Quality post. I need to correct myself and say that it was Tyler the Creator and not Chance that I was referencing.
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Pornstar August Ames commits suicide after bullying for refusing to have sex w/ man who did gay porn
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Quality post. I need to correct myself and say that it was Tyler the Creator and not Chance that I was referencing.
That's a really good point. I've been internet since literally the beginning of the technology, but still think of IRL and online social life as being distinct. It clearly isn't for most young people. So ya maybe unplugging for a few days isn't a real option. But doesn't that also mean that a 23-year-old with 600K follower should know that posting about her decision would generate some hate?
Reading responses to her tweets, my reaction was pretty much the same as Amber. Maybe some of the worse tweets were deleted but I only saw a handful of the vile, take a pill and die ones.
For me, I'm going to blame this suicide on her tragically untreated mental illness, rather than social media. But of course, none of us truly know what happened.
The now since deleted posts are the most relevant in this issue(IMHO).
We have an internet where people can say or do things that would get them openly ostracized in real life, yet the "delete" option is revered by almost everyone. We don't have the luxury of this in real life, and if something hurtful is said in real life, there are numerous hoops one has to jump through in order to either apologize, or clarify ones remarks. Ms. Ames could have easily deleted her original tweet, but she chose to stay her course as a "known entity" and attempted to clarify her remark(s) amongst a sea of anonymity.
The issue here is not one of bakers or masseurs, but one of Peer Review. What if she had come here, to this, or any sex performer forum, and posted an open letter detailing her reservations about performing with this man, would there have been a dog-pile mentality as there was with her twitter posts? I'd really like to think that the discourse in such a thread would have been much more civil and understanding of her concerns, even though a majority of us are still anonymous. I have no doubt that she was seeking positive feedback in voicing her concerns about how she felt. I just do not think Twitter was the proper avenue for seeking out a proper base to provide solid peer review of her situation. The signal to noise ratio of such a medium is just so out of whack with what -should- happen during normal conversation and discourse, and it's sad to see people seeking some form of validation in such a landscape.
We have an internet where people can say or do things that would get them openly ostracized in real life, yet the "delete" option is revered by almost everyone. We don't have the luxury of this in real life, and if something hurtful is said in real life, there are numerous hoops one has to jump through in order to either apologize, or clarify ones remarks. Ms. Ames could have easily deleted her original tweet, but she chose to stay her course as a "known entity" and attempted to clarify her remark(s) amongst a sea of anonymity.
The issue here is not one of bakers or masseurs, but one of Peer Review. What if she had come here, to this, or any sex performer forum, and posted an open letter detailing her reservations about performing with this man, would there have been a dog-pile mentality as there was with her twitter posts? I'd really like to think that the discourse in such a thread would have been much more civil and understanding of her concerns, even though a majority of us are still anonymous. I have no doubt that she was seeking positive feedback in voicing her concerns about how she felt. I just do not think Twitter was the proper avenue for seeking out a proper base to provide solid peer review of her situation. The signal to noise ratio of such a medium is just so out of whack with what -should- happen during normal conversation and discourse, and it's sad to see people seeking some form of validation in such a landscape.
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I know I've been blowing up this thread. I'm in a depressive funk myself and this girl's death is just kind of hovering in the back of my mind. But, I had a thought. Lucid is right about here vs Twitter, IMO. Here, we enjoy picking apart ideas and disagreeing. On Twitter, people enjoy piling on with the winning side. Ultimately though, a mob cannot police bias because once you're a large group, you're going to be biased by what is socially acceptable.
Had August written that she'd seen a performer using IV drugs and would not work with him, would she have been ganged up on? Likely not. The stigma that comes with IV drug use scares most people. The picture that you come up with when someone talks about IV drugs use is not pretty. The thought of addicts standing around sharing a needle doesn't make you want to stand behind them. Right? If she were scared of something most people accept as scary, no bullying. Still, according to the CDC, if you're going to choose between sharing a needle with someone who is HIV positive or being anally penetrated by them, guess which one is almost twice as safe? The needle.
Either way, I would be on the side of consent on this one. To me, her reasons don't matter. But, it's good to remember that morality policing is not always rooted in facts but in feelings and socially accepted behaviors.
Had August written that she'd seen a performer using IV drugs and would not work with him, would she have been ganged up on? Likely not. The stigma that comes with IV drug use scares most people. The picture that you come up with when someone talks about IV drugs use is not pretty. The thought of addicts standing around sharing a needle doesn't make you want to stand behind them. Right? If she were scared of something most people accept as scary, no bullying. Still, according to the CDC, if you're going to choose between sharing a needle with someone who is HIV positive or being anally penetrated by them, guess which one is almost twice as safe? The needle.
Either way, I would be on the side of consent on this one. To me, her reasons don't matter. But, it's good to remember that morality policing is not always rooted in facts but in feelings and socially accepted behaviors.
- Feb 23, 2015
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When did 'cyberbullying' start popping up? About 10 years ago? Seems it was all about the children then (at least going off a memory that seems to be less reliable by the day).
Threats of physical violence, doxxing/blackmail, long term harassment/stalking, etc. are one thing. But has society become so infantilized that we need to be protected from harmful tweets? I read the cyanide comment, and as a stand-alone comment it was nothing an adult shouldn't be able to cope with.
I think it was bullshit for people to accuse her of homophobia, same as I feel about the retort of misogyny. I think she was in the right, and I wish mentally she had been in a place where she could stuck around and stood her ground.
I think her death was tragic. I also think all the handwringing about how 'cyberbullying' caused it is idiotic (not talking so much about calls to reflection on this forum, referring more to the years of propaganda surrounding cyberbullying).
There was a polite word of disapproval from a guy I had a lot of respect for years ago, and it sent me into couple of days of depression, in a way that 1000 suggestions that I bump myself off never could have. I also went through months of malicious torment from a psycho, it pushed me to the point where I was suicidal/homicidal, and every step of the way they played by the rules of the system and stayed within the confines of accepted speech.
http://upnorthlive.com/news/local/new-legislation-aims-to-criminalize-cyberbullying
So how much protection do we need here?
Threats of physical violence, doxxing/blackmail, long term harassment/stalking, etc. are one thing. But has society become so infantilized that we need to be protected from harmful tweets? I read the cyanide comment, and as a stand-alone comment it was nothing an adult shouldn't be able to cope with.
I think it was bullshit for people to accuse her of homophobia, same as I feel about the retort of misogyny. I think she was in the right, and I wish mentally she had been in a place where she could stuck around and stood her ground.
I think her death was tragic. I also think all the handwringing about how 'cyberbullying' caused it is idiotic (not talking so much about calls to reflection on this forum, referring more to the years of propaganda surrounding cyberbullying).
There was a polite word of disapproval from a guy I had a lot of respect for years ago, and it sent me into couple of days of depression, in a way that 1000 suggestions that I bump myself off never could have. I also went through months of malicious torment from a psycho, it pushed me to the point where I was suicidal/homicidal, and every step of the way they played by the rules of the system and stayed within the confines of accepted speech.
http://upnorthlive.com/news/local/new-legislation-aims-to-criminalize-cyberbullying
So how much protection do we need here?
This guy tho
He has almost no idea what the situation was/is and yet, is speaking so passionately about it. This is most of the human population.
He has almost no idea what the situation was/is and yet, is speaking so passionately about it. This is most of the human population.
Sounds about right. Had only come to my attention about 5 years ago with this tweet.
I can't argue with what your overall message seems to be. I also can't claim to know what it is like to grow up with the internet being such a huge part in many peoples life. All I know is that things have changed and it makes me feel much older than I am. I mean shit, die in a fire and kill yourself were common insults back then. Calling people faggots was part of internet culture and often a term of endearment. I've ranted here before about how soft younger generations seem to be so you are mostly preaching to the choir with me. Just seems like something I won't be able to fully comprehend and don't want to be an old man stuck in his ways. The times they are a changin my friend.
No. Twitter definitely sucks. Here's a person with RIP AUGUST AMES as their freaking name telling a woman she is fat a few minutes ago.
All I did was search August's name and this was the second tweet that came up. Posts like this and the video I posted earlier are the norm on Twitter. It should be obvious that social media does very little to help those with depression or severe anxiety. It's nearly impossible to be active online and not be severely judged multiple times a day by strangers and fed a constant stream of incorrect information. The human brain was/is not prepared for this and so many young people are not able to adapt and keep their life partially offline to save themselves. Deleting Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, etc is one of the best things I ever did for my sense of self-worth. If I could go without earning a living, I would delete my Snapchat and probably stop broadcasting my Webcam too. For every kind person who builds you up and supports you online, there are ten people waiting to comment on your flaws and challenge your lifestyle choices. I think if we can all learn from what we just saw unfold around August Ames, it's a lesson in being able to put the internet away when it's not serving you. For the sake of self-preservation, do not put yourself on any mainstream social sites if you care what people say about you.
All I did was search August's name and this was the second tweet that came up. Posts like this and the video I posted earlier are the norm on Twitter. It should be obvious that social media does very little to help those with depression or severe anxiety. It's nearly impossible to be active online and not be severely judged multiple times a day by strangers and fed a constant stream of incorrect information. The human brain was/is not prepared for this and so many young people are not able to adapt and keep their life partially offline to save themselves. Deleting Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, etc is one of the best things I ever did for my sense of self-worth. If I could go without earning a living, I would delete my Snapchat and probably stop broadcasting my Webcam too. For every kind person who builds you up and supports you online, there are ten people waiting to comment on your flaws and challenge your lifestyle choices. I think if we can all learn from what we just saw unfold around August Ames, it's a lesson in being able to put the internet away when it's not serving you. For the sake of self-preservation, do not put yourself on any mainstream social sites if you care what people say about you.
The amount of friends I've seen quarreling with friends in Xbiz in the last week about this was intense. It's tragic and sad, and I agree that I work with Twitter and Facebook for a living (social media is my job after all), but I don't believe it should be the go to for advice.
I agree with @JickyJuly that society often uses morality as a justification for aggression that stems from deeper and darker places. That being said, I'd like us to remember that a tragedy took place, and to take a deep breath before lashing at each other, especially here, because unlike Facebook or Twitter, we are a tolerant safe haven, at least I like to believe that.
I agree with @JickyJuly that society often uses morality as a justification for aggression that stems from deeper and darker places. That being said, I'd like us to remember that a tragedy took place, and to take a deep breath before lashing at each other, especially here, because unlike Facebook or Twitter, we are a tolerant safe haven, at least I like to believe that.
Parents were probable just the first people to start talking about it on a large scale as a parenting issue. How to prevent being on the giving or reeving end of cyber bulling. How to deal with it when you are.
Right now there are several generations of people who are using the internet. And no one talked to them about responsible use.
- Feb 23, 2015
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I would have thought so too, but it doesn't look like it.
https://www.isafe.org/outreach/media/media_cyber_bullying
http://abcnews.go.com/Primetime/story?id=2425023
Educators and media. Or the Indoctrinators and the Ministry of Truth, if you prefer.
The 2004 study certainly seemed to be ahead of the curve in (*cough) "addressing" this issue. Raising kids in the early 2000s, pretty much the only concern was keeping them from hunting down porn when they weren't being watched, at least from what I remember. Yet iSafe was already pointing out "58% of kids admit someone has said mean or hurtful things to them online. More than 4 out of 10 say it has happened more than once." And now here we are, dead bodies piling up all around us...
Oh, who will save us???
Idk man. Sounds a little too sane.
On the other hand, the internet can be a most helpful tool in battling bullies. I despise bullies!!!
https://ca.news.yahoo.com/bullied-b...al-video-stirs-massive-support-174913896.html
https://ca.news.yahoo.com/bullied-b...al-video-stirs-massive-support-174913896.html
Very sad story, but a lot of us in this industry have deep seated issues (NOT all, but many) and I think saying she "killed herself over bullying" is short sighted.
My guess is the bullying was the straw that broke the camel's back and it was just one more thing on top of many things that led her to do what she did.
It's sad, regardless, but her comments were mildly homophobic. She could have just said she didn't want to have sex with him, she wasn't going to have sex with him, period. But she brought the fact he did gay porn into it, revealing irrelevant biases.
A woman doesn't need a reason not to have sex with someone other than "I don't want to."
My guess is the bullying was the straw that broke the camel's back and it was just one more thing on top of many things that led her to do what she did.
It's sad, regardless, but her comments were mildly homophobic. She could have just said she didn't want to have sex with him, she wasn't going to have sex with him, period. But she brought the fact he did gay porn into it, revealing irrelevant biases.
A woman doesn't need a reason not to have sex with someone other than "I don't want to."
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