Yet another Chaturbate (ban) rant :/

[Rivaille]

Unlike some of the complaints, my account was not banned due to age verification issue. In my case, however, the ban feels to me like it was Chaturbate showing their absolute authority over their performer which leaves me quite dumbfounded.

Anyways, I started broadcasting earlier this year, although I have been verified since forever. Even though my fan base isn't as significant in number (2,000 followers), but it is a profound fan base nonetheless! I only cam for fun, therefor I never set up any payment arrangement nor have I ever cashed out my earnings. You will see how this is related to my case later.

Earlier this month (or perhaps last month) I received a site warning notifying me not to, and I quote, "direct users to pay in other forms of payment". It threw me off a little, as I have never forced anyone to TIP (you can check with my viewers) let alone asking them to pay me in other form of payment (I suppose they meant "other than chaturbate tokens"). I figured some troll or a jelly wacko must have reported me, hence I responded to the warning saying that I acknowledged the warning but I have never done anything close to what I was accused of, and that I would never do anything like that.

Second warning came a few days later. This time it warned me in regards to attaching PayPal and GoFundMe links on my profile. Ooops my bad! I heeded the warning and took an action accordingly. No more PayPal link. However, I explained in my message that I would be keeping the GoFundMe link as it was an alternative link to my Amazon wishlist (I've had a wish list set up specifically for a new desktop). My wishlist is on Amazon.de and some people have had a hard time trying to get giftcards off the website, thus I thought GoFundMe should do the job, besides I have seen numerous models having crowdfunding links on their profiles. I quoted some articles from Chaturbate ToS to back my argument.

Just a few days ago, the third warning came in (on top of the warning, Chaturbate also deleted my HTML bio), saying and I quote, "this is not up for discussion. Only Amazon link is acceptable." and that my account would be terminated if I failed to comply. This time I wasn't bothered to write a long message, so I kept it short and sweet, "FINE ". I put my bio back up, and made sure I got rid off the GoFundMe link. Everything should be in order--or so I thought.

Last night I was about to go on cam, when I found out that my account was banned along with a standard explanation "We have reason to believe that you may have violated our terms of service." I emailed "support" (CC to Shirley), and received an automated response to which I replied:

(in summary) "I believe the ban was a mistake --I have been always compliant and removed the said link immediately in accordance to the warnings. --thus I fail to see any reason for the ban. Therefor, I respectfully ask for my account to be reinstated. Plus I have (a significant sum) tokens on my account which I have no access to at the moment."

To my surprise, they replied "Dear rivaille, We can no longer further assist you. Thank you, Support".

ARE YOU KIDDING ME? First they came at me with a baseless accusation, they then shot down my argument with "this is not up for discussion" line, they proceeded to banning me with no explanation, and now they leave me hanging without granting me access to my own tokens?

Opening a new account isn't an option as I worked hard to grow my fan base. So here I am pleading, begging, imploring for JUSTICE!

ps. I contacted Shirley (@punker barbie) by posting on her profile, heard nothing back yet.

 

[Rivaille]

I must add that the third and final warning came with a deadline. The warning gave me until the next morning to fix my bio, however I removed the GoFundMe link the second I received the warning.

I always try to refrain from sounding too accusatory, or using inappropriate language (e.g. calling people names), as I believe a little respect and kindness go a long way.
But man, this thing has me on the edge of losing my cool....

 

[curacing]

Wow!!
They must be by law obligated to refund you your earning minus their cut?

 

[ramblin]

I'm actually pretty impressed with Chaturbate's communication in this case. I admit they've earned pretty low standards, but it sounds like they let you know what you needed to do differently, and they put up with you initially refusing to comply by keeping your GoFundMe link up. In the end they even suggested that you could keep a wishlist up as your only form of payment, since you don't accept or cash out tips, meaning that they'd be providing you a camming platform with no earnings to them at all.

Of course following up with the usual ban and ignore and refuse to discuss after you complied just sounds like old Chaturbate "support" that we're all too familiar with.

 

[justjoinedtopost]

"FINE "

whoops

 

[JerryBoBerry]

ARE YOU KIDDING ME? First they came at me with a baseless accusation, they then shot down my argument with "this is not up for discussion" line, they proceeded to banning me with no explanation, and now they leave me hanging without granting me access to my own tokens?

You may be out of luck.

https://chaturbate.com/terms/

 

[Rivaille]

I'm actually pretty impressed with Chaturbate's communication in this case. I admit they've earned pretty low standards, but it sounds like they let you know what you needed to do differently, and they put up with you initially refusing to comply by keeping your GoFundMe link up. In the end they even suggested that you could keep a wishlist up as your only form of payment, since you don't accept or cash out tips, meaning that they'd be providing you a camming platform with no earnings to them at all.

Actually these aren't quite accurate. First, they didn't let me keep the GoFunfMe link up, the third warning came in shortly after the second one, and they told me that "only amazon link is acceptable", meaning that I was requested to get rid of the GoFundMe link.

Second, Chaturbate still earned their share regardless. My viewers bought tokens from Chaturbate, and spent them on me. By not cashing up, I left my share of the earnings on my account, which turned out to be a big mistake. Chaturbate still makes money whether or not their models cash out those tokens.

You may be out of luck.

https://chaturbate.com/terms/

View attachment 70552

Even if the tokens are (hypothetically) worth over $1,000?
What kind of business practice is that?

 

[Serenity_Tam]

It wasn't a baseless ban reading your account of things. You had several warnings to not accept outside payment. Like. It seems pretty clear to me, didn't follow rules so got a ban. Sites dontbeven have to give you warnings when you get banned, you should just know the rules of your contract and follow them.

You kept trying to explain their rules to them and get out of following them. It honestly seems like a more reasonable ban than others.

You cam for fun and never even bothered to set up payment options. There are people who are actually banned with little reason who rely on camming for their livelihood. Stop whining and set your hobby up somewhere else if you're so concerned, there are other options. -.-

 

[Rivaille]

Yes I did receive several warnings, which I never failed to comply. I took every action based on the actual instructions that came with those warnings. I did what they wanted me to do.
What could I have done differently?

How did I KEEP explaining their rules to them? I brought up a discussion ONCE, following the second warning, to clarify the guideline (for myself, not for them), as sometimes the lines are pretty blurred with this sort of thing, don't you agree?

Have you ever thought, that maybe I haven't set up payment options for personal reasons? Like for example, I just moved to this country and I haven't quite figured things out just yet. Or that I just started camming a few months ago, and that I don't cam that often (twice/three times a month)? But whatever reason one might have to cam, Chaturbate should treat all their performers equally

EDIT: Also let's not forget, the last warning came with a deadline, I fixed my bio as soon as I saw the warning. And yet my account still got banned :/

 

[justjoinedtopost]

Did you really send CB a "" ? Or is that just your way of telling the story now after the fact?

 

[Rivaille]

Did you really send CB a "" ? Or is that just your way of telling the story now after the fact?

I said "fine " because I just didn't wanna prolong the issue. I made sure my profile was fixed and in order after sending my message.

 

[Rivaille]

Dear Shirley (@punker barbie), I sincerely hope you find it in your heart to give me a second chance. If my action was deemed so out of line, please give me a chance to write my wrong, it was an honest mistake and I regret it. I learned my lesson and I hope you can forgive me. I'm just a small time webcam performer trying to make it in this industry through an honest work. In no particular way did I try to undermine or challenge your decision, I simply request for your leniency, and for my Chaturbate account to be reinstated. Thank you.

 

[AnonyMouse]

Why not create a new account ? Innocentdoll was banned for whatever reasons and re-appeared a few days later on her current account. I think CB will pay you out on what you earned.

 

[JerryBoBerry]

Even if the tokens are (hypothetically) worth over $1,000?
What kind of business practice is that?

I believe the first highlighted word in the Terms I posted, "ALL" would cover it even if the tokens were worth over $10 million berjillion.

 

[Rivaille]

lmfao yeah you right , I'm just hoping they'd be kind enough to let me have my tokens back.

 

[Esther_Fae]

lmfao yeah you right , I'm just hoping they'd be kind enough to let me have my tokens back.

If you never cashed out the tokens then they are concidered virtual currency with no actual cash value. Or at least that's what chaturbate says. They specifically say they will not grant you the tokens from your account if you never bothered to cash them out.

 

[AudriTwo]

Yes I did receive several warnings, which I never failed to comply.

You refused to remove your MGF link when they asked...

Lol. This ban was totally reasonable. They just weren't putting up with your bullshit anymore it seems like.

 

[Rivaille]

You refused to remove your MGF link when they asked...

Lol. This ban was totally reasonable. They just weren't putting up with your bullshit anymore it seems like.

Yeah, right, my bullshit :'(
I didn't refuse to remove my GoFundMe link, I removed it after the warning. How is that not clear to you?

I admit I made a mistake by not setting up a payment option, and not understanding every line of Chaturbate ToS (I attached PP and GFM links on my profile, I shouldn't have done it, and got rid off the links right away after the warnings), I expressed my apology via the messages I sent, but these were all honest mistakes, which I rectified the second they were brought up to me.

Anyways, what's with all the hostility? Have I written something offensive (if so please let me know and I apologize)? I understand you need a thick skin to make it in this industry, and I will not play the victim (and hate those who do), but it seems like some of you think I am a self entitled, despicable, evil crybaby, who seeks to bring Chaturbate down. I can promise you, I am not that kind of person. I love Chaturbate community and I don't want to quit camming.
If you think the ban was justified, then just say so without having to belittle me, you know this is a rant post (duh), and calling me out for "whining" is rather oblivious.

I'm only a noob in webcam industry, but I have had my share of living in the real world, I worked very hard to get to where I am today as a person. I am no saint, but I know what's right or wrong, and what's JUST or not, and I feel like I have been treated unjustly. Do not try and compare my situation to other sob stories, because they're simply different, and this thread was made for a different reason, otherwise I would have just posted a comment on one of those threads.

The more I think about it, I feel like this whole thing was a misunderstanding. The person who sent out the final warning, and gave me a deadline until the next morning, didn't leave a memo to whoever decided to ban me, because my profile was already in a good standing when my account got banned. Mistakes are made from both ends, mine and theirs.

ps. I do love to write long posts, and bring up discussions, and more often than not I will stick to my gun and stand my ground. If you think my arguments are bullshit, that's completely fair and that's your prerogative, but I too have a voice and have the right to be heard Now, If you're here thinking of dissing me, and say that the ban was fair because I violated their ToS, or that they're tired of my bullshit (let me let you in on a secret, it's their job to hear people's bullshit as "support"), don't even bother.

I am fully aware of my actions during the course of this entire clusterfuck, I did to the best of my ability to revise my mistakes (by removing links etc.) as soon as humanly possible within the given period of time. If that wasn't enough, then I don't know what would have been.

Lots of love,

Levi

 

[uncoveredmanhole]

Opening a new account isn't an option as I worked hard to grow my fan base.

this is one reason it's a good idea to use kik/snap/twitter/instragram/etc.

but you could always open a new account with a similar username and use all the same tags you always did use in hopes of the fanbase finding you again when searching for models like you. (I am not giving this as advice. I don't know if it's against the ToS of CB, I'm just saying you literally can, because I have seen it done twice in the past month by the same model (bars377 - room gets banned, and a variation of her name with underscores pops up. it gets banned, another one pops up. She's online right now, but I'm sure if "_bars_377" gets banned she'll do what "bars_377" and "bars377" did, and that is be proactive and just submit a new username and verification, not waste time hoping for some kind of redemption.

 

[AudriTwo]

Because we don't sympathize with people who break rules... You are bending the rules so it benefits you. The site gave you a time frame, and decided they didn't want you on it. It's their decision to allow you back or not. Quite frankly, I don't blame them if they don't. They asked you to remove your GFM and PP, and you refused to remove your GFM. I'm going off of your account.

Second warning came a few days later. This time it warned me in regards to attaching PayPal and GoFundMe links on my profile. Ooops my bad! I heeded the warning and took an action accordingly. No more PayPal link. However, I explained in my message that I would be keeping the GoFundMe link as it was an alternative link to my Amazon wishlist (I've had a wish list set up specifically for a new desktop). My wishlist is on Amazon.de and some people have had a hard time trying to get giftcards off the website, thus I thought GoFundMe should do the job, besides I have seen numerous models having crowdfunding links on their profiles. I quoted some articles from Chaturbate ToS to back my argument.

You broke the rules, you are experiencing the consequences. Not sorry about it.
5q in the ToS clearly states: https://chaturbate.com/terms/#code_of_conduct

q: Contributors may exchange information with users of the Site, including contact information, but Contributors MAY NOT use users' information to provide webcam shows or receive payments outside of the Site. If a Contributor sells something to a user (such as the Contributor's underwear) or enters into any other transaction with a user of the Site, the sale must be completed in exchange for Virtual Money (defined below.)

You should of used those tokens... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Rivaille]

Because we don't sympathize with people who break rules... You are bending the rules so it benefits you. The site gave you a time frame, and decided they didn't want you on it. It's their decision to allow you back or not. Quite frankly, I don't blame them if they don't. They asked you to remove your GFM and PP, and you refused to remove your GFM. I'm going off of your account.

HAH funny you mentioned that. I didn't even make a penny out of my GFM/PP links.
But anyway that's not my point, I broke the rules (which I deeply regret and rectified right there and then), and all the sudden I became public enemy number one? What the hell is wrong with you? Hahah
I showed remorse and tried to redeem myself, and yet Chaturbate did not account any of that.

I can see where you're coming from, I really do, but it is difficult to explain to someone who turns a blind eye.
Okay bear with me, I'm going to try this again,

For the sake of the argument, let's just forget the first warning ever happened. It notified me not to "direct users to other forms of payment", but it didn't mention anything about any links.
Call me dumb, but I wasn't aware of what they were implying. Hence, no action was taken. Maybe I'm just stupid and don't understand subtexts, but if being stupid was a crime, more than half of the world's population would in prison.

Second warning. Now they told me to get rid off any links to outside payments. If memory serves me, the messaged mentioned PayPal and GoFundMe links.
I was like, AHA! I got it now! Putting those links on your profile translates to "directing users to other forms of payment", and I kind of agreed, so I got rid of the PP link.
However from my limited understanding of this line (5r):

Contributors are not allowed to advertise commercial websites that offer live webcam streams, under any circumstances; but they are allowed to mention their own personal profiles, homepages and wish lists.

Performers are allowed to put their wish lists on their profile. So I kept my Amazon and GFM links, and explained to them what they were (my wish list) via a message.
Notice how the article does not specify which websites/links are/aren't acceptable. So stupid me thought it was okay to keep both Amazon and GFM links as they were categorized as wish list.

Third warning came in very, very shortly after the second one. It stated, "this is not up for discussion, only Amazon links are acceptable. You have until morning to fix your profile". This might not be verbatim, but that's pretty much the content of the warning.
I was like, oh shit, oh shit, better fix my profile ASAP. Only to find out that my custom HTML bio was already removed from my profile by Chaturbate. So with my limited HTML skills, I removed the GFM link from my bio using notepad, and put the bio back up onto my Chaturbate profile. All seemed to be in order, no mention of both PP/GFM. All of this was done within 2 mins after I received the warning.
It was sometime in the PM here in Amsterdam, so it must have been afternoon in the states, and they gave me a time frame until the next morning.

I don't know when exactly my account got banned, but I tried to log in the other night and discovered the ban notification.

That's pretty much it really. Yes I violated the ToS. Was it intentional? Absolutely NOT! Did I regret it? FUCK YES!
Does that make me a villain? You decide

Let me know if there's anything unclear about my statement

 

[CharlotteLace]

Regardless of who's right or wrong here, there's not anything any of us can do on the forum, and it's clear that despite the public opinion of their banning practices, they'll continue on however they chose. So, was this just a vent thread? Because that's pretty much all it can potentially be. It's sucky this happened to you, and to other people who get banned, but you're pretty much just telling employees at Google how unfairly Apple treated you.

You have my sympathy though. Regardless of your mistakes, it sucks. Move on and try other sites.

 

[Rivaille]

Regardless of who's right or wrong here, there's not anything any of us can do on the forum, and it's clear that despite the public opinion of their banning practices, they'll continue on however they chose. So, was this just a vent thread? Because that's pretty much all it can potentially be. It's sucky this happened to you, and to other people who get banned, but you're pretty much just telling employees at Google how unfairly Apple treated you.

You have my sympathy though. Regardless of your mistakes, it sucks. Move on and try other sites.

That's exactly what this thread is about. I've contacted Shirley, and hope we could come up with some understanding.
I just don't understand people bashing me for ranting on a thread clearly titled RANT!

 

[AudriTwo]

You know it's cute. When someone disagrees on the discussion, it's obviously bashing.

If you didn't want people to oppose your rant, don't post it on a public forum?

 

[Zana]

There's a difference between a justified rant and an unjustified rant.

 

[AmberCutie]

This time it warned me in regards to attaching PayPal and GoFundMe links on my profile. Ooops my bad! I heeded the warning and took an action accordingly. No more PayPal link. However, I explained in my message that I would be keeping the GoFundMe link as it was an alternative link to my Amazon wishlist

I imagine this is the point they decided they'd rather ban you, since you decided to try to make your own rules/reasoning for why you'd go against their terms.

CB: Please remove PP and GFM links.
Riv: I'll only remove PP.
CB: /ban
Riv: But whyyyy?? I complied!

Everyone else: #smh

 

[Rivaille]

You know it's cute. When someone disagrees on the discussion, it's obviously bashing.

If you didn't want people to oppose your rant, don't post it on a public forum?

Okay, I'm sorry, "bashing" is perhaps too strong of a word, but you understand what I mean.
Or shall I say "labeling me as the bad guy"?

I imagine this is the point they decided they'd rather ban you, since you decided to try to make your own rules/reasoning for why you'd go against their terms.

I didn't though, I really did not mean play by my own rules. Here I reiterate my statement and the logic behind my action:
https://www.ambercutie.com/forums/threads/yet-another-chaturbate-ban-rant.28054/#post-847536

And why do you guys keep forgetting the third warning where they gave me a time frame?
You don't throw someone a lifeline and just yank it when they're trying to reach it. Why gave a false hope?

 

[Zana]

If memory serves me, the messaged mentioned PayPal and GoFundMe links.

... and I kind of agreed, so I got rid of the PP link.

That's pretty much it really. Yes I violated the ToS. Was it intentional? Absolutely NOT

How didn't you make your own rules? How, after the first and second warning, was it not intentional?

 

[Rivaille]

How didn't you make your own rules? How, after the first and second warning, was it not intentional?

Oh now you're just being cheeky by taking my words out of the context Let's read it one more time, shall we?

Second warning. Now they told me to get rid off any links to outside payments. If memory serves me, the messaged mentioned PayPal and GoFundMe links.
I was like, AHA! I got it now! Putting those links on your profile translates to "directing users to other forms of payment", and I kind of agreed, so I got rid of the PP link.
However from my limited understanding of this line (5r):

Contributors are not allowed to advertise commercial websites that offer live webcam streams, under any circumstances; but they are allowed to mention their own personal profiles, homepages and wish lists.

Performers are allowed to put their wish lists on their profile. So I kept my Amazon and GFM links, and explained to them what they were (my wish list) via a message.
Notice how the article does not specify which websites/links are/aren't acceptable. So stupid me thought it was okay to keep both Amazon and GFM links as they were categorized as wish list.

I intentionally kept GFM link based on that line in their ToS. But clearly my interpretation was incorrect, and I wasn't aware of it. So, was the mistake intentionally made? I don't believe so.

 

[THE MOLLIE MARIE]

In your OP, you say you have seen the other chaturbate threads here on the forum. I don't know why you seem so surprised by the responses on your own...