Coming up on 50 years in a few days (JFK- gross pics inside)

[Poker_Babe]

 

[Just Me]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days

How can you believe it was a conspiracy and not name who you think conspired to assassinate the president?

This is where most of the JFK conspiracy theories fall down for me. They like to spew out coincidences or ask why such and such was not considered or point out strange or unusual things about a case then fail to come to a conclusion, other than it was a conspiracy.

One of the biggest reasons I think Lee Harvey Oswald was the lone assassin and not a patsy, is the Kennedy family. Do you really think that his brother who was the Attorney General of the United States and the President's closet political adviser would ignore his brothers assassination? What about Jackie? She ignored it as well? Or were they part of this "conspiracy"?

 

[Poker_Babe]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days

How can you believe it was a conspiracy and not name who you think conspired to assassinate the president?

This is where most of the JFK conspiracy theories fall down for me. They like to spew out coincidences or ask why such and such was not considered or point out strange or unusual things about a case then fail to come to a conclusion, other than it was a conspiracy.

One of the biggest reasons I think Lee Harvey Oswald was the lone assassin and not a patsy, is the Kennedy family. Do you really think that his brother who was the Attorney General of the United States and the President's closet political adviser would ignore his brothers assassination? What about Jackie? She ignored it as well? Or were they part of this "conspiracy"?

Well to put it in a nutshell, I guess elements within our "shadow" government would be the easiest way to answer that. I have put many many hours upon hours of study and research into the subject over the last 7 years and I'm still learning new stuff all the time. And my conclusion is that to pull off something like this, you would have to have help from the "inside". I believe the CIA had a hand in it, and E Howard Hunt even admitted to being involved.

So, now that I answered your question, would you care to answer mine from the video? What is your "smoking gun" about the case that brings you to your conclusion???

I've got many, but I'll start with the first one that came into my head just now...

The much larger exit wound is in the back of JFK's head. As a bullet exits, the head pushes out all the brain matter it collected along the way and the exit wound is much larger and far more explosive than the entrance.

WARNING GRAPHIC PHOTOS COMING UP...

Here's the doctors who were there that day describing the large wound...



Here's the picture from the coroner's report...



And finally, here's the morgue pictures of JFK showing a small entry wound in the front, and a larger exit wound in the back...

 

[Just Me]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days

What evidence is there of a "shadow" government? What evidence is there and why would the CIA have a hand in it? E Howard Hunt? A convicted felon?

The two sons alleged that their father cut the information from his memoirs to avoid possible perjury charges.[56] According to Hunt's widow and other children, the two sons took advantage of Hunt's loss of lucidity by coaching and exploiting him for financial gain.[56] The Los Angeles Times said they examined the materials offered by the sons to support the story and found them to be "inconclusive".[56] However, the sons do have audio tape of their father's confession, which has been widely circulated on the internet.

Why would there need to be any help from the "inside"? There is a lot of evidence that lone crazy people try to kill presidents. List of United States presidential assassination attempts and plots.

Here is my smoking gun. http://www.archives.gov/research/jfk/warren-commission-report/

The Warren Commission consisted of:

Supreme Court Chief Justice Earl Warren
Congressman and Minority leader Gerald Ford (R)
Senator Richard Russell Jr. (D)
Congressman and Majority leader Hale Boggs (D)
Senator John S. Cooper (R)
John McCoy, emeritus president of the World Bank
Allen Dulles, emeritus CIA Director

I have provided links to their respective wikipedia pages. Now tell me, which of those 7 men would overlook law, outrage and honor to cover up the murder of their President?

Thousands of pieces of evidence which included classified and private material. 500 plus witnesses were called. They looked at the testimony of thousands of others that was given to police and other investigators. The witness list went so far as a nearly anonymous man who rode the bus to Mexico City with Oswald in late 1963. A number of recreations, re-enactments and tests that, among other things, proved that Oswald was more than capable of hitting targets under the assassination conditions.

We don't need alternate theories. The Warren Commission report provided such a preponderance of evidence that Oswald would have been convicted beyond a reasonable doubt in any court.

 

[Sevrin]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days

Allen Dulles, emeritus CIA Director

I have provided links to their respective wikipedia pages. Now tell me, which of those 7 men would overlook law, outrage and honor to cover up the murder of their President?

That one. In a heartbeat.

 

[Poker_Babe]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days

Allen Dulles, emeritus CIA Director

I have provided links to their respective wikipedia pages. Now tell me, which of those 7 men would overlook law, outrage and honor to cover up the murder of their President?

That one. In a heartbeat.

Huh, you beat me to it.

 

[AmberCutie]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days (JFK- gross pics ins

Reminder - name topics appropriately if they have sensitive content in them.

"Coming up on 50 years in a few days" doesn't exactly scream "click this and you'll see gross images".

 

[Just Me]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days

Allen Dulles, emeritus CIA Director

I have provided links to their respective wikipedia pages. Now tell me, which of those 7 men would overlook law, outrage and honor to cover up the murder of their President?

That one. In a heartbeat.

Huh, you beat me to it.

Really? Since when is the head of the CIA some nefarious character? I suppose you are now going to claim he convinced the other 6 to go along with some type of cover-up? :roll:

 

[Poker_Babe]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days

Really? Since when is the head of the CIA some nefarious character? I suppose you are now going to claim he convinced the other 6 to go along with some type of cover-up? :roll:

Since when has the CIA not been a nefarious agency? They were behind the overthrow of (elected) Iranian Prime Minister Mohammad Mossadegh in 1953. They were busted with 5.5 tons of cocaine when their DC9 airliner crashed landed in Mexico.

Oh and I really don't think you needed to add the snooty eye rolling smiley. I mean come on, you're responding to this thread like I'm saying something truly offensive. You really think it would be that hard to find 6 people to go along with that kind of cover up? You don't think everyone has a price? Well sir, if that's really what you think, then you have waaaaay more faith in the goodness people than I do, I'll tell you that right now.

 

[yossarian]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days (JFK- gross pics ins

Honestly, my thinking has changed on this over the years. When the movie JFK came out I was all into Kennedy conspiracies, but as time went on and I got more and more information I've come to believe that Oswald was indeed the only shooter. Now, that doesn't mean there wasn't a conspiracy, but I don't think anyone was involved but Oswald and a handful of Dallas douchebags. I can buy that a lot easier than a vast conspiracy that nobody's ever cracked. I think the Warren Commission was bullshit, though--I do think they were looking for expediency, and they wanted to avoid a black eye for the Secret Service and the government in general (remember, this was pre-Watergate), so they probably ignored evidence that Ruby and others were involved. But do I think the CIA, Mafia, Castro, LBJ, and everyone else under the sun was involved? No. Not anymore. At some point you have to take a step back and look at what makes logical sense given the information you have. The information we had in 1963, or in 1979, or 1992 is different than what we have today, and what we have today points to a lone gunman who possibly plotted with a few of his shady friends to whack the president, in a time where the Secret Service was dumb enough to let the President ride through town in an open limo with open windows all over the place.

That's what I think, anyhow. Do I trust the CIA? Nope. Do I think they did this? No. Just because somebody's a bad guy doesn't mean he has a hand in every bad thing that happens. But it is the Warren Commission's fault that people don't believe the official story, because they did a half-assed job of investigating it.

 

[EdgarAllenWhoa]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days (JFK- gross pics ins

I just have a real problem with most conspiracy theories and the conspiracy people.
I think that the JFK thing was so terrible and it imprinted so heavily on that generation of people that they can't believe it just happened...a lot of shock and pain.
The rest of the things: the Towers getting blown up by Dick Cheney
The moon landing was faked...the earth is flat
The Masons are running it all...its the Illumanti...The knights Templar...all of that.

I think the big thing about is that it in some way it gives comfort...that there is something to rail against...like some big monster organization is marshalling forces against them or us.

When the truth...the fact of the matter....is far more sinister:


There are no great evil organizations...no one has you on their radar...there are no master plans...the world is rudderless

You come into the world screaming and you die in your own arms and after a few years...no...one...notices...


WELL there you go something to have with a sunny drink huh?
Good Times for all :character-hobbes:

 

[Poker_Babe]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days (JFK- gross pics ins

I think the big thing about is that it in some way it gives comfort...that there is something to rail against...like some big monster organization is marshalling forces against them or us.

I've heard this said a few different times, I'm sorry but I just don't understand how anyone could think that people would find "comfort" in the belief of a shadow government or powerful elite who runs the world and does evil things like murdering presidents, overthrowing elected governments, and mass killings. Isn't more logical to think that a belief in thinking that's all just crazy talk a lot more comforting? Just saying.

 

[yossarian]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days (JFK- gross pics ins

I think the big thing about is that it in some way it gives comfort...that there is something to rail against...like some big monster organization is marshalling forces against them or us.

I've heard this said a few different times, I'm sorry but I just don't understand how anyone could think that people would find "comfort" in the belief of a shadow government or powerful elite who runs the world and does evil things like murdering presidents, overthrowing elected governments, and mass killings. Isn't more logical to think that a belief in thinking that's all just crazy talk a lot more comforting? Just saying.

I think it's more along the lines of thinking about how scary and random it is to live in a world where the government can't protect us from people flying planes into buildings, or a crazy kid shooting up a school--where they can't even protect the president from one nut with a rifle. It implies chaos, whereas conspiracy theories require order, and order is more comforting than chaos.

If nothing else, it's the comfort that comes with having an explanation that demonstrates to you that the world is not a random and chaotic place that nobody can control.

 

[EdgarAllenWhoa]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days (JFK- gross pics ins

In regards to the JFK conspiracies the one thing that really "got my goat" is the theory that Lyndon Johnson was involved with death of JFK.
Some of the theory suggests he was in "cahoots" with whatever organizations they felt led to JFK's death.

I can pretty much denounce these theories about LBJ because they are just bullshit.
To know the truth, they should learn about the man.
LBJ may have been one of the greatest Senators that the US has ever had.
He fought tirelessly for education, led the charge on getting a man on the moon, was a con decorated war hero, fought for voter rights ,protection of seniors and having access to Medicare. LBJ's work on inner city poverty and education was some of the most revolutionary process's brought forward by any elected official.
The was during Vietnam and the disastrous "leading by polls" strategy, it pretty much finished him.
He refused to re-up for re-election and went retired back to his own home.
Then he went and ate, smoked, and probably drank himself to death.
He was dead after 4 years from retiring from politics.

Sorry for the rant
just saw someone on TV who clearly has no idea what they are talking about in regards to LBJ and how things work in the REAL world lol.

 

[yossarian]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days (JFK- gross pics ins

Not to beat a dead thread, but I just watched this movie called "Parkland" that was about the day JFK was assassinated and it was really good. I think Tom Hanks produced it. It deals with some of the less-talked-about stories: the hospital staff at Parkland, Abraham Zapruder, Oswald's brother, etc. The guy who played Oswald looked EXACTLY like him and it looks like Oswald's mother was was a certified lunatic.

 

[bodisha]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days (JFK- gross pics ins

I'm of the belief it was a conspiracy and Oswald was a patsy. Mostly because there are to many piece that simply don't make sense to conclusively add up to a single shooter or multiple shooters.

The magic bullet is possibly the most conclusive evidence of conspiracy. It had to pass through Kennedy’s neck and Connally’s chest and wrist and embedded itself in the Governor’s thigh. It traversed 15 layers of clothing, 7 layers of skin, approximately 15 inches of tissue, struck a necktie knot, removed 4 inches of rib, and shattered a radius bone.

When compared to the bullet that took Kennedy's head off, which shattered by simply going through two layers of thinner skull bone, the magic bullet copper jacket was completely intact and the bullet's nose appeared normal. The magic bullet simply does not make sense to me.

Also, the FBI had arranged for the magic bullet and the various fragments found in the car and in Connally’s wounds to be examined using a method known as neutron activation analysis (NAA). NAA is a very accurate, non-destructive method of determining the relative concentrations of trace elements in a sample of matter. The data from the tests performed for the FBI were inconclusive as to the origins of the fragments

In 1978 the House Select Committee on Assassinations asked physicist Vincent P. Guinn to review the NAA data and conduct new tests. Guinn did so and presented his results and analysis to the Committee. Guinn stated that initially he agreed with the earlier conclusion. However, after examining the old and new NAA data further, he concluded that all the fragments probably came from two bullets, one of which was the magic bullet.

The rest of what doesn't make sense to me is if Oswald was a lone gunman, he went to some length to hide his purchase of the rifle. Yet they found fingerprints on the gun. While I don't think anyone would ever accuse Oswald of being a criminal mastermind... Not considering fingerprints on the gun that was just used to shoot the President, and left behind at the scene of the crime, makes Oswald the single dumbest criminal on the face of the planet.

While gun shot residue tests are inconclusive, the Dallas police did test him for it. His hands tested positive, but not his cheek. One would have expected his cheek to have tested positive if he had shot the rifle.

Then there is the fact a fair percentage of people present said a gun shot came from the grassy knoll. While that area has proven to be very echo-ee... I tend to believe peoples gut feeling when they are there. Also, Connally’s himself died saying he didn't believe the single bullet theory.

Then there was the question of Oswald's location, and state of mind shortly after the assassination. About ninety seconds after the shooting, in the second-floor lunchroom, Oswald encountered police officer Marrion Baker accompanied by Oswald's supervisor Roy Truly. Baker let Oswald pass after Truly identified him as an employee. According to Officer Baker, Oswald did not appear to be nervous or out of breath. Truly said that Oswald appeared "startled" when Baker aimed his gun at him. A clerical supervisor at the Depository, Mrs. Robert Reid returned to her office within two minutes of the assassination. She said that she saw Oswald who "was very calm" on the second floor with a Coke in his hands. His story about being in the lunchroom eating at the time of the assassination was, in part, confirmed by Junior Jarman and Harold Norman when they told the committee they had passed through it as Oswald said. Added up, this is not what I perceive as the demeanor of some lone loser who just shot & killed the most powerful man on Earth.

Then there were Oswald's fringe connections to the US Government via David Ferrie, Guy Banister, and Clay Shaw. In 1979, Richard Helms, former director of the CIA, testified under oath that Clay Shaw had been a part-time contact of the Domestic Contact Service of the CIA. Oswald wasn't just some wacko without contacts to the Intelligence community.

Added up, everything equates to a lot of very suspicious circumstances. Personally, I feel a rouge element in the CIA orchestrated the assassination. Specifically I believe David Phiilps was the individual responsible for having Kennedy shot. The remaining classified documents of the Warren commision are due to be released in 2017. Perhaps they will have the missing keys to who did or didn't shoot Kennedy.

 

[Red7227]

Re: Coming up on 50 years in a few days (JFK- gross pics ins

Well 3 old codgers I know all managed to duplicate the shots on a range last weekend after a discussion of the practicalities of making the shots. There are at least 3 separate ways of explaining the damage caused by the headshot which does not require a second shooter or anything exotic in the way of bullets. Either the bullets were commercial soft points which were undersize for the rifling and so both turned sideways and fragmented, it was a surplus bullet with a filed tip which was unstable in the air and did the same thing, or it was a fragmenting bullet of a type manufactured by the Italians - which looks like a ball round bit is full of shot and has 4 slits in the jacket - which occasionally turn up in surplus ammunition.

There is no requirement for more than one shooter with a carcano to make the shots and do the damage JFK suffered. The point should also be made that if he was being backed by some shadowy organisation, he should have been able to afford more than $13 for a rifle. $89 would have got him a surplus scoped garand from the same store on the same day, a rifle he had used in the army and was familiar with.