very knowledgeable in legal speak of everything I’m reading, but this is how it seems to me. And explains why so many sites haven’t completely shut out Russian models yet.

 

[SMuser69]

I’m not sure how turning crypto into Rubles will work as far as fees and what not or if that will be effected here shortly due to banking stuff.

You'd need a Russian based exchange. That said 'Anonymous' has been actively attacking and taking them down for the last few days, draining hot wallet active on them to donate to Ukraine red cross.

 

[Highlander884]

I'm sure it will change but all the russian ladies I follow still have active accounts on cb and onlyfans.

 

[rockin_rod]

A friend based in Russia is still working on 6 sites, and just updated her OF an hour ago. She told me earlier today that several regulars (USA and Europe) have asked to send her 'gifts' via PP, in case she can't cash out through the sites.
Said she's still able to transfer funds from PP to her Russian bank....... so IDK what is going on, maybe it is just taking time for financial movements to dry up.

 

[diabellaqueen]

It's look like SWIFT will be/is disabled to the government accounts and some banks. Friend of mine told me, that she still can receive payments by many payment methods, even convert USD to RUB. I am following this subject lately and by the information I have only affected are 10-15% of population.
Also, it seems like crypto is banned in Russia, or it is very hard to exchange.

 

[Smoothie]

It's look like SWIFT will be/is disabled to the government accounts and some banks. Friend of mine told me, that she still can receive payments by many payment methods, even convert USD to RUB. I am following this subject lately and by the information I have only affected are 10-15% of population.
Also, it seems like crypto is banned in Russia, or it is very hard to exchange.

That’s interesting. I’m glad to see at least some of the models are able to get paid at the present time.

I keep seeing conflicting information about crypto being an option for them. Maybe it’s just an ease of use issue, as opposed to it being unavailable.

 

[diabellaqueen]

Can't confirm any info about crypto there, it is 50/50 banned or not, acceptable or prohibited. Also, rumors acquire about closing Russia from getting payments from the rest of the world. Oh, it's a hard time for both Ukraine and Russia. God help the people.

 

[Smoothie]

If models from that region have a way to cash out quickly and often, hopefully they do it without waiting.

Things seem to be changing by the hour with this conflict. Something that’s possible right now could become impossible very fast.

 

[CheeseMoon]

Things seem to be changing by the hour with this conflict. Something that’s possible right now could become impossible very fast.

Indeed. Some of the stuff that was holy writ last night with regard to money transfers now isn't so set in stone. In this interconnected and deregulated world there is probably always another option, and as time goes bby, probably at a premium. But interesting that PP is operating as normal wrt Russia right now ...

 

[Derek_Zoolander]

Based on the fact there are still so many Russian models online, I don’t think getting paid is a problem. I really don’t think they would all continue working for free.

 

[SMuser69]

Based on the fact there are still so many Russian models online, I don’t think getting paid is a problem. I really don’t think they would all continue working for free.

Well for SM at least, your flag is based on your Passport not your location. So a model registered with a Russian passport could be in England, France or Spain but still be limited to displaying Russian or flags from other Baltic regions. The sanctions are against Russia not the average Russian. If you live somewhere else then little has changed for you.

I know a Model in Spain with a Latvia flag and an Estonia model with a British flag because she has duel citizenship.

I don't know what other sites do for flagging. But I would wager if you see a Russian flag on the model at this point they are probably either not in Russia, their studio is paying them through some jank method or they receive their money to a foreign account they may/may not have access to currently.

 

[AudriTwo]

Well for SM at least, your flag is based on your Passport not your location. So a model registered with a Russian passport could be in England, France or Spain but still be limited to displaying Russian or flags from other Baltic regions. The sanctions are against Russia not the average Russian. If you live somewhere else then little has changed for you.

I know a Model in Spain with a Latvia flag and an Estonia model with a British flag because she has duel citizenship.

I don't know what other sites do for flagging. But I would wager if you see a Russian flag on the model at this point they are probably either not in Russia, their studio is paying them through some jank method or they receive their money to a foreign account they may/may not have access to currently.

pretty sure most camsites/3rdparty require proof of address for payments. they know where we models live since they have copies of our utility bills. if they are russian living out of the country and not banking with russia, they should be good.

 

[CheeseMoon]

Based on the fact there are still so many Russian models online, I don’t think getting paid is a problem. I really don’t think they would all continue working for free.

Never underestimate people's tendency to inertia and thinking it will all work out.

 

[rockin_rod]

Never underestimate people's tendency to inertia and thinking it will all work out.

Well, with so much uncertainty, the only certainty would be zero income if they just stop working.
So I understand why they would carry on, better to have hope of getting paid than assume there is none.

 

[CheeseMoon]

PayPal have shut down their services in Russia:

PayPal shuts down its services in Russia citing Ukraine aggression

Payments company PayPal Holdings Inc shut down its services early on Saturday in Russia, citing "the current circumstances," joining many financial and tech companies in suspending operations there after the invasion of Ukraine.

www.reuters.com

 

[Lelo1]

I wonder if CB will shutdown all payments methods for Russian models.

Like if models get completely cut off, they might opt for bitcoins, and one to one video conferencing. Or self hosted websites, bitcoin, and self broadcasting.

 

[CheeseMoon]

I wonder if CB will shutdown all payments methods for Russian models.

Even if they decide not to, the payment processors, credit card companies and the international banking system will eventually force their hand. There will always be half shady, back alley orgs that are able to transfer money into and out of Russia, but I don't know if CB (and other sites) will be desperate enough to use them. It's not just about money anymore.

Like if models get completely cut off, they might opt for bitcoins, and one to one video conferencing. Or self hosted websites, bitcoin, and self broadcasting.

Next on the list of Russia embargoes is disconnecting them from the rest of the world internet wise. Cogent, one of the world's largest companies in terms of backbone connectivity, have already cut them off.

We can all bitch and moan about not being able to pay to see our favourite pair of Russian tits, but cam sites are just one of many, many industries being collateral damage in the ever tightening sanctions. That's basically the point of the sanctions anyway.

 

[LydiaFrost]

Russia has now blocked access to Facebook and Twitter, strict internet censorship might become another thing they will struggle with, if the situation keeps getting worse, like it does right now..
Not sure how many russian models already use a vpn, but without that it might get really hard to even access anything.

Other stuff might be availability of tech stuff, like webcams etc, if the sanctions keep getting worse. Intel already stopped their products being available on the russian market etc and so did some others.
It's just a shit situation for them, but seems to be the only way right now.

 

[Lelo1]

Next on the list of Russia embargoes is disconnecting them from the rest of the world internet wise. Cogent, one of the world's largest companies in terms of backbone connectivity, have already cut them off.

Yah, but there will probable be illegal popup internet. Radio, Line of site, secret cables, mesh, satalight.
Same thing happened in the iraq war.

 

[CheeseMoon]

Yah, but there will probable be illegal popup internet. Radio, Line of site, secret cables, mesh, satalight.

There will always be a way to circumvent embargoes and domestic laws, and a country like Russia is nigh on impossible to isolate 100%. But even if individual models and studios technically could connect to cam sites outside Russia and stream over alternative "black market" connections, it would for many of them be either pointless because of financial embargoes, too expensive with ever more worthless roubles or too illegal (for lack of a better word). And that's not even considering the available bandwidth on whatever is left of their internet backbone or whether the relevant cam sites will serve them at all.