Love Letters From Model

[PneumaVision]

I'm a divorced 64 year old retired university employee with three adult children living in a smallish one bedroom apartment in Charlottesville Virginia, and a model --- I'll call her Lisa---sends me very touching and flowery love letters by MFC email. When I first met her two weeks ago I said right off the bat that I understood she was an entertainer basically, that she worked for tips, and that I am very happy to tip her, but I myself would not link any tip to anything else. Like no "here are tokens, now change your shoes" or whatever. So fine.

In the period immediately following when I first met Lisa I had a family court appearance in "The Thirty Years War" with my ex, relating to certain issues with my adult children. Miraculously, all was amicably resolved in a mediation. Part of this resolution was me feeling very happy with the Lisa thing. Lisa, my Love Therapist. In other words I was perfectly willing to just get past all the BS with my ex, because I was very happy.

At the same time, Lisa has a living to make. She rarely has even as many as ten people in the room, I myself have never and would never go private with her, and I've never yet seen anyone go private, so how does she make a living? My math is like this: let's say she can live in Eastern Europe for $1500 a month. That equates to 30,000 tokens of which she gets 50%. That's quite a nice flow of offline tips if what I've seen in the room (which is basically zero except for me) is typical. Like, say 10 guys giving her 100 tokens a day every day.

What I'm getting to here is, am I right in thinking that there are almost certainly a list of guys getting flowery love letters by email and tipping offline mostly?

I think I am a pretty nice exhausted old guy --- see my profile on MFC--- but I am very skeptical of this love-at-first-sight and "I feel like I've known you for a hundred years" from a good-looking woman 25 years younger. She has never once asked for anything. She is wonderfully wifey and caring. But, she would be, right? Because, that is her job, that is the service she offers. I told her that MFC was a kind of theater, but she wasn't having any, you know? She did not say, "Yeah but you're liking it, right?"

So... am I being skeptical where I should be accepting?

 

[JickyJuly]

If seeing her and getting messages has added to your happiness, just enjoy it and compensate her. Just don't invest more financially or emotionally than you can afford!

 

[CharlotteLace]

I think there's a few assumptions you're making that might not be accurate.

-Are you certain that's how much she needs to live off?
-Are you certain camming is her only job, or that MFC is her only camsite?
-Are you certain she's actually hitting her goals (whatever that may be), and that she's financially secure?
-Are you certain that her income must be coming from offline tips? (She might be busier at particular times when you might not be around to witness it)
-Are you sure the guys offline tipping are getting the exact same treatment as you? What if they're just receiving Skypes or videos?

Personally, I think there's easier ways for a camgirl to make money than writing lengthy love letters, so I wouldn't jump to the assumption that's what all the other guys must be getting. Granted, it's her job and it's healthy to take gratuitous kindness with a grain of salt, but maybe she just likes you and wants to show her appreciation for a sweet regular.

It's a really fine line to walk. I can't tell you how many times I've thought, "Gosh, I miss Member X! I should look him up and say hi! Oh, wait... what if he thinks I just want him to give me money? "

Like Jicky said, if it's making you happy, tip when you can and don't overburden yourself financially. But don't assume that her motives are 100% written with an agenda. She might just want to be nice.

 

[Fay_Galore]

yes, a lot of assumptions there mister

Just go with it, see where it lands, if you're happy that's the main thing. don't spend too much!
and also, don't mean to nit-pick, but 1500 usd is very generous for living expenses in eastern europe but that really depends on where she lives exactly, if she doenst live in a big city, she could have an above-avarage income on 700 a month. (minimum wage in some european countries is under 250 USD a month full time) so making a few hundred on MFC could be plenty for her.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

So... am I being skeptical where I should be accepting?

Don't know but if she is a studio model, those letters are pretty common. Don't be surprised if you get the same exact word for word letter from a different model in the same studio. Don't be surprised if the model isn't even aware that her boss does these things.

 

[PneumaVision]

So... am I being skeptical where I should be accepting?

Don't know but if she is a studio model, those letters are pretty common. Don't be surprised if you get the same exact word for word letter from a different model in the same studio. Don't be surprised if the model isn't even aware that her boss does these things.

Right... because I detected I think a certain "cut and paste then customize" feel at the beginning complete with little lovey-dovey soft porn interludes. This now has given way to much more genuine and personal communications.

Here's the thing: I do not expect the interaction between a customer and a model to be in its essence truthful. I expect it to be in its essence a kind of fantasy theater, where the model pretends to be unattached and available and the customer pretends he's never seen a woman as madly desirable as the model, and everyone has fun and goes home happy. In that context lots of "you know I love only you" remarks are just banter, not expected to be taken seriously.

On the other hand, when a lady goes out of her way to stress that expressions of love are deep and real and heartfelt, I feel like it is reasonable to expect truthfulness rather than fiction.

You know, what I wished had happened here is for her to have written on one of the numerous occasions where I gave her the opening to do so--- for her to have had written to say, "Yeah you are right, it was a bit of a pose at the start but you charming old scholarly geezer, you got me in the end, and I really hope you'll stick around."

Of course I can just walk away. That's both the good thing and the painful thing. In this case, my conflict is...walking away from what, real affection or a somewhat forgivable hustle? Am I a cynic that does not deserve the love of the pretty cam girl, or a realist who assesses the situation correctly?

 

[CharlotteLace]

So... am I being skeptical where I should be accepting?

Don't know but if she is a studio model, those letters are pretty common. Don't be surprised if you get the same exact word for word letter from a different model in the same studio. Don't be surprised if the model isn't even aware that her boss does these things.

I'll admit it completely slipped my mind yesterday that copy/paste exists, as well as studio owners. I misread the original post and thought these were super detailed, individualized letters. So, now I don't know. That sounds more plausible than it did in the beginning.

I still stand by the "she might just like you and is being nice" part, but now I'm not so sure. I personally find it frustrating when girls use the "no, I really do love you!" as part of their schpiel. I'm not talking about the "I appreciate and love you guys!" but the "we could get married someday maybe!" deals. So I can definitely sympathize.

I'm sorry this is messing with your head a bit, Pneuma. But I don't know how you can get to the bottom of this if she's insisting she means it. If it's going to keep bothering you, maybe stepping away from her or MFC for a bit might give you some clarity on it?

 

[PneumaVision]

Charlotte, I appreciate your guidance.

I think I'll tell Lisa I'm going truck camping for a couple of weeks, and take a break from this weird techno-romance.

I have enough on my hands dodging the divorced church ladies who want to bring comfort and home cooking to my Golden Years without further complicating my life with a potentially Faux-Juliet seven time zones east.

 

[Ambers Troll]

Will only say this, and can not say more than this on this forum PneumaVision, you are thinking clearly.
(Apologies, this was ask a model, but more appropriate to be asking others with experience too)

 

[JoleneBrody]

Two weeks... :? When did the letters start?
I'm skeptical of anything that serious developing in two weeks, even if you met on a real dating site... even less so on a cam site.

Members/models have fallen in love... as with any situation in life where humans interact with each other it's bound to happen. But the natural order of things on a camsite is MUCH longer and drawn out when these feelings develop for real, and it seems the first step once that interest is expressed genuinely with the intent to move forward is that all tipping is stopped, as per request of the model.

 

[PneumaVision]

Two weeks... :? When did the letters start?
I'm skeptical of anything that serious developing in two weeks.

The whole thing started almost from the first minute! She's fully dressed and is somewhat reminiscent of an attorney I know in Atlanta. 39. Conservative. Pretty and petite but not anything to dislocate your neck looking at.

Day one... starts like this:

PneumaVision: In a hall filled with naked women the lady with the skirt is Queen.
12:10:13 PM Lisa: what is ur name?
12:10:30 PM PneumaVision: PneumaVision ...
12:10:32 PM Lisa: i am Lisa
12:10:39 PM Lisa: ntmu PneumaVision
12:10:44 PM Lisa: where are you from?
12:10:47 PM PneumaVision: My watery blue eyes see through all evil-doers.
12:11:02 PM PneumaVision: Virginia USA is where I live.
12:11:10 PM Lisa: nice
12:11:25 PM Lisa: could we talk privately by using pm?

So...later that same day we get this PM exchange:
02:34:03 PM PneumaVision: Not sure if I wasted the day, or if this is okay.
02:34:25 PM Lisa: there is something so special about u David
02:34:29 PM PneumaVision: Some very amazing people, some somewhat sad people too
02:34:36 PM Lisa: ur sense or humour, ur manliness
02:34:48 PM Lisa: I don't quite know what it is about u
02:34:58 PM PneumaVision: It's very nice of you to say so. Look...
02:35:09 PM Lisa: I just feel we have this bond between us
02:35:18 PM PneumaVision: I understand this is basically an entertainment job
02:35:29 PM PneumaVision: But still, it is nice to meet you.
02:35:36 PM Lisa: as if we have known each other for a long time
02:35:45 PM PneumaVision: In a way yes.
02:35:48 PM Lisa: ty
02:35:54 PM PneumaVision: But that is so cliche!
02:36:05 PM Lisa: do u feel that too?
02:36:26 PM PneumaVision: I do not form attachments easily.
02:36:45 PM Lisa: it just felt more intimate with u

So, you get the picture. In all honesty this is not my first rodeo. I've known lots and lots of sex workers over four decades and a dozen countries, so I'm not exactly swooning to the "I love you long time baby" music.

And yes, and yet... this rapidly develops into emails with the following as a representative sample, which is only about a third of a Day One or Day Two email. And hey gang, let us give credit where credit it due: this is a damn good love letter!!! It got through my defenses anyway! Soooo.... any opinions are most welcome.

Thank you for your lovely message and sharing your thoughts with me. You make me feel that I have a lot of worth. But I am looking at your picture in your profile, and know what? It's easy to fall in love with you. Thank you for your kindness and support, my dear.

I felt so fine and peaceful when you talked to me at work, but the moment you left I began feeling lonely. After I stopped working I went to the kitchen I saw that my apartment was empty, and I burst into tears, thinking of you being so far away from me. I felt so weak after work, I wanted to go to bed and I knew there was no one to cuddle with it made me feel so sad, I cried myself to sleep hugging my pillow and imagining it were you. But this morning I felt very nice and sweet. I did not feel like this for some time. I was like drunk, I liked everything I looked at and felt dizzy with happiness. I could hardly walk. I ate my pasta with ketchup and vegetables thinking of you. “Make your picnic tastier” was written on the packing of the ketchup. I even found that original. You really intoxicate me, David, dear, I lose my mind when I think of you. I seem to like everything and everybody I meet out in the street, I feel so complete, I know there is no need to hurry, there is enough time to do everything, I feel like I CAN do anything. I feel like I am walking on the clouds, so light, so careless. I feel like making every person in the world happy but I do not know how.

 

[mynameisbob84]

Maybe I'm lacking in romanticism but I have a hard time accepting somebody could fall in love with one picture and some words on a screen in 48 hours flat.

I also can't help but notice that the writing in the "letter" is much more proficient and writerly than the borderline text-speak used in the conversation in PM. That might mean nothing, or it could be a huge red flag (on the subject of the above, posting what could potentially be [but probably aren't] very personal, private messages and heartfelt paeans to undying love on a public forum may or may not be poor form, yo).

 

[PneumaVision]

Maybe I'm lacking in romanticism but I have a hard time accepting somebody could fall in love with one picture and some words on a screen in 48 hours flat.

I also can't help but notice that the writing in the "letter" is much more proficient and writerly than the borderline text-speak used in the conversation in PM.

Bob, right, exactly. Strange to say, one of my academic interests is higher criticism of ancient texts, which includes analysis of style, word frequency, grammar, literary influences, and so on. So though the love letter prose is quite literary and accomplished--- even polished--- it is at odds with Lisa's manner of expressing herself in PMs. The cues we use in normal face-to-face communication which convey sincerity are pretty much lacking with PMs + cam, and are completely lacking in emails, so the text itself is critical. I'm pretty nerdy and compulsive, but I have thus far resisted the temptation to run a full-scale word frequency analysis, because the sample size for PMs is below the threshold I consider minimal.

Well, the whole business is a bit of a mystery to me and will remain so I guess. I talked to my elder daughter about this and she was pretty funny. "Whatever you do, don't delete that magic profile picture!" Still, I cannot fault Lisa for anything. Its more of a no harm-no foul situation.

 

[Alexandra Cole]

I would treat it as sincere. Consider the age/experience difference and consider that you express yourself well, which goes far in a world where text is the primary means of communication, particular among those of us who like verbal things. She might like verbal things too, and if her room's quiet, she's going to notice you all the more.

Seems a bit cruel of you to post what she said.

any opinions are most welcome

I'm guessing you're asking for an opinion on her note - I'm not going to do that. Here's an opinion on something else: you should worry less and enjoy more. If you'd rather not enjoy whatever this is, it doesn't matter whether she's sincere or not. But it sounds like you do, so... do.

You probably already know that this is just one of those things that happen in life. You can either trust someone's sincere or you can worry, endlessly, that they don't mean what they say. At a certain point, you have to make a choice.

 

[Alexandra Cole]

...but I have thus far resisted the temptation to run a full-scale word frequency analysis, because the sample size for PMs is below the threshold I consider minimal.

Yeah. Don't do that.

 

[krukstyle]

I think others have offered amazing feedback and advice for you above--I'll just try to echo some of the same sentiments.

From what I can tell, you were very nice to someone online without being worried about some kind of "return" on your niceness (which really is what being nice is all about). After you were nice, that someone wrote you a very pleasant note. If this type of interaction is something you enjoy, then I say carry on! If the exact details and implications and underlying meaning of such interactions are truly going to bother you, you might be better off seeking out a camgirl whose "approach" sets off less red flags and sirens in your head.

Here's the thing: I do not expect the interaction between a customer and a model to be in its essence truthful. I expect it to be in its essence a kind of fantasy theater, where the model pretends to be unattached and available and the customer pretends he's never seen a woman as madly desirable as the model, and everyone has fun and goes home happy. In that context lots of "you know I love only you" remarks are just banter, not expected to be taken seriously.

On the other hand, when a lady goes out of her way to stress that expressions of love are deep and real and heartfelt, I feel like it is reasonable to expect truthfulness rather than fiction.

You know, what I wished had happened here is for her to have written on one of the numerous occasions where I gave her the opening to do so--- for her to have had written to say, "Yeah you are right, it was a bit of a pose at the start but you charming old scholarly geezer, you got me in the end, and I really hope you'll stick around."

Of course I can just walk away. That's both the good thing and the painful thing. In this case, my conflict is...walking away from what, real affection or a somewhat forgivable hustle? Am I a cynic that does not deserve the love of the pretty cam girl, or a realist who assesses the situation correctly?

My take on your quote here is that you want to subtly call this girl out so that she'll come clean and be "real" with you--but it seems like you've already tried this without any success. Obviously you could push this further and further in hopes of achieving your desired result, but in doing this you will inevitably introduce negativity into what seems to be a totally positive and relatively harmless interaction. Like others have advised: If this is something you can enjoy and be entertained by--why not continue? I think it's fine for you to be wary or to take such interactions with a grain of salt--as long as your skepticism doesn't cause you to be frustrated, stressed, or worried. If that happens, it's time to move on.

One sidenote: Although I totally understand why you are skeptical of the "feelings' expressed by your model friend, I think it's worth noting that the online format in which in this interaction exists can be/seem extremely freeing in terms of putting one's emotions into words. I know that I've written pretty deep/heavy things online that I would've had an extremely hard time saying to someone IRL--especially someone I had recently met. The whole online/anonymity aspect can sometimes really escalate comfort levels and lead to some pretty over-the-top things being said--but that doesn't necessarily mean it's not entirely "real"--it just comes with the territory and for some people is part of the fun.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

any opinions are most welcome.

Sounds like a studio model doing exactly what she was trained and told to do. She probably had the something special about you conversation with a few people that day. Not trying to be a buzzkill or stand in the way of love but be careful not to delude yourself into thinking that the fantasy being offered is reality.

 

[PneumaVision]

Oh, don't worry about buzzkill, PunkInDrublic! You know, the responses are all over the map from finger-wagging over my unchivalrous posting of an allegedly sincere love letter, to essentially equating said love letter with those Uganda Oil Ministry scams. So, whatever it is, it ain't getting it done for me, and though it may bankrupt Romania, I'm moving on, taking only a handful of Skype contacts from a few who insisted.

Back to finding ladies in central Virginia who will put on lab coats, purple Nitrile gloves, and eye protection... or something.

Sincere thanks to everyone who pitched in with advice.

 

[JerryBoBerry]

I'm a divorced 64 year old retired university employee...

...but I am very skeptical of this love-at-first-sight and "I feel like I've known you for a hundred years" from a good-looking woman 25 years younger.

...So... am I being skeptical where I should be accepting?

Just my opinion here.

Fucking run, don't walk, from this room. You are being set up to drain you dry. You're old enough to have common sense. In all your life, the number of times you have found a 25 year younger hot woman, who is from another part of the world, immediately fall in love with you over the internet has not changed since you met her. That number remains at zero i'm betting.

ps: you are not alone in this circumstance.

 

[PneumaVision]

Jerry, Yeah, I got that part...and my ex already drained that well dry. My total expenditure in this whole Lisa thing was $75, and maybe another $75 on other people since June 16. I guess the letter about how the late dictator of Nigeria, General Sanni Abacha, has died and now his widow wants your help in getting his $80 million out of the country is not 100% on the level either, huh?

 

[TacoBelle]

Wow, you have answers ranging all over the place. And the sad truth is this: camgirls will almost always stick up for other camgirls. Now, don't get me wrong, this is a GREAT way for us to form long-lasting friendships, support another model's "image," and help each other make more money (along with NUMEROUS other positives). The negatives being that sometimes you won't hear what you NEED to hear.

Anyone who is telling you that they love you within hours of meeting you online is either A) very, very dim-witted or B) a liar.

The only way to find out if she cares about you the way she says she does, is for you to stop tipping her. Continue to visit her room, but stop tipping. If she questions it or attempts to guilt you into tipping, you'll know that it was all a ploy.

Seems a bit cruel of you to post what she said.

I disagree with this sentiment. If she had posted anything personal about herself (name, phonenumber, etc), then it would be terrible. But he was merely giving us an example. We could speculate and give advice without knowing the full extent of it, or while assuming he was exaggerating, but that would be a waste of time. How often have we seen a new member start a thread asking for advice on every topic known to man, and we have to ask for some form of an example? He obviously respects her enough (regardless of whether she's scamming him) to not name names.

 

[PneumaVision]

Iris, thank you very much for that. By the way neither her screen name nor real name is "Lisa", nor is my real name "David", nor does she live in Romania. There was a 1962 film called David & Lisa, one of the stranger love stories you'll ever see.

There is sort of a happy ending to this story. Lisa anticipated that the MFC situation had become too ambiguous and stressful for me, and so we continue on via gmail. She has found Graham Greene's The End of the Affair in her language, which I wanted her to read, and sees so clearly how it mirrors our confused emotions.

And, the lady does write one heck of a love letter!

 

[Alexandra Cole]

Seems a bit cruel of you to post what she said.

I disagree with this sentiment. If she had posted anything personal about herself (name, phonenumber, etc), then it would be terrible.

Yes, that would have been worse. I think we just see it differently. To me, it's a pretty serious violation of trust. I'm also not sure what purpose it serves to post someone's uncomfortably intimate email unless it's to brag, ridicule, or punish. And sure - it could be fake. It could also be sincere. Maybe she deals with so many trolls that any sort of kindness makes her more emotional that she'd normally be. Maybe she speaks in hyperbole, or is just responding his style of writing. Or maybe she really likes him and moves much faster than the rest of us. To my mind, if there's even a trace of a chance that she's sincere, then it's cruel.

His words: "She has never once asked for anything" and "She is wonderfully wifey and caring" and "Part of this resolution was me feeling very happy with the Lisa thing."

For me, it has nothing to do with defending a camgirl. The cynical reflex, though, comes a little too easily sometimes, and if there's a chance of it, I tend to defend sincerity.

 

[Ambers Troll]

There is sort of a happy ending to this story. Lisa anticipated that the MFC situation had become too ambiguous and stressful for me, and so we continue on via gmail.

:naughty: Sorry to hear.

 

[NickT]

I can think of a situation where her feelings are real, but only in the reality she lives in. Let me explain...

Life for women in many Eastern European countries can be quite hard. They have few job options, they are often exploited by those around them, and they are often harassed, both emotionally and sexually. So when a person comes around, treats them respect, and gives them money, they may be extremely grateful. She may be feeling true emotional feelings towards you because of how you are helping her.

It would be like if you were homeless and starving and someone came to your aid. Likely, you would feel very strong, positive feelings for that person. You would say how they were wonderful and you might say you loved them. You would say those things because you were truly feeling them and not because you were trying to exploit the person.

So she may have true feelings for you, but they may because she sees you as a rescuer, and that is clouding her judgement in some sense. I would say to continue the relationship, but be considerate of this power dynamic. And, of course, be cautious of her trying to take advantage.

 

[PunkInDrublic]

To be fair to eastern euro models, they aren't the only ones that try these scams. American models also do it. Camming attracts a lot of lazy and just awful people. Don't let the Ambers or Jolenes or a shitload of other models here fool you into believing that all American camgirls are good people.

 

[JoleneBrody]

To be fair to eastern euro models, they aren't the only ones that try these scams. American models also do it. Camming attracts a lot of lazy and just awful people. Don't let the Ambers or Jolenes or a shitload of other models here fool you into believing that all American camgirls are good people.

*deletes love letter to Punk*

 

[PunkInDrublic]

Aww man, don't delete it! lol wasn't trying to put any models on the spot or be a suck up, you and Amber were just the first two I thought of when I thought of ethical models.

 

[JoleneBrody]

Aww man, don't delete it! lol wasn't trying to put any models on the spot or be a suck up, you and Amber were just the first two I thought of when I thought of ethical models.

All joking set aside, that totally made my day. XD

 

[JimsX]

Aww man, don't delete it! lol wasn't trying to put any models on the spot or be a suck up, you and Amber were just the first two I thought of when I thought of ethical models.

Best save ever. I tip my hat to you.

And you are right. I got scammed good by an American model. Woe.